View Poll Results: Should the pilots of the hijacked a/c be criticised for disabling it by abandoning it
I AM a professional pilot and they SHOULD NOT be criticised
430
55.70%
I AM a professional pilot and they SHOULD be criticised
31
4.02%
I AM NOT a professional pilot and they SHOULD NOT be criticised
279
36.14%
I AM NOT an professional pilot ad they SHOULD be criticised
16
2.07%
I have no opinion one way or another
16
2.07%
Voters: 772. This poll is closed
Atlas Jet Hijack
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
take the one for the start switches, fuel pumps or the electrics panel with you. It won't take you one minute to take them out, since the connectors on the back are usually cannon plug types and I doubt you'll get the engines started or the plane moving without boost pumps,..
By the way, something which looks like a screwdriver will probably be confiscated before you get on the aircraft
I think pilots should be looking for quick, practical ways of disabling an aircraft. Snapping off ignition CB's.. pah... Most aircraft have 3 sets of breakers? (Sys 1/2 and Standby). CB's will break when you don't want them to... Good luck intentionally snapping them off.
Physically lock the cockpit door and jump out the window (hatch). This will give you enough time to disable the aircraft from the outside (as someone has already suggested).
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: CGN, EDDK
Posts: 91
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
You've never heard of gravity/suction feed? I'm sure I wouldn't be the first or the last person to successfully start up an engine after forgetting to turn on the boost pumps. Also, the last time I had to remove an overhead panel, the wiring was so tight I had to pull out several panels... and use cannon plug pliers...but maybe an MD11 is different from other aircraft?
Concerning the bayonett type cannon plugs now in use on most aircraft, maybe I have stronger hands than you, but except for the smallest ones, where I can't get a proper grip, I can usually disconnect them without pliers.
By the way, something which looks like a screwdriver will probably be confiscated before you get on the aircraft
I think pilots should be looking for quick, practical ways of disabling an aircraft. Snapping off ignition CB's.. pah... Most aircraft have 3 sets of breakers? (Sys 1/2 and Standby). CB's will break when you don't want them to... Good luck intentionally snapping them off.
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
no electricity to move valve actuators etc..
I think the key word here is "subtlety"... It helps when you don't want to get shot at/blown up, etc.
They want to get out in a hurry, without creating lots of loud noises, without changing the state of the aircraft (packs shutting down, cabin lights turning off,...). Do you really want the hijackers to think a SWAT team is about to storm the cabin?
Warning Toxic!
Disgusted of Tunbridge
Disgusted of Tunbridge
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Hampshire, UK
Posts: 4,011
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Reality time folks! In a hijack, do you really think you have time to decide what you are going to do? Start removing panels and unplugging things? Think: Why? The fact is- an opportunity presents itself- you immediately go headlong through the door/window, whatever- get your ass out like lightning? Why are we talking about disabling the aeroplane? YOU have no requirement to do that. Just get yourself out- with no pilots it's difficult to move. Leave it to the authorities. IF they want the aeroplane disabled, they can put large chocks on, or stick a pice of wood into the fan blades to stop the engines being started, or disconnect ignition leads on the engines in the dark.
I have spoken to several pilot hijack victims. Far from being cool headed- you are in imminent terror of a grenade being exploded even accidently because the hijacker is so hysterical. Can you imagine if he discovers you 'doing something'. You will not only be killed, but may precipitate a bad situation that could escalate rapidly when nobody is ready. Lock yourself in the flight deck? Be ready for executions outside the door- you will escalate the temperature when what is needed is to relax things and give the authorities time to get organised. Just get yourself out if the opportunity presents itself, and please, no more ideas about damaging your own aeroplane!
I have spoken to several pilot hijack victims. Far from being cool headed- you are in imminent terror of a grenade being exploded even accidently because the hijacker is so hysterical. Can you imagine if he discovers you 'doing something'. You will not only be killed, but may precipitate a bad situation that could escalate rapidly when nobody is ready. Lock yourself in the flight deck? Be ready for executions outside the door- you will escalate the temperature when what is needed is to relax things and give the authorities time to get organised. Just get yourself out if the opportunity presents itself, and please, no more ideas about damaging your own aeroplane!
Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,307
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Our planes have a manual lockbolt in the flight deck additional to the electric lock.
"Physically lock the cockpit door"
IMHO, I think Rainboe's response hits the nail on the head.
Cheers.
NSEU
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: USA
Posts: 844
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
In a way I have a few regrets posting this mess about the pilots jumping ship.
Then as a joke I placed the idea about ripping the fire handles out.
Seems that I opened a can of worms here, that was never my intention.
Some of these replies are way out there.
Destroying an aircraft to prevent it from being flown is not the way.
The ground handlers can do many things to prevent the aircraft from being moved as previously mentioned.
Lets all hope that if or should it happen again we all take the correct action.
Then as a joke I placed the idea about ripping the fire handles out.
Seems that I opened a can of worms here, that was never my intention.
Some of these replies are way out there.
Destroying an aircraft to prevent it from being flown is not the way.
The ground handlers can do many things to prevent the aircraft from being moved as previously mentioned.
Lets all hope that if or should it happen again we all take the correct action.
Last edited by Earl; 4th Sep 2007 at 03:09.
The Reverend
Join Date: Oct 1999
Location: Sydney,NSW,Australia
Posts: 2,020
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Earl, I think it's best to punctuate your jokes with a smilie. Otherwise people will think you are serious.
Last edited by HotDog; 4th Sep 2007 at 08:17.
Hardly Never Not Unwilling
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: USA
Posts: 481
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Destroying an aircraft to prevent it from being flown is not the way
I still think quickly preventing the aircraft from operating before trying to escape is the right strategy, subject to ascertaining the actual, rather than hypothetical, situation and using some of the judgment we're paid to possess.
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: England
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This business of people saying the pilots should have stayed with the aircraft, reminds me of captains of ships being obligated (by their company and by the public at large) to go down with their foundering vessel.
Why was this the case with ships? As a punishment for failure in their duties? Because of some misguided notion of honour?
Such an attitude is outdated and pointless. People might want the comfort of knowing that someone of authority - the flight crew - is there, (Ah - maybe that's the real underlying reason why captains went down with their ship?). But the average pilot isn't a trained negotiator. He or she brings only one skill to the table - flying the aircraft somewhere. And that's exactly what needed preventing here.
Even if these guys were terrified (and I have no doubt they weren't in their comfort zone) and even if they were only thinking of their own backsides, I believe the right choice was made by removing themselves from the equation.
EDIT:
Disclaimer: It should be obvious from my post that I'm not a professional pilot. Which is to say that do I fly, but I don't get paid for it.
Why was this the case with ships? As a punishment for failure in their duties? Because of some misguided notion of honour?
Such an attitude is outdated and pointless. People might want the comfort of knowing that someone of authority - the flight crew - is there, (Ah - maybe that's the real underlying reason why captains went down with their ship?). But the average pilot isn't a trained negotiator. He or she brings only one skill to the table - flying the aircraft somewhere. And that's exactly what needed preventing here.
Even if these guys were terrified (and I have no doubt they weren't in their comfort zone) and even if they were only thinking of their own backsides, I believe the right choice was made by removing themselves from the equation.
EDIT:
Disclaimer: It should be obvious from my post that I'm not a professional pilot. Which is to say that do I fly, but I don't get paid for it.
CJP-MK:
More likely because a ship's Captain is responsible for his passengers, his crew, his ship and his cargo and as such felt obliged to ensure that their safety and well being came first. Sometimes time ran out.
Per
This business of people saying the pilots should have stayed with the aircraft, reminds me of captains of ships being obligated (by their company and by the public at large) to go down with their foundering vessel.
Why was this the case with ships? As a punishment for failure in their duties? Because of some misguided notion of honour?
Why was this the case with ships? As a punishment for failure in their duties? Because of some misguided notion of honour?
Per
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: England
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
More likely because a ship's Captain is responsible for his passengers, his crew, his ship and his cargo and as such felt obliged to ensure that their safety and well being came first. Sometimes time ran out.
While what you said is ultimately true of a pilot also, I wonder whether the negative attitude toward these two pilots might come from commenters having a ship's captain in mind, and thinking that they were abandoning their duty, (the safety of their passengers), when actually they improved the situation by not being part of it anymore.
