FAA withdraws flightcrew duty, rest NPRM
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I had a friend flying for an Oriental airline out of Vancouver to Taiwan, he was commuting from Oslo.
Nothing wrong with this, IMO...its the short commutes weekly that are tiring, and pilots should be paid a reasonable cost of living base allowance to enable them to rest properly....at base.
Of course, regional airlines will say this is far too expensive, so tired pilots will continue to fly tiring schedules, and more accidents/incidents are likely to occur.
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Is there any policy to take a well earned rest after 7,000 posts
If you somehow object to my posts, send an email to management.
Be advised, this has been tried before, with limited success.
411A tells it like it is not how you might want it to be.
And, as far as traveling where the base of ops is...411A no doubt holds the record...10,000 miles.
Quite a long time ago, to Singapore, for a B707 Command/Training (TRE/IRE) position.
Go where the big bucks are...and take your kids...they are likely to receive a better education in that foreign location, anyway.
Afraid of leaving friends behind?
Make new ones at the new base.
And, in some cases, collect your salary tax free.
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I seriously doubt that 411A has EVER worked for a major US airline, thus he has a hard time getting a grip on the convulsions this industry has sustained from a purely line pilots point of view. Base closing or equipment scheduling is more like musical chairs than airline operations. The convulsing realestate markets along with cost of living in some of these bases inhibits if not outright prevents "following the time" in many cases.
Working someone like Saudia solves the problems before they start. You simply dont commute on a trip basis. Maybe monthly, but not every trip.
He is right though about commuting and the pilots are their own worst enemies in this areana. Pretty hard to have sympathy for someone who commutes from the west coast to say JFK and then flies an all nighter to Europe. Not that I have ever done that.
Working someone like Saudia solves the problems before they start. You simply dont commute on a trip basis. Maybe monthly, but not every trip.
He is right though about commuting and the pilots are their own worst enemies in this areana. Pretty hard to have sympathy for someone who commutes from the west coast to say JFK and then flies an all nighter to Europe. Not that I have ever done that.
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I seriously doubt that 411A has EVER worked for a major US airline...
All, tax free.
No problemo.
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411A...Did you ever yank gear for anyone and if not , please tell us how you became worhy of a DEC slot at SIA?
SQ?
Joined as a DEC with 2000 hours Command in the airplane, in my early thirties.
All prior training at PanAmerican.
It really is quite simple...you are either prepared to actually go where the job is, or you ain't.
My bags are always packed.
Next?
PS.
Airline flying can (and many times, is) a very satisfying job, however...you have to make the choices that are necessary, to obtain a senior position.
IE: make your own luck...not depend on some company to make it for you.
Last edited by 411A; 26th Nov 2009 at 20:32.
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Well aside from all the potshots at 411A I think it is criminal that all the commuters out there are forced, probably some at gun point, to work for the dreary jerks who establish a base of operations where the pilots don’t want to live. Maybe sometime in the near future all those commuters will unite, find those dirty SOBs, and go lynch em! That will assuredly fatten the paychecks of each of those poor guys/gals who had to commute to their jobs.
Oh, wait. If the owners are pushing up the grass, it might be that their inflow of cash might stop and therefore stop the operation … hmm… oh, well. These guys were looking for a job when they found the rotten one … right? They probably can go find one of those hundreds of $1000/hr captain jobs in Orlando or Houston or … hmm … where were those jobs again?
Well, maybe we could pass a law … “all airline pilot starting salaries would be $80,000 per year – guaranteed to go up 10% a year for the first 5 years and then 25% a year for the next 10 and have the airline provide housing (of a “suitable quality”) for each person that desires homes at the airline’s base of operations. That way everyone who wanted to be a pilot would have a great career to look forward to. All we have to do is pass another law that says minimum airline tickets would be $10 a mile plus fuel surcharges.
Yeah … that otta do it.
Oh, wait. If the owners are pushing up the grass, it might be that their inflow of cash might stop and therefore stop the operation … hmm… oh, well. These guys were looking for a job when they found the rotten one … right? They probably can go find one of those hundreds of $1000/hr captain jobs in Orlando or Houston or … hmm … where were those jobs again?
Well, maybe we could pass a law … “all airline pilot starting salaries would be $80,000 per year – guaranteed to go up 10% a year for the first 5 years and then 25% a year for the next 10 and have the airline provide housing (of a “suitable quality”) for each person that desires homes at the airline’s base of operations. That way everyone who wanted to be a pilot would have a great career to look forward to. All we have to do is pass another law that says minimum airline tickets would be $10 a mile plus fuel surcharges.
Yeah … that otta do it.
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What is this all prior training at Pan Am. You make it sound like Pan Am was running some sort of an ab initio program back in the 60's. NOT.
Amazing that SIA would hire anyone with 2000 hours as a DEC on the 707? Maybe that was 2000 in type? And where might have that come from?
Amazing that SIA would hire anyone with 2000 hours as a DEC on the 707? Maybe that was 2000 in type? And where might have that come from?
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What is this all prior training at Pan Am. You make it sound like Pan Am was running some sort of an ab initio program back in the 60's. NOT.
Amazing that SIA would hire anyone with 2000 hours as a DEC on the 707? Maybe that was 2000 in type? And where might have that come from?
Amazing that SIA would hire anyone with 2000 hours as a DEC on the 707? Maybe that was 2000 in type? And where might have that come from?
If spooky wants further details, a PM will suffice...and will provide details of foreign airline ops, and the pilots that have been there, done that.
Spooky excluded, no doubt.
I think it is criminal that all the commuters out there are forced, probably some at gun point, to work for the dreary jerks who establish a base of operations where the pilots don’t want to live.
You either accept the job as is...or walk.
Take your pick.
Those airlines really don't care...at all.
Plenty of applications at the HR department.
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Thanks for the clarification ,Stilton.No, I did not make the assumption that it was the norm industry wide. Just curious to know which airlines do the right thing and which just say they do the right thing,as far as providing good rest facilities to commuting crew.
Cheers!
Alt3.
Cheers!
Alt3.
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I've had my disagreements with 411A over the years, but he is SPOT ON with the idea that you look at the conditions on offer, and, accept or reject; don't take a position, and then whine about conditions. There are alternatives; I did my military time in the '60's-70's in the Air Force, and looked for the non-existing 'DREAM JOB' with Eastern, Pan-Am, Braniff, etc., then, when nothing good was on offer, went overseas, because that was WHERE THE WORK WAS, and, WHERE THE DECENT PAY WAS, and I had a family to support. If you whine that you don't wanna leave the good ole USA, just take what is on offer, and SHUT UP. There are great opportunities overseas...I've seen them, in the Middle East, India, Far East, etc. even in this impacted economic morass. The USA's future is grim, because of the last few Administrations' monetary policies...the dollar is tanking, and will go much lower. If you insist on the US, don't friggin gripe about conditions...you have rejected much better opportunities overseas; it was your choice. Sam
You are welcome, Alouette3. Great user name by the way.
Spooky brings up some good points 411a. Why not answer the question ?
you trained at Pan Am and say you had 2000 hours when you were hired by SQ as a DEC on the 707.
It would be very hard to believe they would hire you with 2000 hours total time. Curious to know where you got 2000 hours in the 707 ?
You've never been shy before, why keep it a secret ? !
Spooky brings up some good points 411a. Why not answer the question ?
you trained at Pan Am and say you had 2000 hours when you were hired by SQ as a DEC on the 707.
It would be very hard to believe they would hire you with 2000 hours total time. Curious to know where you got 2000 hours in the 707 ?
You've never been shy before, why keep it a secret ? !
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It would be very hard to believe they would hire you with 2000 hours total time.
I will make make it easy for your good self...
Joined as a DEC with 2000 hours Command in the airplane
Where?
Offer me a position and I might send my CV...provided of course you have the deep pockets to actually pay....
Yes 411a, I offer you the 'suspected not confirmed' position of 'most prolific contributor to PPrune'
Ideas for prizes might be a Fifth Stripe, a megaphone or a larger mirror, take your pick.
Still no details forthcoming on where you attained the 2000 hours 707 command time for your Direct Entry Command though..
Ideas for prizes might be a Fifth Stripe, a megaphone or a larger mirror, take your pick.
Still no details forthcoming on where you attained the 2000 hours 707 command time for your Direct Entry Command though..
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Still no details....
Also, think of the loads of cargo that departed Accra.
Do a little research and you might even find a few photos of the 707's that I flew...mostly old straight pipe models ex-PanAmerican and TWA.
Even a couple of Conway powered ones, from time to time.
And yes, I stepped straight into the LHS.
It's a big world out there, stilton...it doesn't just end at the US border.
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Originally Posted by 411A
Airlines are not the least bit concerned about 'where you want to live'. You either accept the job as is...or walk. Take your pick. Those airlines really don't care...at all. Plenty of applications at the HR department.
Each job comes with a salary and working conditions - those should be made clear to any applicant ... and if these conditions aren't explained, it's the applicant's responsibility to find out BEFORE they sign on. And, once working, there isn't a law that forbids someone from resigning from a bad job.
I would wonder about the mental facilities of someone who goes to work every day, day after day, complaining about the work, the hours, the pay, the ... whatever. If it's so bad ... for cryin' out loud ... go find something else to do! Sheesh.