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Kamchatka crash: Both pilots drunk

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Kamchatka crash: Both pilots drunk

Old 15th Oct 2012, 18:17
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Kamchatka crash: Both pilots drunk

Probably a good reason to avoid flying in Russia:
Russia's investigative agency says both the pilots of a plane that crashed last month in Russia's far east, killing 10 people, were drunk.

The Investigative Committee said Monday that a forensic study found the first pilot of the local flight was lightly intoxicated and his co-pilot was moderately intoxicated when their An-28 slammed into a forest on the Kamchatka Peninsula on Sept. 12. Ten of 14 people on board, including both pilots, were killed.

Investigators say they are looking into who was responsible for letting the pilots board.

Russia has had a series of deadly crashes in recent years, rooted in lax government controls, poor crew training and neglect of safety rules. Investigators determined that the pilot of a plane that crashed in June 2011, killing 47, was also drunk.
Source: The Associated Press
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Old 15th Oct 2012, 18:32
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I watched a programme 5 years ago about Aeroflot safety following an A310 crash over there that found the pilot's children in the cockpit. It was not uncommon for the crew to knock back a few neat vodkas prior to boarding to calm their nerves. This was hardly surprising given the precarious state some of the old TU-154s were in.
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Old 15th Oct 2012, 20:51
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Old 15th Oct 2012, 20:59
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Then people nag when other people jump to stereotypes....
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Old 15th Oct 2012, 21:00
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I would rather fly on an old plane with good pilots than on a new plane with drunk, inexperienced, or incompetent pilots.
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Old 15th Oct 2012, 21:12
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It was not uncommon for the crew to knock back a few neat vodkas prior to boarding to calm their nerves. This was hardly surprising given the precarious state some of the old TU-154s were in.
Total and utter .
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 14:44
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True, the Tupes weren't all wrecks, and Russian pilots are not nervous, but the Voddies ? sorry, but more than a little truth there I am afraid to say.

Ask any CC from Blue Panorama (who operated with Ukraine Airways back in 1999/2000 & served in the cabin of their aircraft when they code shared MXP-Kiev ) to reveal the flightcrews favorite in-flight tipple.

Last edited by captplaystation; 16th Oct 2012 at 14:46.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 14:47
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regretfully there is plenty of evidence that Russians drink on duty in all sorts of critical jobs

I believe it's starting to change, especially in the bigger, well run outfits, but it wouldn't surprise me in this case
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 15:22
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Ask any CC from Blue Panorama (who operated with Ukraine Airways back in 1999/2000 & served in the cabin of their aircraft when they code shared MXP-Kiev ) to reveal the flightcrews favorite in-flight tipple.
You are aware that Russia and Ukraine are two separate countries, right?
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 15:28
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Call me whatever you will, but I really would not feel safe getting on a Russian plane.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 15:53
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Different industry, but the same principle applies:

I worked in St. Petersburg for over a year for a company that had an extensive haulage department. I was told that every morning, before being alllowed in to the lorries, the drivers had to report to the company doctor for alcohol testing.

This suggests two things to me:
1. The drinking culture is/has been very strong in Russia, making the above statements more believable in the past.
2. Attitudes have changed (or at least are changing) and steps are being taken to make these scenarios much less likely in the furure.

Last edited by waldopepper42; 16th Oct 2012 at 16:01.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 16:22
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Not aviation, but a cultural problem perhaps?

Drunken Eastern European sea captains endanger waters, judge warns - Telegraph
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 16:44
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The cultures in Russia and Ukraine are broadly similar.

Drinking is very much part of that culture, both during and outside work hours. I contracted in Moscow for Aeroflot (ground based - nothing to do with flying) and some of the people I worked with had started on the way to work and were well-oiled by the mid-morning break, at which I was invariably invited to join them in the kitchen for 'special' coffee. The only way out was to tell them I was a teetotaller. That said, they seemed to function remarkably well considering their alcohol intake.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 18:10
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You are all reacting to a press report. Not the actual report.
he Investigative Committee said Monday that a forensic study found the first pilot of the local flight was lightly intoxicated and his co-pilot was moderately intoxicated.
.

I would like to see the definition of " lightly intoxicated" and I bet you a case of Vodka that the accident causes had nothing to do with that fact.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 18:19
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The Captain of the Perm 737 that crashed in 2008 tested positive for alcohol - sadly after all 82 pax and 6 crew were killed.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 18:27
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I had the pleasure of sharing a house with a Russian crew, all aged 40/45+ who, before doing their actual typerating on a western build aircraft, got send from deep dark mother Russia to get used to flying glass cockpit aircraft in a 2 man operation. They had been flying all types of Antonovs and TU's and had great stories to tell. One more amazing than the other. Even in the house, the captain was the boss.

They had one thing in the fridge: Vodka! And boy, could they drink...!

I heard from the training company that they were shockingly bad though. Good for Russia's way of doing things but they could not fly a modern airliner. But that's off topic.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 18:57
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" lightly intoxicated"
Light- Better mood, talkative, there is a feeling of muscular relaxation and physical wellbeing. Facial expressions become more expressive, movements less precise.

Moderate intoxication. Instead of a good mood can be irritability, resentment sometimes malice and aggression. Self-esteem inflated. Impaired coordination of movements and gait. Speech becomes slurred. Reduced pain and temperature sensitivity.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 19:43
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A TV documentary shown in Aus in the late 90's on the ABC, possibly a BBC or Granada production, called Aeroplanski, had numerous references to pre & inflight imbibing.
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Old 16th Oct 2012, 20:51
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Good for Russia's way of doing things but they could not fly a modern airliner. But that's off topic.
Maybe you should ask thos eguys too:

 
Old 16th Oct 2012, 21:04
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Every pilot is checked by a doctor before flight on blood pressure and alcohol level in Russia.
Russian aviation is NOT unsafe in general. I can guarantee that here in Western Europe, we also have our fair share of crew flying when over the limit.
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