Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Flight Deck Forums > Rumours & News
Reload this Page >

Iranian Plane Crash

Rumours & News Reporting Points that may affect our jobs or lives as professional pilots. Also, items that may be of interest to professional pilots.

Iranian Plane Crash

Old 12th Feb 2002, 13:18
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: BNN VOR
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Unhappy Iranian Plane Crash

BBC is reporting that an Iranian passenger plane has crashed near the city of Khorramabad. No further details as yet.
steve1969 is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 13:33
  #2 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: BNN VOR
Posts: 22
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Unhappy

Latest from the BBC:

An Iranian passenger plane has crashed into the mountains near the western Iranian city of Khorramabad, state radio has reported. . .The Tupolev airliner left the capital Tehran on Tuesday morning for Khorramabad.

There were some 160 passengers on board, according to local authorities.

There was no immediate information on the cause of the crash
steve1969 is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 15:51
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: back of beyond
Posts: 76
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Unhappy

Try here

<a href="http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_518993.html?menu=" target="_blank">http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_518993.html?menu=</a>

Bad news
Hagbard the Amateur is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 16:11
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: southern england
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

Reuters revises pax load to 105, but says that 30 bodies already DOA at local hospital. Wreckage on side of mountain.
newswatcher is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 17:03
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: europe
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

Hopefully they'll get rid of those death traps.. .There are a lot of cheap western aircraft around now.. .Thoughts go out to their families.. .<a href="http://www.irna.com/en/tnews/020212134940.etn00.shtml" target="_blank">http://www.irna.com/en/tnews/020212134940.etn00.shtml</a>
schit.furbraen is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 21:48
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: 22.5 parallel
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Cool

S.Fb

Can you elaborate on the words "deatht trap" ?. .If you are considering an answer, let me help you started.. .Since 1973 (data available). .Tu-154 crashes 23 casualties 2172. .B-727 crashes 37 casualties 2930

You consider the 727 a death trap as well then?. .Did you ever flew the 154, or the 727 to make the comparison, for that matter. Let me know.. .Here on PPRuNe we don't need soundbites and one liners when the topic is accidents. Facts please.

(statistics courtesy of the fine people of Airdisaster.com)

With best regards. .A.V.
AEROVISION is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 22:19
  #7 (permalink)  

ex-Tanker
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: Luton Beds UK
Posts: 907
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Question

And while we are on facts, how many of each type have been operating and at what rate during the period quoted - just to get a feel for the successful flights too...
Few Cloudy is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 22:53
  #8 (permalink)  
LMD
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Location: Sanford, FL, USA
Posts: 15
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

AEROVISION AND FEW CLOUDY,

you might want to check the stats a little more closely. how many of the 727 crashes were due to a problem with the airframe. very, very few. most of the incidents were in the early years of the aircraft and were mostly due to pilot error (this was the first jet experience for many of the pilots and there was a steep learning curve). most of the recent crashes are CFIT, no flaps on T.O, and such.

i am not sure what the percentage of mechanical failures is on the tupolev, but you were emplying that the 727 was just as dangerous, which in my humble opinion is nonsense.
LMD is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 23:04
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 1998
Location: North west UK
Age: 64
Posts: 123
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Angry

Why start quoting statistics? if you wanted to quote the worst safety record of any airliner then statisticaly it is not an eastern block ex-bomber but our very own Concorde <img src="eek.gif" border="0">
PA38 is offline  
Old 12th Feb 2002, 23:48
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Aug 2000
Location: Herts, UK
Posts: 156
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Exclamation

Bear in mind why Iran Air and other Iranian carriers had to buy Yaks and Tupolevs - US sanctions. They couldn't even legally purchase engines for their Airbuses last I heard.

[ 12 February 2002: Message edited by: Cahlibahn ]</p>
Cahlibahn is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 00:12
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Wet Coast
Posts: 2,335
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

PA38. .Depends entirely on what metric you use. . .Based on how many of a particular model have been destroyed expressed as a percentage of the number built, Concorde is near the bottom of the list at 5%. So are the Tu154 (5.9%) and the 727 (4.8%).. .<a href="http://aviation-safety.net/statistics/aircraft.html" target="_blank">http://aviation-safety.net/statistics/aircraft.html</a>

Rather surprising figures for the Hercules (civil version only I assume) and also the dear old Viscount.

I don't propose this method of comparison is any more meaningful, just illustrating that statistics really don't tell you much about the relative safety of a particular model, for the reasons which others have stated.
PaperTiger is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 01:48
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2001
Location: Ft, Lauderdale,FL
Posts: 199
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

This is off the topic and not relevent here, but I have well over 4000 hours on 727's and I would take that airplane in an emergency with a good engineer over just about any other airplane ever made with possible exceptions being the 747 classics, 707's and DC8's.. .Most 72's are underpowered but built like brick outhouses with multiple redundant systems and manual reversion on all flight controls (which I realy miss). The airplane also requires good airmanship and is unforgiving to the ill trained or sloppy aviator.. .Sorry I didn't mean to go off like that but I realy love the old girl. <img src="smile.gif" border="0">
Raas767 is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 02:58
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: europe
Posts: 36
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Red face

I am so sorry to cause this. . .All I meant was that the Tu-154 has many accidents due to system failure where there was no way out of the situation. and they seem to blow up some times (I'm not quoting the Ukrain missle practice) due to engines etc.. .Also I meant the Iranians getting rid of the TU's anyway. . .They had a good saftey record till the sanctions, trigger happy yanks and the Russian shopping trips...
schit.furbraen is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 04:18
  #14 (permalink)  
allianceair
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Post

Hey guys just keeping with the forum motto, Asian pilots, Hindus, and Iranian pilots can't fly. <img src="eek.gif" border="0">
 
Old 13th Feb 2002, 10:25
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jul 2000
Location: Down south, USA.
Posts: 1,594
Received 9 Likes on 1 Post
Question

Just lots of questions here (ah, not again...). Many of you folks out there are very knowledgeable. Did most or a large fraction Tu-154s originally operate for the Soviet's Aeroflot or for their puppet states? I'm just curious, because the former Soviet Union (or even eastern European airlines?) was not known for publishing accident figures on very many of its aircraft types-but maybe my impression is far from the truth.

Apparently, all of the older statistics covering incidents/accidents before the fall of the Iron Curtain are now included in various accident statistic tables?

I read that a certain Aeroflot jet type (maybe the Tu-134 or 154?) was known to have had major malfunctions with its reversers, and depite the fact that a number of Aeroflot pilots were blamed and fired after some incidents or accidents, it was revealed after many years that a cover-up had taken place.

I read several years ago in the US magazine "Business Week", that many PRC Chinese pilots were working at least 150-170 block-to-block hours or more per month, from what I remember. Do many countries in the world far exceed even US/British/Ir/European duty rules? Can Captain's in all countries refuse to fly the airplane due to system/instrument problems, based on an MEL manual or such, without facing termination of his job/profession?

In Iran or in other countries, do political or 'job title' (pilots who lack currency, or are mostly management/admin types) factors complicate which pilots fly certain aircraft or routes? Does Iran have and use/allow replacement of correct spare parts when needed?

[ 13 February 2002: Message edited by: Ignition Override ]</p>
Ignition Override is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 11:03
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2001
Location: CANADA
Posts: 12
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Wink

It's amazing how few people respond to the death of a hundred or so "insignificant middle easteners".. .I think it is true that some peoles lives are worth more than others on the world market.
BIG PARTYR is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 11:11
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Oct 2000
Location: 22.5 parallel
Posts: 44
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Cool

MLD, . .I was not emplying that the 727 was an unsafe aircraft, it is not, nor is the 154.. .I was questioning sfb on his perception of the 154 and used simple basic equations to get my point in. (btw my figures start after 1973, that is after the learning curve.). .As for the statistics, numbers build, sectors flown and years in service, I think Paper Tiger summed it up very well in his above posting.

And, allianceair, can you back up Your soundbite?. .Pilot error is conclusive in many accidents and NO nationality is exempted.

With best regards. .A.V.
AEROVISION is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 12:08
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Arizona USA
Posts: 8,571
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

Flew into Khoramabad many times in the mid-seventies....lots of high nasty terrain thereabouts..and yes, NDB approaches at that time altho we had Omega/VLF as well, helped a lot.. .The VLF was VERY accurate.. .Iran Air at that time was a well respected carrier, with a good safety record. Maintenance top-notch as well. Had the Shah on board for two flights...and our call sign was "blue flight 001".. .Quite a pleasant guy....and an accomplished pilot.

[ 13 February 2002: Message edited by: 411A ]</p>
411A is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 12:38
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: FL000
Posts: 10
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

BP - Just because there is no outpouring of emotion does not mean fewer people care. No one enjoy's air disasters. It's just not as much a shock when an old bird in a poor 3rd world wasteland goes down in high terrain and possibly bad wx. <img src="frown.gif" border="0">

As for [quote] anyways, I'm off for a bloody good shaggin <hr></blockquote> Rosy Palms? <img src="rolleyes.gif" border="0">
Harvy is offline  
Old 13th Feb 2002, 13:23
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: southern england
Posts: 1,650
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Post

Local comment from the Dubai Gulf News:

"An Iranian airliner carrying 117 people crashed into a mountain while trying to land in western Iran yesterday, killing all aboard, a senior official and local residents said.

The Russian-built Tupolev-154, belonging to Iran Air Tours, an affiliate of the state carrier Iran Air, was flying from the capital Tehran to Khorramabad when it disappeared from radar screens southwest of the city.

Low cloud and heavily overcast skies may have hampered landing, residents said. The official, who declined to be identified, said those killed - 105 passengers and the rest crew - included four government officials. Four Spaniards were also among the dead.

The latest in a series of air disasters in Iran prompted calls in parliament for the resignation of Transport Minister Ahmad Khorram and aviation agency head, Behzad Mazaheri.

"Every once in a while a plane crashes, there is some debate and then the whole thing is forgotten," MP Azam Naseripour told Iran's IRNA news agency. "No one is ready to take responsibility for the lack of air security in Iran."

Another deputy, Golamreza Barzegar said parliament was moving towards impeaching the minister if he did not resign.

In Madrid, the Spanish Foreign Ministry identified the four dead Spaniards as businessmen Jesus Maria Olazabal, Juan Carlos Goikoetxea, Joseba Mirene, Julio Ibarra. They were from the Basque region of northern Spain and worked for the Basque-based household appliance maker Fagor Arrabate.

Khorramabad lies to the east of the Zagros mountain range running along the border with Iraq. State radio said villagers in the area were startled by an explosion early in the morning.

"There is a mountain close to the airport and the plane crashed into it as it was landing," said a local resident who visited the crash site. "The plane was totally destroyed and scattered in small pieces across the mountain."

State television showed pieces of metal strewn across jagged outcrops on the side of a mountain topped with thick mist.

President Mohammad Khatami ordered a special task force to investigate the crash.

An aviation official told the television rescuers were unable to reach the crash site due to bad weather and logistical problems and that the search for the victims had been postponed until Wednesday.

He said only small pieces of the plane had been spotted in the Chegeni region of Khorramabad.

Iranian airlines have been dogged by accidents in recent years, prompting calls for greater efficiency and revamp of the the country's ageing air fleet, many of them Boeings acquired before the 1979 Islamic revolution.

U.S. sanctions bar the sale of Boeing airliners to the Islamic Republic and hinder the acquisition of other aircraft, many of which rely on U.S.-built engines or other components. Iran has turned to Russia and Ukraine for cheaper planes.

Last May, a Russian-built Yakovlev Yak-40 plane carrying 30 people, including the transport minister and seven MPs, crashed near the northern town of Sari killing all on board.

Following that crash, Iranian legislators called for tighter aircraft safety controls and an end to the use of planes from the countries of the former Soviet Union.

In Moscow, Tupolev design chief Alexander Shingart discounted suggestions that the Tupolev-154 which crashed yesterday had suffered a technical failure.

"It was one of the last aircraft to come off the line and underwent repairs in June 2000 and in January it underwent regulatory maintenance. The plane was brought up to tip-top shape and everything was checked," he told Ekho Moskvy radio."
newswatcher is offline  

Thread Tools
Search this Thread

Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.