Ground Collision At London City This Morning.
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I have to say I agree with 'slip and turn'. I don't recall any arrival or departure procedures that requires the tail to move into the SW corner of the box. (Never mind beyond it!)
Which is why I am trying to think of other scenarios.
Though of course, as professionals, we should just sit tight for the official report!
Which is why I am trying to think of other scenarios.
Though of course, as professionals, we should just sit tight for the official report!
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Though of course, as professionals, we should just sit tight for the official report
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Oh OK!
In an attempt to 'catch up'!
My utterly unsubstantiated theory, and with the luxury of total ignorance (and only because nobody was injured!) is this:
Lufty was taxiing onto stand. Used a touch too much right brake, and not enough left. This means the nosewheel steering comes off the rack, and no longer functions, with the wheel at more than 70' off centre.
If the taxi speed was slightly higher than normal, the aircraft could easily end up in this position before coming to a halt.
Just unlucky for them, they were on the tightest stand!
It's a 'theory'!
In an attempt to 'catch up'!
My utterly unsubstantiated theory, and with the luxury of total ignorance (and only because nobody was injured!) is this:
Lufty was taxiing onto stand. Used a touch too much right brake, and not enough left. This means the nosewheel steering comes off the rack, and no longer functions, with the wheel at more than 70' off centre.
If the taxi speed was slightly higher than normal, the aircraft could easily end up in this position before coming to a halt.
Just unlucky for them, they were on the tightest stand!
It's a 'theory'!
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Do airfield ops do the stand planning at city? Not ATC??
Even so, neither of these departments sell slots. Pretty much seems LCY is too busy and have to do things like this?
And stand 11 for a F50? If you can't park an RJ with a much shorter wingspan, then 50s defiantly out of the picture!
And what is with people picking on peoples wording and knowledge of EGLCs ground layout, if the people picking are so clued up, then perhaps they could answer our questions to ask....
...How did this happen?
Even so, neither of these departments sell slots. Pretty much seems LCY is too busy and have to do things like this?
And stand 11 for a F50? If you can't park an RJ with a much shorter wingspan, then 50s defiantly out of the picture!
And what is with people picking on peoples wording and knowledge of EGLCs ground layout, if the people picking are so clued up, then perhaps they could answer our questions to ask....
...How did this happen?
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... Tandemrotor, like it, as a theory 
But a steering fault is one thing but the brakes still work, don't they? The marshallers should have crossed the wands long long long before while it was still facing the terminal building at some abortive angle.
Oh well ... easily said with hindsight I guess ... I do hope there WAS a marshaller for the first bit ... I recall seeing them running down the apron after leaving a different job trying to get to stands before the aircraft came on at peak periods ... sometimes the corner marshaller came from the other end of the apron and got there first
... then there'd be a mad moment as they held their radio mikes close jabbered something, agreed a swap and No 1 carried on running while his mate (or hers! - yep girlies with brown knees in the summer!) did the 'bring it on' bit.Here you go, many of us have seen this one before but this gives you the gist of how it worked when it was at around 50% of the current pax throughput maybe 5 or more years ago I think
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hY5TueMRq0k
Hope the youtube link is allowed? But I think this video is fairly public domain deliberately 'cos it was obviously shot from the control tower...
Last edited by slip and turn; 23rd Apr 2008 at 19:48.
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Fact; The Cityflyer a/c was parked on stand with no pax on board not moving. The LH aircraft was attempting to move off stand to depart with pax on board. Belief; the LH aircraft had been pushed back on to stand because the inbound skipper was unhappy about the clearance , it apparently wasn't quite in the right position so in taxing off the stand in an attempt to get onto the taxi-off line a tight turn was needed which mean't the tail swinging across into the other aircraft.
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Yeah I am sure you are right TR, the look of concentration on some of the crews faces in that turn and the way their heads went on stalks showed how interesting it gets...
Meantime, I knew there was a topical Youtube video of how much fun the ground teams have at LCY...
Please mods don't delete this link too quickly, it just makes me smile this one ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OCfe6D7efQ
Told you they all have fun, didn't I?
Meantime, I knew there was a topical Youtube video of how much fun the ground teams have at LCY...
Please mods don't delete this link too quickly, it just makes me smile this one ...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OCfe6D7efQ
Told you they all have fun, didn't I?
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LCY makes a huge amount of money and is very popular with lots of people who know very little about aviation.
Therefore, the odd extra scrape is entirely 'deductible' in their terms.
50 posts - I think - (51 counting mine) and not a single band-aid applied to a slight cut...
The most important safety factor in aviation is, without doubt, the good old yankee dollar, whether it's spent and accounted in sterling, euros, yen, Vietnamese Dong, or whatever you state is your currency of choice.
Therefore, the odd extra scrape is entirely 'deductible' in their terms.
50 posts - I think - (51 counting mine) and not a single band-aid applied to a slight cut...
The most important safety factor in aviation is, without doubt, the good old yankee dollar, whether it's spent and accounted in sterling, euros, yen, Vietnamese Dong, or whatever you state is your currency of choice.
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I think you are probably right frontleft, and therefore should we be bothered about this one if anyone did get hurt well it'd only be some toff(s) who'd be instantly forgotten or some aviation peeps who thoroughly enjoyed their aircraft carrier job?
Safety ... it's nothing more than a transient state of mind really, kind of laid over an agreed framework of rules if you're lucky, but as you say, prone to all kinds of value judgements from people who know the price of everything.
Safety ... it's nothing more than a transient state of mind really, kind of laid over an agreed framework of rules if you're lucky, but as you say, prone to all kinds of value judgements from people who know the price of everything.
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Parking and taxing at LCY is a pain in the arse. I am surprised there are not more ground incidents! It will be interesting to see how tight they park the BA A318 when it starts flying in next year!
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Yes that's a point - if I've looked it up correctly (Spitoon will check for me) the A318 wingspan is five metres more than even the F50 
Maybe they'll moor the barge permanently somewhere east of Stand 1 and use that?
) the A318 wingspan is five metres more than even the F50 Maybe they'll moor the barge permanently somewhere east of Stand 1 and use that?
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I'm pretty sure the A318 can't operate out of LCY until the new stands are built, to the East of stand 1.
Landings and take offs are one thing. Keeping it there on the ground whilst the airport is open is another matter!
There are issues other than simple wing tip clearance in the parking areas.
That is of course if the A318 ever operates out of LCY!
Landings and take offs are one thing. Keeping it there on the ground whilst the airport is open is another matter!
There are issues other than simple wing tip clearance in the parking areas.
That is of course if the A318 ever operates out of LCY!
Last edited by Tandemrotor; 24th Apr 2008 at 18:13.
