MP supports finninigley airport
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Which airports would be losers? We have been down this road several
times last year.
The first to disappear would be Sheffield; Leeds/Bradford would suffer;
Humberside would equally stagnate, while East Midlands would perhaps
level off to a minor degree.
Perhaps one of the biggest losers would be AOG's (Onan on another
day) favourite John Lennon Airport owned by the same (Manchester)
company which owns Finningley. As previously noted a large percentage of
pax at Liverpool originate from Yorkshire and if a low cost carrier
opens up a network of routes from Finningley, why travel to LPL? ( Or is
that LJL now?)
Sorry Onan, Manchester will not lose much, in fact plans are afoot to
entice low cost carriers to MAN anyway.
Brabazon is correct, EZY is the main beneficiary at Liverpool, and
likewise should a low-cost carrier commence operations at Finningley
then a similar deal will most certainly be created.
As noted previously, a large percentage of the revenue earned at LPL is
derived from the airport's car parks, which are in a state of continual
expansion. More income is obtained from the car parks than from the
principal low-cost operator.
times last year.
The first to disappear would be Sheffield; Leeds/Bradford would suffer;
Humberside would equally stagnate, while East Midlands would perhaps
level off to a minor degree.
Perhaps one of the biggest losers would be AOG's (Onan on another
day) favourite John Lennon Airport owned by the same (Manchester)
company which owns Finningley. As previously noted a large percentage of
pax at Liverpool originate from Yorkshire and if a low cost carrier
opens up a network of routes from Finningley, why travel to LPL? ( Or is
that LJL now?)
Sorry Onan, Manchester will not lose much, in fact plans are afoot to
entice low cost carriers to MAN anyway.
Brabazon is correct, EZY is the main beneficiary at Liverpool, and
likewise should a low-cost carrier commence operations at Finningley
then a similar deal will most certainly be created.
As noted previously, a large percentage of the revenue earned at LPL is
derived from the airport's car parks, which are in a state of continual
expansion. More income is obtained from the car parks than from the
principal low-cost operator.
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Rockwell: The degree to how much MAN suffers from Finningley is (as with the other fields) wholly dependent on how successful the venture is and what sort of traffic it attracts. With 25% of MAN's traffic coming from Yorks then the airport IS vulnerable should a field ever be evolve to the east of the pennines that is able to meet local demand. Whether Finningley proves to be the answer is a different story, but it is no surprise that MAN has been one of the most vocal objectors to the proposal. Indeed, a Doncaster MP has tabled a question in Parliament asking whether the objections by the local authority owned MAN is a case of public money from one area of the country being used to threaten job creation and economic regeneration in another.
On your other point, I'd be very suprised to see significant low cost ops at MAN. It would seem a foolish move indeed to spend years building up a network of domestic and international scheduled services only to then p**s the likes of BA, BMI, LH etc by offering a low-cost carrier cheaper landing fees and the opportunity to nick all their pax!
On your other point, I'd be very suprised to see significant low cost ops at MAN. It would seem a foolish move indeed to spend years building up a network of domestic and international scheduled services only to then p**s the likes of BA, BMI, LH etc by offering a low-cost carrier cheaper landing fees and the opportunity to nick all their pax!
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Rockwell
perhaps my UK geography is a bit rusty, but I would have thought Sheffield, Humberside, Teeside, Tyneside and Leeds/Bradford would be the losers. Surely Manchester with it's international sched status and I think Liverpool would be too far to the west and would also be imune from any impact Finningley might have.
perhaps my UK geography is a bit rusty, but I would have thought Sheffield, Humberside, Teeside, Tyneside and Leeds/Bradford would be the losers. Surely Manchester with it's international sched status and I think Liverpool would be too far to the west and would also be imune from any impact Finningley might have.
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The issue of which airports will suffer from the development of Finningley depends on the level and type of services which will be offered from it and what the corresponding levels and types are from other airports. Manchester, by the fact that it has a large range of services attracts passengers from a large catchment area. I am sure many people from the Doncaster area travel to Manchester to catch flights if they are not offered from Leeds, Humberside, Teesside or even Sheffield.
So if Airtours who whoever start services from Finningley to destinations served by them from Manchester then they may see a reduction in passengers, but the full effect will depend on factors such as what the price difference is, what times the flights depart etc etc.
We could debate on what reasons people use to choose where to fly from.
I even sat next to a couple flying from PMI to LTN who were travelling on to the Doncaster area to see relatives - they chose LTN as the fare was cheap and travelling up the A1 "wasn't too bad". Their view on Finningley being developed wasn't as positive as others, saying that whilst locals had been used to the noise while the RAF were there, some had got used to the quiet and wanted it to stay thay way.
So if Airtours who whoever start services from Finningley to destinations served by them from Manchester then they may see a reduction in passengers, but the full effect will depend on factors such as what the price difference is, what times the flights depart etc etc.
We could debate on what reasons people use to choose where to fly from.
I even sat next to a couple flying from PMI to LTN who were travelling on to the Doncaster area to see relatives - they chose LTN as the fare was cheap and travelling up the A1 "wasn't too bad". Their view on Finningley being developed wasn't as positive as others, saying that whilst locals had been used to the noise while the RAF were there, some had got used to the quiet and wanted it to stay thay way.
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I see from the NOTAMS that Finningley is to re open from 5 to 12 August. My spies tell me there will be C-130 Fat Alberts, Lynx helis and an Islander operating, incl weekends. Anyone know what is going on?
By the way, the addresses to write to in support of the proposals at the Public Inquiry are:
Mrs Marcia Dean
The Planning Inspectorate
Room 3/17, Eagle Wing
Temple Quay House
2 The Square
Bristol BS1 6PN
Tel: 0117 987 8918
__________________________________
Caroline Flint MP
The House of Commons
London SW1A 0AA
The Inquiry is due to get under way on 25th September and all papers must be with the Planning Inspectorate 4 weks beforehand, so send anything you can ASAP. Let's be having the old place buzzing again!!
[ 20 July 2001: Message edited by: Justin Abeaver ]
I say there boy
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I noticed that as well - there's an ATZ active with frequency 112.1.
There has been helicopter activity at FLY for a while now. A sign of good times ahead I hope. It's a shame to waste a runway so long (just like the shame of Elvington's massive disused runway and pan just up the road which now only hosts car boot sales plus the odd visitor and airshow for the museum).
There has been helicopter activity at FLY for a while now. A sign of good times ahead I hope. It's a shame to waste a runway so long (just like the shame of Elvington's massive disused runway and pan just up the road which now only hosts car boot sales plus the odd visitor and airshow for the museum).
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Fast Erect
Perhaps post NATS PPP, the next target is the navaids, each sponsored by a different company/group/organisation, with real speech capability.
Morse idents to make way for :
"This is the MCT VOR, sponsored by Boddingtons, the Cream of Manchester"
"This is the Dean Cross VOR, sponsored by Blue Nun."
[]
Perhaps post NATS PPP, the next target is the navaids, each sponsored by a different company/group/organisation, with real speech capability.
Morse idents to make way for :
"This is the MCT VOR, sponsored by Boddingtons, the Cream of Manchester"
"This is the Dean Cross VOR, sponsored by Blue Nun."
[]
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Rafat,
Until recently I was MAN based, but I live in the Doncaster area. Throughout all of the summer whenever I drove across the penines to MAN, especially for earlies at 4am, I was in a line of minibuses and cabs we all went to MAN airport but they went to the terminals and I went to the staff car park.
The level of traffic that comes from the east of the country is large and a decent airport this side of the penines wil reduce the traffic at MAN substantially. That is what they are worried about.
Plus MAN own Humberside which will collapse once FY opens.
Until recently I was MAN based, but I live in the Doncaster area. Throughout all of the summer whenever I drove across the penines to MAN, especially for earlies at 4am, I was in a line of minibuses and cabs we all went to MAN airport but they went to the terminals and I went to the staff car park.
The level of traffic that comes from the east of the country is large and a decent airport this side of the penines wil reduce the traffic at MAN substantially. That is what they are worried about.
Plus MAN own Humberside which will collapse once FY opens.
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AOG, RAFRAT & wizzjet
Ah "Manchester!"
Having worked there [in ATC] sincc 1969..[YES I am a Boring Old F@ft]
I have seen the Airport grow. The "Archetect" was a certain "Gordon Sweetapple", [who used to race his go-cart around the taxy-ways]AND there was one bus per hour from Stockport and only three from Manchester.
Yes, there is NOW a lot of vehicular traffic from "Yorkshire" to MAN.
Why????? LBA is up and staggering. HUM is well....humming.
FACT the catchment for MAN is actually greater than for LHR. [AOG, look at a map for a change]
The facts are, Manchester Airport has [in the face of the South, AND the Neddies] made a World wide reputation for itself. YES, YES, and blinking YES it has PROBLEMS, but as a local lad who is lucky enough to do a job THAT he likes, WHERE he likes
Nuff Sed!!!
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy
Ah "Manchester!"
Having worked there [in ATC] sincc 1969..[YES I am a Boring Old F@ft]
I have seen the Airport grow. The "Archetect" was a certain "Gordon Sweetapple", [who used to race his go-cart around the taxy-ways]AND there was one bus per hour from Stockport and only three from Manchester.
Yes, there is NOW a lot of vehicular traffic from "Yorkshire" to MAN.
Why????? LBA is up and staggering. HUM is well....humming.
FACT the catchment for MAN is actually greater than for LHR. [AOG, look at a map for a change
]The facts are, Manchester Airport has [in the face of the South, AND the Neddies] made a World wide reputation for itself. YES, YES, and blinking YES it has PROBLEMS, but as a local lad who is lucky enough to do a job THAT he likes, WHERE he likes
Nuff Sed!!!
we aim to please, it keeps the cleaners happy
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"Additionally, there was a visit recently by the British American Business Council which included American Airlines' UK General Manager. He stated that AA operate 21 flights per day into London but none into the Yorkshire & Humber region, and Finningley would create a fantastic opportunity for this gateway to be established!"
Given that I have just returnd from California where CNN/NBC speak of
" Yorkshire's race riots " those comments may come back to haunt the venerable gentleman !
I am sure his marketing department would have difficulty justifying one flight a day from Finningley to the USA without him promising that it is the second gateway to the U.K. ! I am sure Continental and Delta will be wetting themselves laughing at this.
AA's aircraft also overfly Machrihanish - is this another gateway ?
Given that I have just returnd from California where CNN/NBC speak of
" Yorkshire's race riots " those comments may come back to haunt the venerable gentleman !
I am sure his marketing department would have difficulty justifying one flight a day from Finningley to the USA without him promising that it is the second gateway to the U.K. ! I am sure Continental and Delta will be wetting themselves laughing at this.
AA's aircraft also overfly Machrihanish - is this another gateway ?
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Cmmon Bill!If you worked hard enough at it, I'm sure you'd get the contract to ferry the crews to and from Manch'.
Just think of all that loverly loot rolling around in the back of yer sharabang.
Just think of all that loverly loot rolling around in the back of yer sharabang.
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Spoobill, I am sure you are correct but it has cost us a lot of money building and installing our patented 'low cloud and fog' machines at LBA !
There aren't any hills to hide it in near Finningley !
There aren't any hills to hide it in near Finningley !
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This'll add some fire to the smoke:
In today's Sheffield Star there is going to be an article covering the until now, secret discussions between Sheffield City Airport Ltd and Peel Holdings. By all accounts Peel are negotiating to purchase up to 50% of SCAL.
More on this when I've seen the article in question, but it makes you wonder eh? What could Peel be planning.
Will they close Sheffield down, forget all about opening Finningley or even operate them together. Who knows, but it's all very interesting.
In today's Sheffield Star there is going to be an article covering the until now, secret discussions between Sheffield City Airport Ltd and Peel Holdings. By all accounts Peel are negotiating to purchase up to 50% of SCAL.
More on this when I've seen the article in question, but it makes you wonder eh? What could Peel be planning.
Will they close Sheffield down, forget all about opening Finningley or even operate them together. Who knows, but it's all very interesting.
I say there boy
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The only reason I can see Peel taking an interest in Sheffield is for its staff and equipment. Once they have closed it down they'll be able to drive the ILS, NDB, fire service, airport management and ATCOs (with their unused radar ratings) 15 miles down the M18. All they need to add is a Surveillance Radar and a Class D CTR and, hey presto, they have a proper airport straight out of the box. They could even take the Meccano terminal!
What is the most annoying thing about the whole Sheffield saga is that this is what they should have done all along.
All that European money should have been spent on developing Finningley with a spur road to the M18 and a fast rail link to Sheffield city centre (there's an under-utilised freight line that runs right past EGSY direct to Finningley that would have done nicely). Instead what has happened is good money has been poured after bad at the abandoned slag tip that is Sheffield City doing no-one any good, not least the image of the city.
The city council and developers of EGSY were poorly advised from the outset. They were advised that only a City airport supporting small high-yield flights as close to the city centre as possible would succeed. Hence EGSY's turboprop/146-only runway and congested location just 4 miles from the city centre.
This advice was given just months before the low-cost phenomenon hit Britain and their need for low-cost 737-capable airports with lots of development potential. Oops.
[ 25 July 2001: Message edited by: foghorn ]
What is the most annoying thing about the whole Sheffield saga is that this is what they should have done all along.
All that European money should have been spent on developing Finningley with a spur road to the M18 and a fast rail link to Sheffield city centre (there's an under-utilised freight line that runs right past EGSY direct to Finningley that would have done nicely). Instead what has happened is good money has been poured after bad at the abandoned slag tip that is Sheffield City doing no-one any good, not least the image of the city.
The city council and developers of EGSY were poorly advised from the outset. They were advised that only a City airport supporting small high-yield flights as close to the city centre as possible would succeed. Hence EGSY's turboprop/146-only runway and congested location just 4 miles from the city centre.
This advice was given just months before the low-cost phenomenon hit Britain and their need for low-cost 737-capable airports with lots of development potential. Oops.
[ 25 July 2001: Message edited by: foghorn ]
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Foghorn, I don't think I could have put it better myself.
The present owners are a property developement company with no aviation experience. Their only interest was getting the land next to the airport to build a business park on, and the agreement with Sheffield council requires an airport until 2006 otherwise the land goes back to the council.
MOst of the staff I am sure would leap at the chance to move to Finningley, although I'm not sure about the controllers as they are with Serco
Whatever happens, it should all be done and dusted by mid-August, so not long to wait.
The present owners are a property developement company with no aviation experience. Their only interest was getting the land next to the airport to build a business park on, and the agreement with Sheffield council requires an airport until 2006 otherwise the land goes back to the council.
MOst of the staff I am sure would leap at the chance to move to Finningley, although I'm not sure about the controllers as they are with Serco
Whatever happens, it should all be done and dusted by mid-August, so not long to wait.