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Ryanair to pay €10 million in French labour law case

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Ryanair to pay €10 million in French labour law case

Old 9th Oct 2013, 21:28
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CelticRambler: give Air France/CityJet a gentle slap on the wrist for the same offence
Not at all CR, Air France got a fine only because they subcontracted Cityjet. The Air France CEO was personally convicted and Cityjet will have to backpay social security for all involved. Per pilot and per year Cityjet will pay the same amount as FR.
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Old 9th Oct 2013, 23:49
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Originally Posted by Bidule
For sure, it is obsolete to try to keep working and living conditions which seem to be (a bit) civilised. That's true that the "0 hours" contracts are the future of the human beings!
Who mentioned zero-hour contracts? It would be nice to be able to offer 40-hour contracts, but of course that's illegal in France. And from a practical point of view, it's impossible to offer 10-hour contracts too. I know dozens of local (French) businesses that would dearly love to employ one, two or three extra people so that they could keep trading through lunchtime or until 8 or 9pm, but they can't take the risk of being saddled with an unsackable worker. Then there's the risk of going over the magic 50 employee barrier and suddenly you, as the employer, have to house and fund a "comité d'entreprise" even though your entreprise is already bound by a raft of "conventions" drawn up by the union élite. Then there are the limits on opening times - now, thankfully being overtly challenged by a few heavyweight companies, but there's a long way to go.

The defenders of the traditional French way of life seem to forget that the vast majority of people calling for change are French people born and reared in that tradition, but who want the Liberté, Egalité, Fraternité promised to them by the French state. The internet and the free movement of goods and people in the EU offers that, but the current administration carries on the work of the previous in doing everything possible to deny ordinary French citizens access to those values.

Later today (10th October) the Union des Français de l'Etranger hosts an event in Paris specifically encouraging their fellow citizens to leave France and set up business in the UK. What does that say about the level of national pride in the country today?

Last edited by CelticRambler; 9th Oct 2013 at 23:53.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 13:45
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You are just justifyingwhat can't be!
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 16:57
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What can't be what? The industry that employs the professionals on this forum has made it very simple for un pur-sang Français to outsource himself and his business to a friendly neighbouring country. In fact, the two go together - the more reliable the route (so not LoCo, obviously) the easier it is for French entrepreneurs to opt out of their obligations to Marianne.

If you think that's not already happening, accelerating year-on-year, I'll happily point you towards several companies within my area (not adequately served by the aviation industry) who are pressing ahead with these kind of plans in anticipation of a service that meets their needs.

National economic policy in France has been decided for years by the cosy élite of the left-right énarques and the union leaders. This action against FR is more than a simple industrial dispute. Look where it's happening: not in Paris like the easyJet/CityJet affair, but Marseille. Front National heartland. Who's heading the polls in France at the moment? Le Front National. Marine Le Pen is on the campagne trail for 2017 already, while the UMP can't even elect a leader and the PS is fighting Leroy Merlin, Castorama and other overcreating jobs because they're at the wrong time of day, or the wrong day altogether.

What you have in Marseille is a very powerful coincidence of interests between the private sector and a strong political force. There's a lot more at stake here than whether or not Rsi gets its money.

Last edited by CelticRambler; 13th Oct 2013 at 17:17.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 17:40
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Judging by your knowledge of france and french politics, you are either:

-a political and economical expert

OR

- An Irish/UK national living in France. Like thousands of your compatriots who live together in remote villages in the South-West / South-East of France.

Now although I welcome everyone in my home country, judging by the level of your bitterness, it might be time to take a break.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 18:33
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regardless of your personal opinions of France, the UK, the job market, various labor laws etc. this was a legal verdict that we have to accept as a fact unless you have your own personal opinion about democracy as well.....

I welcome the verdict as one of the first steps in the right direction when it comes to a civilized work environment which should be a legal one in the first place.
the discussion about a more liberal or socialist model could go on forever and it's up to the voters of each country to decide, the only thing which people shouldn't be free to decide is to illegally exploit the freedom given to you by the EU to do business in a neighboring country without respecting their laws.
Want to base aircraft and crews in France?No problem but you should do it according to French law, as simple as that.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 18:43
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regardless of your personal opinions of France, the UK, the job market, various labor laws etc. this was a legal verdict that we have to accept as a fact unless you have your own personal opinion about democracy as well.....
Really so when has the right of appeal been smashed in France ?

Given EU law is primary then that will be where the ultimate decision is made NOT in a French courtroom.

I welcome the verdict as one of the first steps in the right direction when it comes to a civilized work environment which should be a legal one in the first place.
the discussion about a more liberal or socialist model could go on forever and it's up to the voters of each country to decide, the only thing which people shouldn't be free to decide is to illegally exploit the freedom given to you by the EU to do business in a neighboring country without respecting their laws.
Want to base aircraft and crews in France?No problem but you should do it according to French law, as simple as that.
Good so you wish French companies and Govt to adhere to the legal position in respecting National Sovreignty of Governments................perhaps you should address that close to home before setting off on the lecture tour.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 21:15
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The right to appeal is there and I will be the first one to accept its outcome and Ryanair fans should do the same.

I'm not lecturing nobody, just had a read at the convention of Rome and understood the basis on which Ryanair are loosing in courtrooms across Europe.
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Old 13th Oct 2013, 22:17
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I'm not lecturing nobody, just had a read at the convention of Rome and understood the basis on which Ryanair are loosing in courtrooms across Europe.
Which courtrooms ?
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Old 14th Oct 2013, 05:11
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Marseille and Oslo, with more to come.
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Old 14th Oct 2013, 11:12
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Also the case in Milan there about Bergamo...
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Old 14th Oct 2013, 17:54
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Marseille and Oslo, with more to come.
So aside from suggesting that a court judgement should be accepted as FACT before being reminded of right of appeal, now you are suggesting the verdicts before a court has even sat.

Interesting.
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Old 14th Oct 2013, 22:27
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I am not suggesting anything racedo, I am merely telling the story of two verdicts which saw Ryanair as the loosing party.
Both of them have been appealed and we can just wait for either their confirmation (very likely) or their reversal (extremely unlikely).
You might find reading the Rome Convention as eye opening in this respect and also understand the reasons behind these verdicts.

But again should Ryanair win their appeal then I will welcome any airline setting up their HQ in Dublin and then continue producing revenue in other countries without employing anybody there nor participating in their social system.
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Old 21st Oct 2013, 19:18
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RYANAIR HONOURED BY CITY OF MARSEILLE FOR CONTRIBUTION TO TOURISM

Ryanair, Europe’s low fares airline, was today (18 Oct) recognised for its outstanding contribution to tourism in the Provence region, when its Deputy CEO and Chief Operating Officer, Michael Cawley, was presented with the Citizen Badge of Honour from the city of Marseille. This year, Ryanair will carry over 1.65m passengers to/from Marseille sustaining 1,650* “on-site” jobs at Marseille Airport, underlining Ryanair’s commitment to tourism in the Provence region.

Got to love the French. On one hand take FR to court on the other lets give them a prize.

Genius..........
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Old 27th Oct 2013, 18:51
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Marseille : la médaille offerte à Ryanair qui choque

Now the local Air France union reps are complaining that AF wasn't recognised in any way, shape or form despite contributing 500.000€ "in kind" to the Marseille City of Culture kitty - on condition that no other airline was allowed contribute. Old monopolistic habits die hard ...

Last edited by CelticRambler; 27th Oct 2013 at 18:52.
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Old 27th Oct 2013, 22:35
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Now the local Air France union reps are complaining that AF wasn't recognised in any way, shape or form despite contributing 500.000€ "in kind" to the Marseille City of Culture kitty - on condition that no other airline was allowed contribute.
That really is so funny................................they contribute and lock everybody out, everybody knows they contributed and still the good people decide another airline deserves the prize.

If ever there was a damming verdict this is it.
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Old 28th Oct 2013, 19:41
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The verdict is out there, I have a copy right here but it is in french.
But the best is still to come with the results of the appeal.

Also heard in the grapevine that more court cases are being prepared across the EU...can't wait!!
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