Passengers on jumbo terror flight to sue BA
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Passengers on jumbo terror flight to sue BA
Passengers on jumbo terror flight to sue BA
by Joanna Walters, transport editor
Sunday April 28, 2002
The Observer
A group of passengers is set to sue British Airways over their terrifying ordeal when a deranged man seized control of their flight to Nairobi and brought them within seconds of death.
The group of up to 70 Britons is furious that BA settled a multi-million-dollar law suit earlier this month with a dozen Americans who were on the flight on 29 December 2000 - while passengers from the UK have been offered only £2,000 and a free ticket each.
City headhunter and spokesman for the group Nick Reid, 48, who was aboard the jumbo and convinced he was going to die, accused BA of 'callous contempt and disregard' in the way it treated the passengers after they arrived in Kenya and in the 16 months since.
It has not been disclosed how much the 16 US passengers were offered by BA to call off their action for negligence and injury and they have all signed confidentiality agreements.
But it is believed to be substantially higher than the Britons were offered and could be as much as 50 times more each, as the maximum award for negligence in the US is $150,000 (£103,000).
Reid and his group accused BA of bias, covering up data and not doing enough to prevent the incident, claiming Kenyan Paul Mukonyi, had been behaving strangely both before boarding and during the flight.
Reid was among 398 passengers on the BA Flight 2069 which also carried pop singer Bryan Ferry, and Jemima Khan and her children.
While most of the passengers were asleep, Mukonyi, then 27, burst into the cockpit and grabbed the controls from the pilot. He forced the Boeing 747-400 into a series of lurches, which sent it diving at 2,000 feet per second. The plane came within four seconds of flipping over into an unrecoverable plunge.
Talking to The Observer, Reid shook as he recalled the terror on Flight 2069, with passengers screaming and shouting goodbyes to loved ones.
Mukonyi was eventually overpowered and the plane brought back under control after heroic feats of recovery-flying by the flight crew.
But while praising the crew, Reid is angry with the airline and claims it offered little assistance to the traumatised passengers when they arrived in Nairobi and has been grudging with information and comfort since.
The settlement with the US passengers is the last straw, he said. While many of the British passengers accepted BA's offer of £2,000, Reid said his group of 70 was seeking counsel in preparation for legal action for negligence.
A British Airways spokeswoman said the US settlement had been made for 'bodily injury' rather than the psychological trauma claimed by the Britons.
But Reid said only four of the US passengers had been taken to hospital with minor injuries and he had evidence that the problems for the others, like many of the British travellers, were related to post traumatic stress disorder.
by Joanna Walters, transport editor
Sunday April 28, 2002
The Observer
A group of passengers is set to sue British Airways over their terrifying ordeal when a deranged man seized control of their flight to Nairobi and brought them within seconds of death.
The group of up to 70 Britons is furious that BA settled a multi-million-dollar law suit earlier this month with a dozen Americans who were on the flight on 29 December 2000 - while passengers from the UK have been offered only £2,000 and a free ticket each.
City headhunter and spokesman for the group Nick Reid, 48, who was aboard the jumbo and convinced he was going to die, accused BA of 'callous contempt and disregard' in the way it treated the passengers after they arrived in Kenya and in the 16 months since.
It has not been disclosed how much the 16 US passengers were offered by BA to call off their action for negligence and injury and they have all signed confidentiality agreements.
But it is believed to be substantially higher than the Britons were offered and could be as much as 50 times more each, as the maximum award for negligence in the US is $150,000 (£103,000).
Reid and his group accused BA of bias, covering up data and not doing enough to prevent the incident, claiming Kenyan Paul Mukonyi, had been behaving strangely both before boarding and during the flight.
Reid was among 398 passengers on the BA Flight 2069 which also carried pop singer Bryan Ferry, and Jemima Khan and her children.
While most of the passengers were asleep, Mukonyi, then 27, burst into the cockpit and grabbed the controls from the pilot. He forced the Boeing 747-400 into a series of lurches, which sent it diving at 2,000 feet per second. The plane came within four seconds of flipping over into an unrecoverable plunge.
Talking to The Observer, Reid shook as he recalled the terror on Flight 2069, with passengers screaming and shouting goodbyes to loved ones.
Mukonyi was eventually overpowered and the plane brought back under control after heroic feats of recovery-flying by the flight crew.
But while praising the crew, Reid is angry with the airline and claims it offered little assistance to the traumatised passengers when they arrived in Nairobi and has been grudging with information and comfort since.
The settlement with the US passengers is the last straw, he said. While many of the British passengers accepted BA's offer of £2,000, Reid said his group of 70 was seeking counsel in preparation for legal action for negligence.
A British Airways spokeswoman said the US settlement had been made for 'bodily injury' rather than the psychological trauma claimed by the Britons.
But Reid said only four of the US passengers had been taken to hospital with minor injuries and he had evidence that the problems for the others, like many of the British travellers, were related to post traumatic stress disorder.
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120,000 feet a minute, some going, is that possible without the loss of the A/C?
What or who was the source of this amazing "fact"? Perhaps Mr Ferry saw the VSI from that vantage point!
Obviously a very slow news day today.
What or who was the source of this amazing "fact"? Perhaps Mr Ferry saw the VSI from that vantage point!
Obviously a very slow news day today.
Last edited by mikegreatrex; 28th Apr 2002 at 16:39.
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I hope they get nothing and are awarded costs against them. It is so pathetic. How will the provision of money from BA make them more whole or fulfilled or more able to deal with their 'suffering'? I wish I could drop my tea down my shirt and get thousands of pounds for it. It is a complete rip-off and a sad reminder of what our society is becoming. I just wish I was on the jury! No doubt they will win millions between them and be sorted for life. Now if you are a soldier in Northern Ireland and get your legs blown off - a different matter all together - 30 quid a week tops.
I am thinking of suing BA for the emotional damage I suffered watching the pax being interview on TV afterwards - I nearly had to drink 2 cups of coffee as a result of the experience. Surely that must be a worth a few thousand quid.
I am thinking of suing BA for the emotional damage I suffered watching the pax being interview on TV afterwards - I nearly had to drink 2 cups of coffee as a result of the experience. Surely that must be a worth a few thousand quid.
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With citizens of the world's most litigious nation aboard, it was only a matter of time before this matter arose. As mikegreatrex's calculation suggests, such a rate of descent would have resulted in a hole in the ground in under 20 seconds, from typical cruising alt.
Clearly Joanna Walters confused her notes and was referring to what the lawyers told her they intend to milk out of the incident in dollars per second - an easy mistake to make.
Clearly Joanna Walters confused her notes and was referring to what the lawyers told her they intend to milk out of the incident in dollars per second - an easy mistake to make.
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Some perspective...
Whilst I'm the first to deride off the wall reporting, and also an exponent of Lord Denning's view on life, which was (and I'm paraphrasing here, folks) 'life's a bitch, buy a helmet', let's not be too quick to deride these people from taking action.
Think about it; I seem to recall, on this very board, discussions being had about how this gentleman had managed to get on board the flight despite being identified as a risk by ground staff. It would seem to me, particularly as an SLF, that it's quite a legitimate question to ask why and how he managed to get on the flight regardless. Let's imagine for a moment that you're sat next to someone, at 35,000 ft, and he suddenly goes quite berserk, leaps into the flight deck and attempts to bring the a/c down. You get the scare of your life. You then discover that said gentleman was identified as a threat before the flight left the ground, but they still let him on. How do you feel?
Think about it; I seem to recall, on this very board, discussions being had about how this gentleman had managed to get on board the flight despite being identified as a risk by ground staff. It would seem to me, particularly as an SLF, that it's quite a legitimate question to ask why and how he managed to get on the flight regardless. Let's imagine for a moment that you're sat next to someone, at 35,000 ft, and he suddenly goes quite berserk, leaps into the flight deck and attempts to bring the a/c down. You get the scare of your life. You then discover that said gentleman was identified as a threat before the flight left the ground, but they still let him on. How do you feel?
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Well however they feel, they were perfectly happy BEFORE the Americans got their award. Perhaps they should really be sueing the American lot who are the ones that have actually made them feel worse, since they NOW feel unjustly treated but were happy to go along with the original award.
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Lawyerboy
How would I feel?
I'd feel relieved to be alive. I'd thank God that the First Officer on my flight had the skill to recover the aircraft from a seemingly impossible state despite a fight going on around him, and that the Captain had the skill to overpower the crazed intruder.
I'd be so pleased that I'd chosen to fly with BA, which is one of the airlines which spares no expense when it comes to training and retraining their pilots.
And I'd feel sadness (and some disdain) towards any of my fellow passenger who thought those strokes of good fortune weren't enough and wanted money as well.
BTW, having recently seen the computer reconstruction (from actual data) of the aircraft's attitudes during the emergency, I'm even more impressed by the F/O's achievement. Unbelievable!
Tudor Owen
How would I feel?
I'd feel relieved to be alive. I'd thank God that the First Officer on my flight had the skill to recover the aircraft from a seemingly impossible state despite a fight going on around him, and that the Captain had the skill to overpower the crazed intruder.
I'd be so pleased that I'd chosen to fly with BA, which is one of the airlines which spares no expense when it comes to training and retraining their pilots.
And I'd feel sadness (and some disdain) towards any of my fellow passenger who thought those strokes of good fortune weren't enough and wanted money as well.
BTW, having recently seen the computer reconstruction (from actual data) of the aircraft's attitudes during the emergency, I'm even more impressed by the F/O's achievement. Unbelievable!
Tudor Owen
Last edited by Flying Lawyer; 29th Apr 2002 at 13:40.
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I agree with flying lawyer.
If any (or all) of these passengers have a right to claim for "damage" so be it.
I am sure there must be some severe stress in anybody who has suffered such a harrowing experience ( crew and passengers). As regards the level of payout for such " damages" that is a matter for the plaintiffs, the insurers and the Courts.
If it really makes you feel better ( and it shouldn't) the level of awards in the UK Courts are truly derisory in comparison to those in the USA ( even for more most forms of bodily injury). Unless the claim is for potential loss of earnings it is probably not worth the effort in most cases.
I guess that is why the US cases have apparantly settled, the UK claimants are so annoyed and the insurers are not losing much sleep over the whole matter.
If any (or all) of these passengers have a right to claim for "damage" so be it.
I am sure there must be some severe stress in anybody who has suffered such a harrowing experience ( crew and passengers). As regards the level of payout for such " damages" that is a matter for the plaintiffs, the insurers and the Courts.
If it really makes you feel better ( and it shouldn't) the level of awards in the UK Courts are truly derisory in comparison to those in the USA ( even for more most forms of bodily injury). Unless the claim is for potential loss of earnings it is probably not worth the effort in most cases.
I guess that is why the US cases have apparantly settled, the UK claimants are so annoyed and the insurers are not losing much sleep over the whole matter.
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How about if it was a British aircraft over some African country how come the American pax settled under American laws and British pax under British laws. It should really be governed on the laws of the country the aircraft is registered.
If passengers are going to sue again anyway there doesn't seem much point in companies settling out of court in the first place.
How about if companies don't offer any compensation at all anymore and just sit back and wait for the knock on the door from the lawyers.
Has anyone ever sued a lawyer?
If the court finds that these people have got all they are entitled to can BA counter sue. If BA do can the people involved sue their lawyers for giving poor legal advice in the first place.
We all do our best but there can be no guarantees of living to an old age or getting there without a few scars.
If passengers are going to sue again anyway there doesn't seem much point in companies settling out of court in the first place.
How about if companies don't offer any compensation at all anymore and just sit back and wait for the knock on the door from the lawyers.
Has anyone ever sued a lawyer?
If the court finds that these people have got all they are entitled to can BA counter sue. If BA do can the people involved sue their lawyers for giving poor legal advice in the first place.
We all do our best but there can be no guarantees of living to an old age or getting there without a few scars.
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BA is not liable for psychiatric injury. That is why they paid out to those who had suffered bodily injury.
There is no reaslistic hope of a successful action - the purpose of the uproar and article is as a perfectly legitimate, if distasteful, attempt to make BA look bad in order to encourage some sort of settlement.
PTSD is probably the most abused psychiatric diagnosis in history but there probably were some genuine cases of it here, given the circumstances.
There is no reaslistic hope of a successful action - the purpose of the uproar and article is as a perfectly legitimate, if distasteful, attempt to make BA look bad in order to encourage some sort of settlement.
PTSD is probably the most abused psychiatric diagnosis in history but there probably were some genuine cases of it here, given the circumstances.
Just a numbered other
NSF
Beat me to it! Well said FL.
I think that anyone claiming to have been traumatised by life's knocks should be sat down in front of the opening sequences in 'Saving Private Ryan', and asked to reflect on their experience and put it in perspective.
Beat me to it! Well said FL.
I think that anyone claiming to have been traumatised by life's knocks should be sat down in front of the opening sequences in 'Saving Private Ryan', and asked to reflect on their experience and put it in perspective.
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I think in this day and age (including well before 9/11) leaving the cockpit door unlocked is clear negligence. That sort of thing usually involves a few dollars
Cheers
Wino
Cheers
Wino
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Flying Lawyer
Superb post, wonderfully expressed.
(Well worth reading if anyone missed it.)
Wino
So you think the BA crew were negligent.
Rubbish. I can't comment about the US or El Al, but it certainly would not be negligence in the UK.
You never miss a chance to knock the Brits do you.
Superb post, wonderfully expressed.
(Well worth reading if anyone missed it.)
Wino
So you think the BA crew were negligent.
Rubbish. I can't comment about the US or El Al, but it certainly would not be negligence in the UK.
You never miss a chance to knock the Brits do you.
Last edited by virgin; 29th Apr 2002 at 19:12.
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Americans will use any exuse to sue. I am reminded of a recent sting, where the DA deliberatley staged a bus crash, and then arrested people as they got on the crashed bus to claim wiplash 
Given the riduculous state of the american legal system, and the way it is abused, I understand the wanton need to guns.
Jon
Given the riduculous state of the american legal system, and the way it is abused, I understand the wanton need to guns.
Jon
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How many of us could say, hand on heart, that if the opportunity presented itself to sue a major corporation with a high probability of success, we would hew to our principles and decline to join an action on the grounds that we held the compensation culture in contempt and disdain?
Not me, baby. Class action shysters may email me here.
Not me, baby. Class action shysters may email me here.