staff car park at man
Guest
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What REALLY annoys me, (as mentioned earlier in the thread), are the problems concerning FTL. Unfortunately for us, this is calculated approx. one hour from 'chocks off' and does NOT take into consideration the time it takes an individual to return home.
If our car parks become satelite ones, God knows how long it will take some people to get home; currently, the buses only run every 12 - 15 minutes or so - are they planning to stick to this system if we move? or will buses run every 5 minutes? Even if they do, it will still add hours to the average day.
Crew on minimum rest could easily find themselves knackered; safety WILL be compromised - but who will get the blame?
My suggestion, should this idiotic idea go ahead, is an increase to minimum hours rest for crew. After all, would YOU like to be a passenger on an aircraft whose crew are likely to make errors of judgement, (or even fall asleep!), simply because they all have to endure extra time put onto an already demanding day?
Think on, Manchester.....
If our car parks become satelite ones, God knows how long it will take some people to get home; currently, the buses only run every 12 - 15 minutes or so - are they planning to stick to this system if we move? or will buses run every 5 minutes? Even if they do, it will still add hours to the average day.
Crew on minimum rest could easily find themselves knackered; safety WILL be compromised - but who will get the blame?
My suggestion, should this idiotic idea go ahead, is an increase to minimum hours rest for crew. After all, would YOU like to be a passenger on an aircraft whose crew are likely to make errors of judgement, (or even fall asleep!), simply because they all have to endure extra time put onto an already demanding day?
Think on, Manchester.....
Guest
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Unfortunately nothing will be done to prevent the ever increasing transport times from the staff car parks at most major airports to your place of work until there is a major flight safety incident or road traffic accident where lack of rest / fatigue caused by travel times is a factor.
I'm still amazed that the CAA is happy for crews to spend upto 90 minutes of a 11 hour min rest period traveling to and from the staff car parks(LGW), and then have to travel to and from home.Have the CAA ever discussed the subject? If not why not!
An article in one of the major national newspapers might get some action.
[This message has been edited by poohbear (edited 26 May 2001).]
I'm still amazed that the CAA is happy for crews to spend upto 90 minutes of a 11 hour min rest period traveling to and from the staff car parks(LGW), and then have to travel to and from home.Have the CAA ever discussed the subject? If not why not!
An article in one of the major national newspapers might get some action.
[This message has been edited by poohbear (edited 26 May 2001).]
Guest
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Following a 'discussion' on Friday representatives from the three largest handling companies contacted the GMB and the TGWU.The main problem is that our employers are 'piggie in the middle' here.They pay the MAPlc for us to use the staff car parks.Any 'action' taken will affect them and then we could end up paying to park on even worse rubble in Warrington.
If this situation is to improve,more people need to know about the rumblings and they will then jump on the bandwagon.
Start to file MOR's and write to your Station Manager,Fleet Manager and BALPA/union.
MAPlc basically treat us as a hinderance.If we sit back and do nothing then they are going to walk all over us and nothing will be improved.
If this situation is to improve,more people need to know about the rumblings and they will then jump on the bandwagon.
Start to file MOR's and write to your Station Manager,Fleet Manager and BALPA/union.
MAPlc basically treat us as a hinderance.If we sit back and do nothing then they are going to walk all over us and nothing will be improved.
Guest
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Those of you who have been to IKEA Warrington recently may have noticed the new Wythenshawe Municipal Airport Staff car park being prepared to the west on part of the old Burtonwood Aerodrome.
I believe that those of you with post codes east of Manchester will find a satellite car park being excavated somewhere in the moors on the Yorkshire-Derbyshire borders.
Dontcha just lurve a good rumour.
I believe that those of you with post codes east of Manchester will find a satellite car park being excavated somewhere in the moors on the Yorkshire-Derbyshire borders.
Dontcha just lurve a good rumour.
Guest
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411A
Get a life, my sweet.... you remind me of the Grim Reaper prowling around cyber space, with nothing of any interest to report, just wandering aimlessly.
This is the one and only time I will deam it worthwhile to respond to or acknowledge you, so reply as you see fit
ariel
Get a life, my sweet.... you remind me of the Grim Reaper prowling around cyber space, with nothing of any interest to report, just wandering aimlessly.
This is the one and only time I will deam it worthwhile to respond to or acknowledge you, so reply as you see fit
ariel
Guest
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Whiskey Zulu----
All the more reason to take a taxi, limo, public transportation....to the airport. Land around airports is very valuable so staff carparks are a low priority, at any price, and this is not likely to change anytime soon. What parking there is available is reserved for the paying customer, the passengers. Is public transportation inconvenient or not available at late hours? Of course, and again all the more reason for a private limo service to invest in transport for crew and staff. All it takes is a little imagination. There is a huge market just waiting to be developed.
All the more reason to take a taxi, limo, public transportation....to the airport. Land around airports is very valuable so staff carparks are a low priority, at any price, and this is not likely to change anytime soon. What parking there is available is reserved for the paying customer, the passengers. Is public transportation inconvenient or not available at late hours? Of course, and again all the more reason for a private limo service to invest in transport for crew and staff. All it takes is a little imagination. There is a huge market just waiting to be developed.
Guest
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What's the problem? I don't know of any major airport that doesn't have "remote" staff parking. If our employee parking (YYZ) was any further east we would be parking in Dorval or Mirabel. At least we have a decent shuttle bus service, but never the less it can add 30 minutes to your working day.
Guest
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Of course, "pilots" want:
1.Parking close to dispatch
2.Low parking prices for their Beemers and
Jags
3.Snob appeal (for those same Beemers & Jags)
These same "pilots" would not think of using taxi, limo because they would "cost too much" and they want the public airport authorities to provide "reasonably priced" car parks for these (again) Beemers & Jags. Hey guys, think you will not find that rate payers will support your lifestyle. Money talks, BS walks.
1.Parking close to dispatch
2.Low parking prices for their Beemers and
Jags
3.Snob appeal (for those same Beemers & Jags)
These same "pilots" would not think of using taxi, limo because they would "cost too much" and they want the public airport authorities to provide "reasonably priced" car parks for these (again) Beemers & Jags. Hey guys, think you will not find that rate payers will support your lifestyle. Money talks, BS walks.
Guest
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I suggest we just ignore 411A he is obviously a simple jerk who gets a kick out of winding people up.
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The MAN parking problem is now bordering on becoming a major issue in terms of Flight Time Limitations. The operators will have to become involved, preferably sooner than later.
Aircrews (not just pilots) many of whom are required to operate on minimum rest cannot be expected to add all that aditional commuting time and not have it taken into account their duty time.
Long haul crews could be effected worst.
However take the following for example a crew reporting for an 0500z departure. Report time 0345z (at the crew room). Take into account the drive to the 'satellite' car park, waiting for a bus (say 20 mins.) ride to airport (20 minutes) drop off at each terminal (at least 15 mins) - there is the best part of an hour before reporting. Then complete a 14 hour duty day - say MAN-LCA-MAN (or worse), get back to MAN and reverse the commuting process. We are now talking about an 18 hour day. Flight Safety issue undoubtedly._
I think it is time that everyone started filing MOR's, ASR's, Chirps and writing to their respective employers.
Every available avenue should be explored before taking any form of direct action.
Personally I would like to see a 'sit-in' on all the approach roads to the airport at peak times - hindering access to all, and hopefully Mr Muirhead and his cronies. That would have the effect of drawing attention to the issue very quickly.
The sad reality is that like every other issue in this country that people get steamed up about, there is lots of hot air but when an opportunity arises to do something positive people just cave in - like the petrol price protests last year. Maybe this is an opportunity to show what Northerners are really made of!
So let's do something positive.
_____________________________________
The MAN parking problem is now bordering on becoming a major issue in terms of Flight Time Limitations. The operators will have to become involved, preferably sooner than later.
Aircrews (not just pilots) many of whom are required to operate on minimum rest cannot be expected to add all that aditional commuting time and not have it taken into account their duty time.
Long haul crews could be effected worst.
However take the following for example a crew reporting for an 0500z departure. Report time 0345z (at the crew room). Take into account the drive to the 'satellite' car park, waiting for a bus (say 20 mins.) ride to airport (20 minutes) drop off at each terminal (at least 15 mins) - there is the best part of an hour before reporting. Then complete a 14 hour duty day - say MAN-LCA-MAN (or worse), get back to MAN and reverse the commuting process. We are now talking about an 18 hour day. Flight Safety issue undoubtedly._
I think it is time that everyone started filing MOR's, ASR's, Chirps and writing to their respective employers.
Every available avenue should be explored before taking any form of direct action.
Personally I would like to see a 'sit-in' on all the approach roads to the airport at peak times - hindering access to all, and hopefully Mr Muirhead and his cronies. That would have the effect of drawing attention to the issue very quickly.
The sad reality is that like every other issue in this country that people get steamed up about, there is lots of hot air but when an opportunity arises to do something positive people just cave in - like the petrol price protests last year. Maybe this is an opportunity to show what Northerners are really made of!
So let's do something positive.
Guest
Posts: n/a
At LHR, Bmi Crews have an adjustment for minimum rest + parking + getting to / from work. I think their min rest is 13 hrs.
I was at MAN the other day and parking at long stay next to the Excelsior. I was given a chit and told to park in short stay @ the terminal. Didnt make sense at the time as had to park on top floor due lack of spaces
I was at MAN the other day and parking at long stay next to the Excelsior. I was given a chit and told to park in short stay @ the terminal. Didnt make sense at the time as had to park on top floor due lack of spaces
Guest
Posts: n/a
411A - Beemers and Jags' ?? Is that cause you drive around in a ( whats the U.K version of a Ford ? ) one of them !. ( Bad english I know ).
These gentlemen here are trying to sort out a sour issue with airport management , yet your contribution keeps on delaying the real message they are trying to convey.
Stir up some where else.
These gentlemen here are trying to sort out a sour issue with airport management , yet your contribution keeps on delaying the real message they are trying to convey.
Stir up some where else.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Have the airlines/companies affected investigated the possibility of a joint purchase of some land in the vicinity and operating a bus shuttle from there?Expensive I know, but the long term costs of paying for premium spaces in the airport car parks must more or less equate to this.
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It wasn't me.
Guest
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Things do seem to be pretty unreasonable oop there in clogs and whippets land. It seems that the mentality of 't Victorian mill owner is still alive and kicking and keen to run roughshod over the workforce. If you can't get to work in a reasonable time frame, then perhaps some contract requiring you to live within a radius of 'x' miles from the designated staff car park should apply - and that your CDT starts and stops from the time you 'clock in' to the car park until the time you 'clock out' from it. Perhaps that might encourage 't mis-management to provide a car park reasonably close - or lose your effective duty time.
Guest
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Hey Slugman...i live next to the tip..still wont get in on time...
And Beagle...yes the MAN PLC is just plain money orientated,they dont give a monkeys as to how the money at there little aerodrome is made...as long as they are making it.
And until such times as something major happens,due to staff car-parking being miles away,they wont do anything to change it.
Acceptable daily risk.
And Beagle...yes the MAN PLC is just plain money orientated,they dont give a monkeys as to how the money at there little aerodrome is made...as long as they are making it.
And until such times as something major happens,due to staff car-parking being miles away,they wont do anything to change it.
Acceptable daily risk.
Guest
Posts: n/a
Spoonbill has the right idea, land purchased by airline(s), reliable transportation provided by someone who knows how to do it right (BillTheCoach, for example)and viola...problem solved. It might be of interest that most airlines in the USA provide their own shuttle busses to and from their own staff parking lots at their home base. If you wait for the airport to provide same, it will be a LONG time and cost large coin.
Wake up guys (and gals) and DO something.
Wake up guys (and gals) and DO something.