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SAS close to bankrupcy

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SAS close to bankrupcy

Old 18th Nov 2012, 13:29
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Some insight into current T and Cs here:-

Danish government prepares for SAS bankruptcy

Very much like what I enjoyed circa 1988. If I went to a team meeting in Manchester from North-East England, I'd get a straight GBP50 per diem for leaving my home patch. You could buy a lot of motorway service area cornish pasties for that. Plus fuel. Plus overtime. Gosh, I miss those days...
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 14:03
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SAS close to bankrupcy

Doesn't sound good for SAS. Will this be SAS in its entirety or SAS the airline. They have masses of engineering and handling contracts throughout the system.
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 14:18
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We are talking about the whole SAS Group - SAS AB is a 100% owner of Scandinavian Airlines, Widerøe's Flyveselskap, SAS Finland (ex. Blue1), SAS Cargo, SAS Ground Handling and SAS Technical Services. SAS Group also own minority share in Air Greenland (37.5%) and Estonian Air (2.66%), but these two companies will not be affected.
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 14:25
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The concept of "disruptive innovation" was coined in the 90s by Harvard professor Clayton Christensen. It's about ideas that change the rules of the game in whole markets.

Clayton Christensen was fascinated by how even apparently successful and well-run companies could be reduced to mediocrity or even eliminated by this concept.

Are you as fascinated?
Borders in the US done in by Amazon books and then by Kindle

Travel agents by the internet

Computer sellers by Dell

Newspapers by online news

etc etc

Every industry has a challenge, its seeing it early enough to do it rather than following on.
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 16:25
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Very sad to see; one of the nicest European airlines I have flown with:

SAS Group Management Rejects Offers From Cabin Crew, Pilots - Bloomberg

This could of course be a negotiating ploy to wring more concessions from unions, but it will certainly scare the smorgasbord out of its clientele as well.

JetPhotos.Net Photo » LN-TUJ (CN: 29095) Scandinavian Airlines (SAS) Boeing 737-705 by John Fitzpatrick
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 18:02
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As a Swede, the failure is entirely a function of bad strategies and bad decisions. Let's look at the specifics:

1. Cutting down almost all intercontinental traffic and concentrating on Europe just when the downturn came, meant they got hammered by the low costs. They should have done the exact opposite.

2. Having a hub in Copenhagen and funneling almost all traffic through there. People fly direct when they can, and especially the Far East services should have been kept in Stockholm - Sweden is the industrial center of Scandinavia, not Denmark. People stayed away in droves, as Sam Goldwyn used to say.

3. Old planes, unhappy staff.

4. The whole notion that a trinity of Norway, Sweden and Denmark should share an airline and then not expect infighting and and angling for positions is nuts.

Honestly, the best thing that can happen SAS is if it goes bankrupt and the carcass is sold out. It's been propped up and subsidised long enough on the tax payers check. Norwegian and Wideröe can fill the Norwegian gap. Denmark and Sweden would have to come up with new airlines, which is good. Start anew, fresh, with new planes and a new approach.

For me as a Swede living abroad, I'd like them to get back to their 60's ethos when they were truly a global airline. Get back to the crisp, clean minimalism that served the world successfully up until the early 90's. I want to see the new SAS buy 787's or 350's and see lines from Stockholm serving San Francisco, Los Angeles, Rio de Janeiro, Johannesburg, Tokyo, Bangkok etc again like they did in the 60's. Unbelievably, SAS used to have no less than 29 DC-8's serving intercontinental lines, 10 747's etc back in the days. How the times have changed.

Last edited by AdamFrisch; 18th Nov 2012 at 18:41.
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 22:14
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Past midnight and no news? No news being good news?
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Old 18th Nov 2012, 22:44
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safelife - talks continue

SAS talks set to continue through night | The Copenhagen Post | The Danish News in English

Agreement reach with Norwegian cabin crew
Airline SAS inks deal with first unions in survival talks | Reuters

Last edited by davidjohnson6; 19th Nov 2012 at 01:14.
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 01:14
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Hopefully there will be a successful negotiation. Meanwhile a very Ryanairesque approach to media management, with another thread talking about a pilot using 6 ltrs of whiskey to de-ice the wing. This will no doubt wing it's way around the globe, allowing the deadlocked union and employer time out of the spotlight.
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 02:47
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Last week I read an article, saying SAS managment denied there was any problem, what happened all of a sudden?
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 05:39
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The agreements are coming. All three pilot unions have agreed to new conditions (10% pay cut), only Danish and Norwegian cabin crew representatives didn't yet reach the agreement. The negotiations with banks continued overnight, the deadline has shifted until... right now, I think. Very soon we should hear the news.
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 05:39
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It would be naive to think that merely renegotiating cabin crew terms and pay would sort out this mess. What about the many other problems with this airline?
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 06:53
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It would be naive to think that merely renegotiating cabin crew terms and pay would sort out this mess.
Almost as naive as thinking that all that has happened this week, and that all SAS are planning to do, is to renegotiate cabin crew T's and C's....
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 08:12
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fa2 an Avionker.

See post 58
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 11:21
  #75 (permalink)  
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What a tremendous responsibility! Seven out of eight unions did sign a deal, only one opposes, The Danish CC Union. Now if SAS disappear, it will be very easy to point the finger of blame at them. The Swedish unions are said to have always been the most compassionate, Danes are called by some as "troublemakers".
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 12:25
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Unofficially: with some 90% certainty the agreement will be reached.
Looks much better for SAS now.
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Old 19th Nov 2012, 13:12
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The Danish CC union has made an agreement with SAS, no details on exact T&C's. Rumours has it the pilots will take a 12% paycut and an 8% increase in productivity.

Next step will be to identify the roughly 1000 redundancies to be made and negotiate the divestment of SAS Ground Handling and Wideroe.
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Old 20th Nov 2012, 12:24
  #78 (permalink)  
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The dust has settled and reading the "Berlingske Bussines" today sums it up nicely:
The Swedish government wants to get rid of their shares.
The Norwegian government wants to get rid of their shares.
The Danish government don't want to comment....
SAS group chairman is hoping for a take-over, merger or something...
Taking into account that the management team that ran SAS into the ditch is also the team that has to pull it up again, I'll be surprised if they don't come running in two years time asking for more money.
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Old 20th Nov 2012, 12:48
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As predicted the latest cuts has resulted in little.

According to Kjos, after the latest cuts by SAS, Norwegian's cost per seat is still 59% lower.

0.42 vs. 0.71 NOK
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Old 20th Nov 2012, 13:05
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Statistics

Yes, but some people are happy to pay more for a particular service. Those figures are meaningless. True LCC propaganda.
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