Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

757 with 307pax gear collapse?

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

757 with 307pax gear collapse?

Old 4th Dec 2008, 19:25
  #41 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: Alpharetta, GA
Age: 64
Posts: 37
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
It was LY-SKJ of Aurelia .. a 2000-model -23N, ex- VIM and ATA.
LN-MOW is offline  
Old 4th Dec 2008, 19:45
  #42 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Riga
Posts: 244
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Does anyone know what type of lease this AC was on? I am guessing (hoping) it was not ACMI.

Aurela's denial of involvment along with the aledged overload authorisation coming from Cameroon would seem to indicate that the Lithuanians are not directly involved.

In my experience from working in this neck of the woods, standards have been raised to a level where I would not expect any LV commander to accept an overloaded AC. I have seen nothing to indicate the Lithuanians to be too different.

RIX
Romeo India Xray is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 06:33
  #43 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Lithuania
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I don't think it was LY-SKJ. This plane returned to Vilnius few days ago and seems to be in good condition.
Local Lithuanian media picked up this story from jacdec.de and avherald.com few days ago. Aurela denies any involvement. Lithuanian CAA said they can not confirm or deny this incident as they have no information about it.

Also, I see that both sources (Jacdec.de and Avherald.com) which earlier this week said about LY-SKJ involvement in incident, recently removed the registration and operator from incident description.

I am also curious what really happened in Cameroon and what airplane was involved? Or maybe nothing serious happened and all this story was blowed out of proportion by various media sources?
Asdrius is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 07:06
  #44 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Horley
Age: 54
Posts: 13
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
For the record

To clear up any doubt on this matter.

As i was invloved with leasing the European B757s in the first phase of the hajj. I can confirm that Air Finland, Aurela and Gadair were not in Cameroon flying for Air Niamey.

These airlines would never exceed their legal payloads.

My contact at Air Niamey tells me the aircraft was a Tri-star.

If that is the case any onions out there will be able to track the aircraft/operator down fairly quickly as there are not so many tri-stars left.
Travelman34 is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 09:37
  #45 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 1999
Location: London
Posts: 85
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Now we are getting somewhere.

Anyone know who's Tri Star?
Onions is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 09:47
  #46 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: LPPT
Age: 58
Posts: 431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
calling 411A...
GearDown&Locked is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 09:50
  #47 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Geneva, Switzerland
Age: 58
Posts: 1,904
Received 3 Likes on 3 Posts
calling 411A...
ROFL

That being said there is a small difference between a 757 and a Tristar... this story gets juicer by the day.
atakacs is offline  
Old 5th Dec 2008, 10:20
  #48 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Location: PBI
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Privilege Jet
OldCessna is offline  
Old 6th Dec 2008, 09:19
  #49 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Privilege Jet
Yup, a sad tale.
Idiot Captain rejected at 133KIAS for a very minor number one engine surge (easily controlled by reducing slightly the throttle briefly) and stopped.
Six tires needed replacing, as well as two brake assemblies.
In doing the necessary, acft slipped off the jack and damaged the landing gear truck assembly.
Latest news is a temp repair is anticipated and the acft ferried for major repair/replacement of the landing gear assembly.
Read...expensive.
Meanwhile, another TriStar carrier is picking up the business....lots of it.
411A is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 12:57
  #50 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Dunstable, Beds UK
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
You have got to hand it to 411

The thread starts not knowing if the aircraft is a 757 or L1011
If it is Lithuanian or African

Then 411 tells us that it was an L1011 and it aborted take off with a " slight surge" that could have been solved by just reducing power and at 133 KIAS
Not around 130 or around 135 BUT 133 KIAS
I would have thought should details could have only come from the flight crew


Latest news is a temp repair is anticipated and the acft ferried for major repair/replacement of the landing gear assembly.

There was never any intention to ferry !!
The replacment landing gear, jacks and people was on a cargo aircraft bound for Cameroons before your post was sent
GotTheTshirt is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 13:12
  #51 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I would have thought should details could have only come from the flight crew
Yup, sure did, after a brief interview, on site.
Info passed along by those in the know.

Not mentioned, of course, are the problems (now) with the suspect engine.
Local maintenance had their oar in the muddy waters after the fact, so ferry might be apt considering the present engine state.
These folks will find out in short order that you cannot maintain an RB.211 with just a screwdriver and a hammer.
Connie Kalitta found out, in short order, some years ago.
A very expensive lesson.
411A is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 15:39
  #52 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Feb 2001
Location: Europe
Posts: 1,109
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
411A,

These folks will find out in short order that you cannot maintain an RB.211 with just a screwdriver and a hammer.
.... but you can fly RB211 with major AD overdue, just because some African CAA gave a dispensation for it?
CargoOne is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 16:25
  #53 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I think the engine A/D is just overdue on the 522 engines.
But its was supposed to be accomplished by AUG 2006.
No alternate method of compliance has been done to many of these 522 engines, not sure if they even have one that was done correctly according to RR and the manufacturer.
-500's flying with the RR 524 are ok.
Maybe some ground engineering types can provide some good updated info.
I seen this Privelage Jet Tristar last year in JED,I think it was a -500, but memory declines with the age I guess.

Last edited by Earl; 7th Dec 2008 at 16:36.
Earl is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 16:36
  #54 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
-500's flying with the RR 524 are ok.
AD's on these due now, and for about two years.
-524B4's and D4's.
but you can fly RB211 with major AD overdue, just because some African CAA gave a dispensation for it?
Yup, in complete conformity with RR.
However, ongoing repetitive inspections are required (and accomplished).
411A is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 16:51
  #55 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Its very rare for these RR engines to surge or stall, maybe with a tailwind or not coming out of full reverse before 80 kts.
But reducing the throttle will stop this as 411 stated.
Not as good as a G/E engine but much better than a Pratt.
Lockheed made a good choice for this airplane with the RR engines.
Happy Haj flying for phase II.
Not in it this year but do enjoy the stories.
Earl is offline  
Old 7th Dec 2008, 21:37
  #56 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2001
Location: Dunstable, Beds UK
Posts: 545
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
411 strikes again

The 524-B4 ( Tristar -500) axial motion AD was due by Aug 2008.

The axial motion AD is NOT APPLICABLE to 524-D4 ( B747)

But I guess if you are on registers that do not follow AD's then the details are not that important!!

Isnt it amazing that FAA and EASA do not accept this Rolls Royce "dispensation leter"
GotTheTshirt is offline  
Old 8th Dec 2008, 03:22
  #57 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: UTC +8
Posts: 2,626
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Abort at 133KTs normally wouldn't be a cause for six tires and 2 brake assemblies to be trashed; the captain must have gotten spooked and stomped on the brake pedals long before the end of the pavement.
GlueBall is offline  
Old 8th Dec 2008, 09:42
  #58 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
...the captain must have gotten spooked and stomped on the brake pedals long before the end of the pavement.
Yup.
Quite long runway, no need for this nonsense.

Isnt it amazing that FAA and EASA do not accept this Rolls Royce "dispensation leter"
Don't fly to either place, so don't care.
Simple as that.
411A is offline  
Old 8th Dec 2008, 11:32
  #59 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: lancs.UK
Age: 77
Posts: 1,191
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
I'm baffled by the stories of gross overloading on these HaJJ flights

3-rd world countries may well have a much more relaxed attitude to life and health ,than Westerners........but I have to question the professionalism of the Pilot-respondents on this Thread whoadmit to having knowingly flown a grossly overweight aircraft.

yes, I can accept "cramming them in"....even loading to known safe limits
but compromising your own safety,by going to the edge of the performance envelope, seems, at the least, foolhardy.

(plenty of "gung -ho" actions in wartime,as well,-but this isn't wartime, either.

*awaits incoming, dons flame-suit*
cockney steve is offline  
Old 8th Dec 2008, 11:45
  #60 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
...but I have to question the professionalism of the Pilot-respondents on this Thread whoadmit to having knowingly flown a grossly overweight aircraft
Which ones would that be?
Didn't especially notice any, but then again, might have missed one.
Personally been flying the Hajj flights for quite a long time with L1011 aircraft (nearly all models) and have never found the need to fly overweight.
If the specific flight segment is limiting due to the required fuel uplift requirements, we simply use a technical stop for refueling.
Simple as that.
Besides, the Saudi GACA regularly inspect aircraft, including loadsheets, and have found no irregulatities at our end.

Certainly can't say about other operators, however.

Me thinks you might have duff gen.
411A is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.