FAA Grounds 787s
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Here today, elsewhere tomorrow
Posts: 90
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
All grounded?
All 787s may be grounded by end of day.
LOT, LAN, Air India either chose or were made to follow FAA lead.
No word from Ethiopian but other planes put in service today for scheduled 787s.
Qatar?
LOT, LAN, Air India either chose or were made to follow FAA lead.
No word from Ethiopian but other planes put in service today for scheduled 787s.
Qatar?
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Near sheep!
Posts: 915
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Dont go to hard on bubbers guys, he is one of those that devotes his life to everything Boeing, stars and stripes etc! A bit like all British who use 'us' and 'we' when talking about Man United......there aint much British about those either!
On a serious note i think the FAA had little option, fail to step in and a unit goes down over the pond......they would have had a lot of answering. I am quite interested that Boeing didnt step in first.
On a serious note i think the FAA had little option, fail to step in and a unit goes down over the pond......they would have had a lot of answering. I am quite interested that Boeing didnt step in first.
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Europe
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Well it seems it is a non-issue for Boeing because they took into account a possible battery fire and say the airplane can stay aloft with a full-blown battery fire. presumably for the full ETOPS time frame.
Somehow this does not give me a warm and cozy feeling. Have they really found the worst case fire scenario, including damage to other electrical systems, overload of the remaining system, spread etc.
Somehow this does not give me a warm and cozy feeling. Have they really found the worst case fire scenario, including damage to other electrical systems, overload of the remaining system, spread etc.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK, sometimes USA
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
presumably for the full ETOPS time frame
As a potential 787 passenger, I'd rather Boeing were confident that "the 787 won't develop a full-blown fire" rather than them say "the 787 can handle a full-blown fire and remain in the air". It's not good PR and won't help me sleep mid-atlantic on the red-eye. For Boeing the whole issue of teething troubles need really tight PR to maintain airline and passenger confidence.
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: UK
Age: 69
Posts: 292
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Whichever way I look at this, there is only one ray of sunshine - we haven't had a loss of life. Whether you're in the supply-side, a driver, a passenger or just another member of the human race who lives in the real world this is terrible news. Only Boeing and Airbus make aircraft like this. We need competition. Even the 'anti-Boeing pro Airbus' brigade should join in defending aviation per se because it is the credibility of aviation that is being harmed, not just Boeing. Any of these issues could just as easily have happened with Airbus.
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Scotland
Posts: 131
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Are you serious? You are comparing the 787 to the A380? Go to Airliners.net and do that. I'm sure they'ed love to have you there. 
Last edited by LiveryMan; 17th Jan 2013 at 07:53.
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Europe
Posts: 256
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I don't think it has been pointed out, but the power distribution and charging circuits seem to be made by Thales:
Boeing 787 Thales
Bubbers' gonna have a field day...
Boeing 787 Thales
Bubbers' gonna have a field day...
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK, sometimes USA
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Airbus A380 first flight 27-4-2005
Boeing 787 first flight 15-12-2009
Boeing 787 first flight 15-12-2009
I think the B787 will eventually be a game-changer but it might take another year or so to settle down. Boeing may yet lead the market with this product.
Airbus introduced an innovative VLA product to market with the A380 that Boeing didn't, but it also had numerous teething troubles. Despite Emirates best efforts the A380 isn't exactly a run-away sales success. However, Boeing's 747-8 has been a real sales disappointment so I suppose you could argue Airbus leads this segment of the market.
As for the B777 in it's various forms, surely Boeing must be regarded as a class winner to produce such a fine product in great numbers. I'm really looking forward to seeing what Boeing do to replace the B777.
Airbus does well with the A330 though, sitting below the B777 size aircraft and gets a tick in the box for it.
For me, the A320 v B737 debate is a waste of breath as they sell in roughly the same numbers and have attributes that appeal to different customers. I'd give them both a tick in the box for their respective products.
In short, I don't think either Airbus or Boeing leads one over the other overall. As each brings in a new model, you could argue they gain a lead but it a fluid game where each competitor leads the other from time to time.
Well it seems it is a non-issue for Boeing because they took into account a possible battery fire and say the airplane can stay aloft with a full-blown battery fire. presumably for the full ETOPS time frame.
Just one AA cell that goes bad can be quite spectacular - a pack equivalent to a stack of car batteries...?
It took a team of professional fire-fighters 40mins to put the 787 in Boston out and that was on the ground with specialist equipment.
Last edited by FullWings; 17th Jan 2013 at 08:21.
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: UK, sometimes USA
Posts: 402
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'm with Lemain and his comments ring true. Both Airbus and Boeing are producing ever complex aircraft stuffed with new technology.
Malfunctioning pitot tubes, wing rib cracks, battery problems, fuel leaks etc. are all bad for aviation's image. Worse, the flight crew can't just fly by feel now as they have to interpret these malfunctions and diagnose the computer output in very little time.
Malfunctioning pitot tubes, wing rib cracks, battery problems, fuel leaks etc. are all bad for aviation's image. Worse, the flight crew can't just fly by feel now as they have to interpret these malfunctions and diagnose the computer output in very little time.
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: uk
Posts: 106
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
A rich seam of battery chemistry information:
Basic to Advanced Battery Information from Battery University
Basic to Advanced Battery Information from Battery University
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: flying by night
Posts: 500
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
One would hope that these are not lithium cobalt oxide cells.......
Here's the spec sheet: http://www.s399157097.onlinehome.us/...s/LVP10-65.pdf
And yes, newer lithium-based chemistries have more desirable thermal properties in a runaway condition (click to enlarge):
Last edited by deptrai; 17th Jan 2013 at 10:29. Reason: typo
