BA jet landing incident at LCY
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I see that the airport has used five airside ground staff in the local press calling them "The Rescuers" While they deserve the praise its strange to see them photographed , names and ages. Is this not a security risk? Are they and those close to them now at risk of pressure from extremists and organised crime? I dont think I have seen airside workers / grunts used in this way before.
Join Date: Oct 2005
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Maybe BA RJ pilots can answer the following;
Is your pushback at AMS performed by tug with a towbar or the Big unit that lifts the nose leg off the floor.I ask this because memory tells me that only pushbacks with the formentioned, can, and only be carried out due to incidences that have happened in the past.
Sidewall diaphragms have been changed on numerous 146's due to cracking.
Just putting over the point that an eager tug driver 'pushing', before 'brakes released', can cause serious damage.
Is your pushback at AMS performed by tug with a towbar or the Big unit that lifts the nose leg off the floor.I ask this because memory tells me that only pushbacks with the formentioned, can, and only be carried out due to incidences that have happened in the past.
Sidewall diaphragms have been changed on numerous 146's due to cracking.
Just putting over the point that an eager tug driver 'pushing', before 'brakes released', can cause serious damage.
Join Date: Aug 2007
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Have seen the damage to the fuselage in these cases, not pretty requires skin changes etc. Have also changed a nose well side wall....not easy!!! Well not for a fat one like me!
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Incredible to think that when LCY first opened the only aircraft allowed in was the amazingly STOL but sadly short lived Dash 7. Now they are looking at operating A318 (319?) transatlantic from there.
Happen/to/accident/waiting (rearrange into a well known phrase or saying)
Happen/to/accident/waiting (rearrange into a well known phrase or saying)
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Hear that just like the Swiss RJ, recently involved in heavy landing and tailscrape, the BA aircraft may be shipped by barge across river to be repaired and then shipped back to resume ops.
Join Date: Apr 2005
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'Accident waiting to happen?'
McDoo,
It wouldn't be 'Accident waiting to happen' would it?
Picture the poor skipper sitting there for n hours knowing that he has only been into LCY in the sim and for a few tame landing - being confronted by marginal conditions in darkness, PPN and serious X winds.
All I can say is STN is much safer in such conditions. I've been there and done that. I am a bit of a spineless coward though.
Good luck and if in doubt - don't.
DB
It wouldn't be 'Accident waiting to happen' would it?
Picture the poor skipper sitting there for n hours knowing that he has only been into LCY in the sim and for a few tame landing - being confronted by marginal conditions in darkness, PPN and serious X winds.
All I can say is STN is much safer in such conditions. I've been there and done that. I am a bit of a spineless coward though.
Good luck and if in doubt - don't.
DB
Gob,
Absolute non-event. BACF is well past the yellow lines, if the LX guys weren't happy they would have gone around (and they're pretty conservative). On top of that, the tower controller would have them do it if he/she thought it too close for comfort. No more scaremongering please.
Absolute non-event. BACF is well past the yellow lines, if the LX guys weren't happy they would have gone around (and they're pretty conservative). On top of that, the tower controller would have them do it if he/she thought it too close for comfort. No more scaremongering please.
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who ever titled that video as a near miss
what complete tosh ... that's normal ops at LCY.. the camera work is not too good either... away to the spotters forum with ya ..
Last edited by Teddy Robinson; 22nd Feb 2009 at 10:28. Reason: typo
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DutchBird-757
Me too, however I seem to recall, it was never approved. A blind eye was always turned to that particular operation. Falling under the category of TFD!
Perhaps I'm wrong, or perhaps it was changed.
Maybe rvsm has a good point??
Me too, however I seem to recall, it was never approved. A blind eye was always turned to that particular operation. Falling under the category of TFD!
Perhaps I'm wrong, or perhaps it was changed.
Maybe rvsm has a good point??
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At the time of this landing/video I was on the ground awaiting start. The Swiss crew reported visual and happy to continue.
From my angle, there was plently of room/time for this landing to be conducted safely.
Remember that Swiss are one of the first to go around when they don't like something.
Hand it to the ATCO, kept calm and pulled it off. One less go-around.
Oh, and may I add, It's much more ideal when the ATCO asks the question and provides some ground information.
"Aircraft vacating ahead, are you happy to continue"
Rather than "GO AROUND!!"
I've been sent around (not just at city) far to early in my opinion. If the question had been asked if we are happy to continue, 9 times out of 10, it would have been "YES WE ARE" and a safe landing would have followed.
The crew are a better judge of speed/distance than the person in the Tower.
However, I am not knocking the work the ATC do in keeping us all flying safe! Top job.
From my angle, there was plently of room/time for this landing to be conducted safely.
Remember that Swiss are one of the first to go around when they don't like something.
Hand it to the ATCO, kept calm and pulled it off. One less go-around.
Oh, and may I add, It's much more ideal when the ATCO asks the question and provides some ground information.
"Aircraft vacating ahead, are you happy to continue"
Rather than "GO AROUND!!"
I've been sent around (not just at city) far to early in my opinion. If the question had been asked if we are happy to continue, 9 times out of 10, it would have been "YES WE ARE" and a safe landing would have followed.
The crew are a better judge of speed/distance than the person in the Tower.
However, I am not knocking the work the ATC do in keeping us all flying safe! Top job.
Last edited by TMAPAX; 24th Feb 2009 at 14:34. Reason: More info,
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Hello TMAPAX."Remember that Swiss are one of the first to go around when they don't like something."Could u pls tell me why SWISS is the first to go around when they dont like something?What is something?Take care and be proud of beeing a LCY pilot.It is not just a 3° glide, 3000 meters of concrete and the terminal on the left or the right side.Now and then you have( may) to show your 
balls.Ha Ha.The Swiss dont guard the Pope just because.
balls.Ha Ha.The Swiss dont guard the Pope just because.
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Something is anything the crew dislike, or feel will cause safety implications to them, their passengers and or aircraft.
They follow the rules very closely.
If bad weather is forecasted, they cancel. Rather than trying to make that approach and descending down to 400ft over London in fog.
A very good airline with smart and cautious crews.
They follow the rules very closely.
If bad weather is forecasted, they cancel. Rather than trying to make that approach and descending down to 400ft over London in fog.
A very good airline with smart and cautious crews.
Join Date: Jul 2007
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Many years ago while over Madrid in a Swissair DC-9 we were on top of a very big weather system. The Captain announced that most flights had diverted to Barcelona but he was going to make an attempt to land and we should expect strong turbulence. We made our attempt and it was very rough. We went from clear skies to pitch black but I was happy when we hit an updraft and shot out of there back into the blue. We then diverted to Barcelona where the airport was filled with many aircraft apparently from Madrid, sat there with doors open for 2 hours then flew back in clear weather.
I didnt really appreciate the Captain making that attempt to land when , as I found out later, all other flights had diverted .
Our Swissair flight was apparently the only one that made that attempt as Madrid was having one of its worst thunderstorms in 2 decades (according to the Madrid associate and resident who was waiting to fetch me at the airport and the news).
Of course SWISS and SWISSAIR are not the same airline.
I didnt really appreciate the Captain making that attempt to land when , as I found out later, all other flights had diverted .
Our Swissair flight was apparently the only one that made that attempt as Madrid was having one of its worst thunderstorms in 2 decades (according to the Madrid associate and resident who was waiting to fetch me at the airport and the news).
Of course SWISS and SWISSAIR are not the same airline.
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Any subsequent AAIB report would have highlighted:
Deliberately destabilising the approach at 100ft.
Departing from company SOPs.
Not following the manufacturer's recommended landing technique.
Poor CRM, due to the pressure deviating from SOPs puts on the F/O.
You're just lucky you never had an incident there. If you did, do you think company would have supported you - especially if it had made it into the public eye like Friday's incident has?
Please tell us you didn't have 4 reds.
On a lighter note False Capture, I started life as a despatcher at LCY back in '89. A small Dutch operator whom I shalln't name, but who operated a Dornier 228, released some sparkling PR literature.
They basically released a smashing looking postcard made up from a photo taken by a passenger from the cabin as the a/c was on short final to 28. Guess what? Nobody in their PR dept., had noticed the 4 reds in the pic.
Oddly the postcards didn't hang around long. No idea why
Deliberately destabilising the approach at 100ft.
Departing from company SOPs.
Not following the manufacturer's recommended landing technique.
Poor CRM, due to the pressure deviating from SOPs puts on the F/O.
You're just lucky you never had an incident there. If you did, do you think company would have supported you - especially if it had made it into the public eye like Friday's incident has?
Please tell us you didn't have 4 reds.
On a lighter note False Capture, I started life as a despatcher at LCY back in '89. A small Dutch operator whom I shalln't name, but who operated a Dornier 228, released some sparkling PR literature.
They basically released a smashing looking postcard made up from a photo taken by a passenger from the cabin as the a/c was on short final to 28. Guess what? Nobody in their PR dept., had noticed the 4 reds in the pic.
Oddly the postcards didn't hang around long. No idea why
Join Date: Mar 2009
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hi guys registered to ask a quick question... one of the terminals at our centre has about 15 pictures of close up damage and 1 picture showing the nose gear sheared off just above the hinge point. Unfortunatly teminal is heavily restricted so we cant do anything with the pictures.....
does anyone here have them? i am surprised they have not been added to this topic actually?
does anyone here have them? i am surprised they have not been added to this topic actually?
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Billysmart
It would be good if someone could obtain those pictures.
It also just occurred to me that G-BXAR/E3298 has also previously
been quite unlucky. It was the infamous 'RJ in the grass'...
Ground Engineers performed an EGR that went a bit wrong.
Ferry flight to Exeter. 2+ months later with serious structural repairs,
re-skinning of lower fuselage, extensive alignment checks, rebuild &
function checks, handed back to customer serviceable.
Whats the plan then BA chaps?
BAe146???
It would be good if someone could obtain those pictures.
It also just occurred to me that G-BXAR/E3298 has also previously
been quite unlucky. It was the infamous 'RJ in the grass'...
Ground Engineers performed an EGR that went a bit wrong.
Ferry flight to Exeter. 2+ months later with serious structural repairs,
re-skinning of lower fuselage, extensive alignment checks, rebuild &
function checks, handed back to customer serviceable.
Whats the plan then BA chaps?
BAe146???
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hi yes i wish we could do anything with the photographs but the terminal is locked down so all we can do is access our email - its not even possible to copy/paste items or right click. we are still wondering how the photographs came to be on the terminal.
all i can say is the top section of the gear is sheared open above the hinge point and i am told by an engineer that this area is subject to ldt something testing for cracks. Other photo shows the nose wheels sticking thru the floor of the electronics area and a large hole in the area below the computers.
all i can say is the top section of the gear is sheared open above the hinge point and i am told by an engineer that this area is subject to ldt something testing for cracks. Other photo shows the nose wheels sticking thru the floor of the electronics area and a large hole in the area below the computers.