NJI is reborn
Join Date: Apr 1999
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Well chaps as one who has just returned to the UK with ones life in the back of ones car I can safely say MR. Eclipse will not remain in business unless he coughs up the dosh he owes everyone. I am sure he has done very nicely out of it! And despite some of you gloating as to the fact we took a risk for good money, which was only true of a very small number, most moved there lives to live in Sicily, Rome, Milan and Athens and which everway you look at it, it will take some a long time to recover. We put everything into that company !!! 
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Guys,
would like to enlighten you about the "un sacco di soldi" thing or exceptionnally good salaries at NJI.
You have all been fooled because if it's true that you were making a great net income it's also true that you had no social security, no pension scheme,no union backing and so on...i can positively assure you that any Alitalia,Air One, Meridiana, Azzurra or Alpi Eagles pilot flying an average of 60 hours a month makes more money that you were making at NJI; that is comparing your net with their gross of course; in some cases (and not even that rare) they are making more than you were even if you look at the net take home.
This is to say that in the end NJI has probably even paid you less than the other italian counterparts that have to pay the "fondo volo", the "cassa marittima", the "irpef", the "inps" and so on to their pilots.
As per the "permesso di soggiorno" we all know that most of the NJI pilots were in Italy (and Europe) illegally...but this is another story.
would like to enlighten you about the "un sacco di soldi" thing or exceptionnally good salaries at NJI.
You have all been fooled because if it's true that you were making a great net income it's also true that you had no social security, no pension scheme,no union backing and so on...i can positively assure you that any Alitalia,Air One, Meridiana, Azzurra or Alpi Eagles pilot flying an average of 60 hours a month makes more money that you were making at NJI; that is comparing your net with their gross of course; in some cases (and not even that rare) they are making more than you were even if you look at the net take home.
This is to say that in the end NJI has probably even paid you less than the other italian counterparts that have to pay the "fondo volo", the "cassa marittima", the "irpef", the "inps" and so on to their pilots.
As per the "permesso di soggiorno" we all know that most of the NJI pilots were in Italy (and Europe) illegally...but this is another story.
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TF, You said:
'...we all know that most of the NJI pilots were in Italy (and Europe) illegally...but this is another story.'
Do you realise that 'most' means more than half? If so then who told you that because you're badly informed.
Oh - and 'un sacco di soldi' had little reference to the gross or net pay that we received but a lot to do with three months pay owing - no matter what the monthly pay was it's one quater of our yearly earnings.
Also you said: '...it's also true that you had no social security...'
Well actually - no - thats not true.
'...we all know that most of the NJI pilots were in Italy (and Europe) illegally...but this is another story.'
Do you realise that 'most' means more than half? If so then who told you that because you're badly informed.
Oh - and 'un sacco di soldi' had little reference to the gross or net pay that we received but a lot to do with three months pay owing - no matter what the monthly pay was it's one quater of our yearly earnings.
Also you said: '...it's also true that you had no social security...'
Well actually - no - thats not true.
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Guys,
i don't want to argue with you and i understand your difficult situation and the fact that each of us has to protect their own interests...but you have to be sincere at least on this anonimous forum.
I have first hand and very precise information on NJI, i even have copies of the Panasia and Eclipse contracts apart from knowing a few former NJI pilots.
Maybe not half of the pilots but a considerable number of them didn't have the right to live and work in the EU, what you call "social security" came later in the operation and only for those who were on the Eclipse contract which was illegal anyway because the EU law states clearly that one should pay taxes in the EU country where they phisically reside for more than 180 days/year and anyways how many of you were residing in Luxembourg anyway?None.
Afterall if the trick was so easy then all of the belgian aviation industry could have turned to Luxembourg contracts to avoid their taxation system isn't it?
i don't want to argue with you and i understand your difficult situation and the fact that each of us has to protect their own interests...but you have to be sincere at least on this anonimous forum.
I have first hand and very precise information on NJI, i even have copies of the Panasia and Eclipse contracts apart from knowing a few former NJI pilots.
Maybe not half of the pilots but a considerable number of them didn't have the right to live and work in the EU, what you call "social security" came later in the operation and only for those who were on the Eclipse contract which was illegal anyway because the EU law states clearly that one should pay taxes in the EU country where they phisically reside for more than 180 days/year and anyways how many of you were residing in Luxembourg anyway?None.
Afterall if the trick was so easy then all of the belgian aviation industry could have turned to Luxembourg contracts to avoid their taxation system isn't it?
Join Date: Aug 2001
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TF,
You DO want to argue, you DON'T know how difficult the situation is.
Whether we on a billion dollars a year or not is totally irrelevant. Whether we paid union dues or not, is irrelevant, whether we paid pension fees or not is irrelevant. Whether you like us or not and whether you like out contract or not is also bloody irrelevant.
what is RELEVANT, is that we have not been paid for work we did. Now the company has been shut down, BWA are waltzing down and ignoring the fact that we worked here at all.
Good day to you. :o
You DO want to argue, you DON'T know how difficult the situation is.
Whether we on a billion dollars a year or not is totally irrelevant. Whether we paid union dues or not, is irrelevant, whether we paid pension fees or not is irrelevant. Whether you like us or not and whether you like out contract or not is also bloody irrelevant.
what is RELEVANT, is that we have not been paid for work we did. Now the company has been shut down, BWA are waltzing down and ignoring the fact that we worked here at all.
Good day to you. :o
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Jumbolino,
I understand that you are mad because your previous employer did not honour your contract. But I suggest you read Hamrah`s postings on this thread over again. I have, and I read that BWA have no commmitments towards previous NJI employees. Again, you and your fellow workers have at least my sympathy, but you are grinding your teeth.
I understand that you are mad because your previous employer did not honour your contract. But I suggest you read Hamrah`s postings on this thread over again. I have, and I read that BWA have no commmitments towards previous NJI employees. Again, you and your fellow workers have at least my sympathy, but you are grinding your teeth.
Join Date: Oct 2000
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Ditto on what LN says above, as in Jumb0lin0 why shouldn't BWA ignore you ?
You didn't work for BWA, and correct me if I'm wrong, you were employed by NJI and that's what your contract would have said.
All BWA did was provide an AOC (at a charge) to NJI, i.e. BWA worked for NJI too.
Of course providing an AOC requires that BWA have 'oversight' of the NJI operation, and that the aircraft all operation on BWA callsigns, and that BWA hold the slots and traffic rights - which is what allows them to now attempt to start a new 'low-cost' operation, no doubt in an endeavour to recoup some of the £400,000 that NJI still owe to them.
Ultimately, as they say, 'Sh!t happens !'
You didn't work for BWA, and correct me if I'm wrong, you were employed by NJI and that's what your contract would have said.
All BWA did was provide an AOC (at a charge) to NJI, i.e. BWA worked for NJI too.
Of course providing an AOC requires that BWA have 'oversight' of the NJI operation, and that the aircraft all operation on BWA callsigns, and that BWA hold the slots and traffic rights - which is what allows them to now attempt to start a new 'low-cost' operation, no doubt in an endeavour to recoup some of the £400,000 that NJI still owe to them.
Ultimately, as they say, 'Sh!t happens !'
Join Date: Apr 1999
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Has anyone thought of the fact that at one time i believe, which may not be the case now of course, Wazza owned a controling share in BWA. He got out of NJI just in time and now BWA/Wazza? are going to try and operate the old routes. Hmmmm 
Join Date: Aug 2001
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Dear Frequent Flyer,For your info Wazza has never had a controlling interest in BWA,and GOD help us he never will.BWA is a PLC which means you can find out for yourself who the shareholders are.BWA are going to PMO/CTA on an ACMI rate and lets all wish them good luck in these difficult times.To all exNJI,sorry it didn't work out but don't take it out on BWA,or think they owe you anything
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I am gathering information on people who have worked for Panasia based on the Isle of Jersey. This is another Warren ******* company which owes past employees money. We are aware that NJI employees where employed there until 1 April 2000, and previously another failed airline in Indonesia he used it to employ Australia`s (illegaly of course).
Has anyone else worked for this company?
Has anyone else worked for this company?
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Devils Advocate : Just to clear one thing up, in case it leads to confussion, it is not BWA starting up the new 'low cost airline', it is another company. I know you know that but I must just clarify to the others reading this thread.
Frequent Flyer : As far as I can see, at no time did WS own a controlling share in BWA ! This is a widely put about rumour that is false. If he did then he would probably have had a position on the BWA board - which he didn't. Also his name would be listed as owning these shares - Which it wasn't. I know personally that he made a lot of wild claims that were all bo11ocks. (Feel free to provide information to prove me wrong.
Guvnor : We agree, must be a first !!
It's Quite simple guys :-
If 'a chip shop owner' (WAZZA) opened up 'a chip shop' (NJI Airlines). Using 'an electricity suplier' (BWA) to provide the necessary services to 'cook chips' (fly aircraft). It doesn't mean that just because 'the chip shop' (NJI) failed as a business, that 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) owes anything to the 'Local Chip Fryers' (NJI Pilots) that are now out of work. Especially if 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) owed 'the Electricity Suplier' (BWA) so much money that 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) had no choice but to refuse to supply any more 'electricity' (services) until 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) paid his 'astromomically high bill' (ASTRONOMICALLY HIGH BILL).
It doesn't matter that 'The chip shop owner' (WAZZA) allegedly had shares in 'the electricity supplier' (BWA) - (Which always was debatable anyway *see below) - That is irrelevant, unless he owned enough to control the company - (which he didn't) -
* 'The Chip Shop' (NJI) made some payments to 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) to cover what it owed for 'electricity' (Route charges, etc) and the hire of fully crewed 'mobile chip vans' (BWA aircraft). 'The Chip Shop' (NJI) always claimed that this money was invested in 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA), when in fact this money was owed for 'electricity' (bills, etc) instead.
Rumour was put out that 'the Chip Shop' (NJI) had saved 'the Eletricity Supplier' (BWA) from financial problems, and had invested heavily in 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) when in fact, it had merely paid some of what it owed - late too.
Unfortunately 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) didn't like to pay his bills on time, if at all, even after several red letters and as understanding as 'the Electricity Suplier' (BWA) had been for as long as it possibly could, it was fed up of doing charity work (working for free) and incuring a 'large debt' (LARGE DEBT) that belonged to 'the Chip Shop Owner' (NJI) !
'The Chip Shop' (NJI) could no longer funtion without 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA).
There were lots of pi$$ed off people that never got paid by the 'Chip Shop' (NJI), including the 'Local Chip Fryers' (NJI Pilots), the 'Pickled Egg Suppliers' (ground support), the 'Girls Working the Till' (Cabin Crew), 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA), and many others.
END OF PART ONE.
================
PART TWO.
==========
A new low cost 'Kebab Shop' (Airline) opens up in Italy and asks to have it's electricity supplied by the same company the supplied 'the Chip Shop' (NJI). It also wants to hire fully crewed 'mobile chip vans' (BWA aircraft) from 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) initially, as it does not have it's own 'deep fat fryers' (aircraft) up and running yet.
The 'Electricity supplier' (BWA) enters into an agreement with the 'Kebab shop' (Airline) - but is very wary.
END OF PART TWO.
=================
CONCLUSION.
============
It is very sad indeed that the 'Local Chip Fryers' and 'girls working the till' are out of work and have not been paid by 'the Chip Shop' all our hearts go out to them. I honestly mean that.
However, you cannot blame the 'Electricity Supplier' for supplying electricity to the 'Kebab Shop' can you ?
Nor can you stop the 'Local Chip Fryers' and 'Girls Working the Till' looking for jobs at the 'kebab shop' can you ?
If anyone wants to work for 'the Electricity Supplier' then that is a matter for them and if 'the electricity supplier' is looking for new employees.
'The Electricity Supplier' is in no way obligated to the 'Local Chip Fryers' !
THE MORAL OF THE STORY.
========================
Never, ever work for an Austrailian man selling chips in Italy - you may get your fingers burned !
Frequent Flyer : As far as I can see, at no time did WS own a controlling share in BWA ! This is a widely put about rumour that is false. If he did then he would probably have had a position on the BWA board - which he didn't. Also his name would be listed as owning these shares - Which it wasn't. I know personally that he made a lot of wild claims that were all bo11ocks. (Feel free to provide information to prove me wrong.
Guvnor : We agree, must be a first !!
It's Quite simple guys :-
If 'a chip shop owner' (WAZZA) opened up 'a chip shop' (NJI Airlines). Using 'an electricity suplier' (BWA) to provide the necessary services to 'cook chips' (fly aircraft). It doesn't mean that just because 'the chip shop' (NJI) failed as a business, that 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) owes anything to the 'Local Chip Fryers' (NJI Pilots) that are now out of work. Especially if 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) owed 'the Electricity Suplier' (BWA) so much money that 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) had no choice but to refuse to supply any more 'electricity' (services) until 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) paid his 'astromomically high bill' (ASTRONOMICALLY HIGH BILL).
It doesn't matter that 'The chip shop owner' (WAZZA) allegedly had shares in 'the electricity supplier' (BWA) - (Which always was debatable anyway *see below) - That is irrelevant, unless he owned enough to control the company - (which he didn't) -
* 'The Chip Shop' (NJI) made some payments to 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) to cover what it owed for 'electricity' (Route charges, etc) and the hire of fully crewed 'mobile chip vans' (BWA aircraft). 'The Chip Shop' (NJI) always claimed that this money was invested in 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA), when in fact this money was owed for 'electricity' (bills, etc) instead.
Rumour was put out that 'the Chip Shop' (NJI) had saved 'the Eletricity Supplier' (BWA) from financial problems, and had invested heavily in 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) when in fact, it had merely paid some of what it owed - late too.
Unfortunately 'the Chip Shop Owner' (WAZZA) didn't like to pay his bills on time, if at all, even after several red letters and as understanding as 'the Electricity Suplier' (BWA) had been for as long as it possibly could, it was fed up of doing charity work (working for free) and incuring a 'large debt' (LARGE DEBT) that belonged to 'the Chip Shop Owner' (NJI) !
'The Chip Shop' (NJI) could no longer funtion without 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA).
There were lots of pi$$ed off people that never got paid by the 'Chip Shop' (NJI), including the 'Local Chip Fryers' (NJI Pilots), the 'Pickled Egg Suppliers' (ground support), the 'Girls Working the Till' (Cabin Crew), 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA), and many others.
END OF PART ONE.
================
PART TWO.
==========
A new low cost 'Kebab Shop' (Airline) opens up in Italy and asks to have it's electricity supplied by the same company the supplied 'the Chip Shop' (NJI). It also wants to hire fully crewed 'mobile chip vans' (BWA aircraft) from 'the Electricity Supplier' (BWA) initially, as it does not have it's own 'deep fat fryers' (aircraft) up and running yet.
The 'Electricity supplier' (BWA) enters into an agreement with the 'Kebab shop' (Airline) - but is very wary.
END OF PART TWO.
=================
CONCLUSION.
============
It is very sad indeed that the 'Local Chip Fryers' and 'girls working the till' are out of work and have not been paid by 'the Chip Shop' all our hearts go out to them. I honestly mean that.
However, you cannot blame the 'Electricity Supplier' for supplying electricity to the 'Kebab Shop' can you ?
Nor can you stop the 'Local Chip Fryers' and 'Girls Working the Till' looking for jobs at the 'kebab shop' can you ?
If anyone wants to work for 'the Electricity Supplier' then that is a matter for them and if 'the electricity supplier' is looking for new employees.
'The Electricity Supplier' is in no way obligated to the 'Local Chip Fryers' !
THE MORAL OF THE STORY.
========================
Never, ever work for an Austrailian man selling chips in Italy - you may get your fingers burned !
Join Date: Apr 1999
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I've never had anything against the 'Electricity Supplier', only latterly against the 'Chip Shop' for not paying me for my 'Chip Frying' duties. I wish the new 'Kebab Shop' all the best and also the 'Electricity Supplier' and I hope that they don't end up providing more 'Charity Work' to the 'Kebab Shop.' By the way, if the 'Kebab Shop' are short of a few 'Kebab Makers' would it be hard to teach an out of work 'Chip Fryer'? Alternatively would they consider one day making 'Chips', especially now that the 'Chip Shop' is no longer open?!
We're still talking airlines right???!
We're still talking airlines right???!
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Superlative post Invalid Delete. Certainly the best I've read on this site in a very long time. 
I join Grease Weasel in saying that I wish both the 'Electricity Supplier' and the 'Kebab Shop' every success in their new endeavour.
Perhaps the detractors, and the bitter and twisted, will now get off the 'Electricity Supplier's' back and give it some support in these 'frying times'.
[ 12 December 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]
I join Grease Weasel in saying that I wish both the 'Electricity Supplier' and the 'Kebab Shop' every success in their new endeavour.
Perhaps the detractors, and the bitter and twisted, will now get off the 'Electricity Supplier's' back and give it some support in these 'frying times'.
[ 12 December 2001: Message edited by: tilii ]