Tupolev down in Surgut, Russia

[andrasz]

I grant you that it does take some time to understand all the details, but on the basis of a single accident you rarely ground (remove from service all aircraft) a large established fleet unless you already have replacement aircraft available to fill the gap.

Before we all get carried away, the grounding affects the B-2 variant, of which there are 14 left in operation. The vast majority of Tu-154s in service are the newer M model (new engines, flaps, avionics).

[Kulverstukas]

andrasz and only 7 in civil service, rest belongs to AF cargo (223th fleet).

[BOAC]

Originally Posted by lms901

To my untrained eye, that fire is in the cabin. Definitely nowhere near the rear mounted engines

- picture 2, post #7?

[andrasz]

To my untrained eye, that fire is in the cabin...

Looking at post #7/pic 2, I agree with the above. The flames are coming out of the opened emergency exits (on both sides there is one aft just before the engine inlet, and two overwing), there is nothing visible on the photos that would indicate an engine (or even APU) fire.

Note however that the fuel lines run under the cabin floor, with the pumps on any unnoticed fire fed by ruptured fuel lines would quickly spread under the cabin. The old Tu-154s had plywood floorboards (I believe the M has fiberglass boards), not exactly a fire retarding material...

Whatever happened there, clearly there was a massive sustained fire from the start that quickly spread along the length of the fuselage. The fireworks/vodka combination in passenger luggage is not an entirely implausible one, given the time of the year...

[BOAC]

There is another exit on the Tu-154 which is positioned at the point where the rear flames are emerging in that picture, as pointed out in the Flightglobal article.

- there is an exit right by the No2 intake?

[RegDep]

BOAC,

Yes.

http://www.onerateads.com/images/3V-T8-TUPO154.jpg

[andrasz]

there is an exit right by the No2 intake?

Actually, no. The exits are by the #1 and #3 intakes, on both sides. However the exits are not quite in front, but partially behind the intakes, opening into the gap between the engine and the fuselage just in front of the engine pylon. They were probably designed to be outside the suction zone, though I'm not sure I would really like to test that in practice...

Edit: these exits were actually an afterthought, they were added on the B variants to allow the maximum seating capacity go up to 180 (from 163). The older (pre-1974) A variants did not have them.

[BOAC]

Well. as you say, andrasz. Of course I meant no3 - just couldn't count!

[andrasz]

Of course, reply was tongue in cheek

[jcjeant]

Hi,

The fireworks/vodka combination in passenger luggage is not an entirely implausible one, given the time of the year...

Where is the TSA when you need them ?

[andrasz]

Where is the TSA when you need them ?

Perhaps having vodka while watching fireworks... ?

[Kulverstukas]

CVR found

????????? ???????? — ???????? «?????? ???? ? ??-154 ?-2»

[Kulverstukas]

MAK update on investigation posted recently. It's prooved that engines and starters are NOT cause of fire. Fire begins in the place between 62-65 frames.

[atakacs]

Anything noteworthy in this location ?

[andrasz]

Anything noteworthy in this location ?

Rear cargo compartment / end of passenger cabin with lavatories.
No principal systems there, though plenty of cables + fuel lines underfloor.

Electric short circuit, lavatory fire (smoking) or something in checked baggage all appear to be possibilities.

[Kulverstukas]

[5 APUs captain]

The only known at the moment: After engine start and selecting the generators ON the black smoke has appeared from the rear toilet.....

[vovachan]

Latest MAK update says preliminary analysis of the FDR shows electrical systems problems the day before the fire.

[Kulverstukas]

Video from CCTV camers

YouTube - Tu 154 on fire

[747JJ]

Kulvertukas. Thanks for a very interesting link.

It is apparent how fast the fire spread, similarly to the China Airlines 737 in Japan.

Cockpit to Cabin communication in a fire situation must be quick and precise. Not much extra time if any to decide a course of action.