All Over for Aer Lingus in Four Weeks as BA Gives Thumbs Down to Investment
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MAD MITCH
The BA cadet on the wannabes deserved to get a thrashing....there he was just out of school from BA with 200hrs....wondering who next should spoon feed him and give him a plane free so that he could build some hours and then at the end says he's going back to Daddy's business....just shows that he probably won't get to command since he evidently can't make up his mind after atleast 1yrs intensive training, what he should do next......if he was REALLY interested in his career and not being spoon fed then he would know what to do.....
He was advised to do his instructors rating...but i guess he decided he was too good for that....and Daddy probably will pay him to sit on his a**e and lose all his touch flying ...rather than slum it as an instructor and get some good experience under his belt.....
As for The Guvnor.....i've already pointed out in his many many many other posts....that most likely he's one of the anoraks at the side of the runway....the nearest he gets to a plane in riding in one or on his Microsoft Flight Sim....
A guy like him with sooo many posts has to be flying a desk.....or just a nerd.....
My advice is ignore the fool......i don't think ALT will be allowed to close, it will most likely be a more trimmed company considering the amount of dead wood in the place already it can only do some good.
I see that ALT management are taking the greatest percentage of cuts.....well about bloody time....during the last 2 cuts...management lost 0%....so what goes around.......
The BA cadet on the wannabes deserved to get a thrashing....there he was just out of school from BA with 200hrs....wondering who next should spoon feed him and give him a plane free so that he could build some hours and then at the end says he's going back to Daddy's business....just shows that he probably won't get to command since he evidently can't make up his mind after atleast 1yrs intensive training, what he should do next......if he was REALLY interested in his career and not being spoon fed then he would know what to do.....
He was advised to do his instructors rating...but i guess he decided he was too good for that....and Daddy probably will pay him to sit on his a**e and lose all his touch flying ...rather than slum it as an instructor and get some good experience under his belt.....
As for The Guvnor.....i've already pointed out in his many many many other posts....that most likely he's one of the anoraks at the side of the runway....the nearest he gets to a plane in riding in one or on his Microsoft Flight Sim....
A guy like him with sooo many posts has to be flying a desk.....or just a nerd.....
My advice is ignore the fool......i don't think ALT will be allowed to close, it will most likely be a more trimmed company considering the amount of dead wood in the place already it can only do some good.
I see that ALT management are taking the greatest percentage of cuts.....well about bloody time....during the last 2 cuts...management lost 0%....so what goes around.......
Join Date: Feb 2001
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I don't know what's wrong with some people. Guv has introduced a vital issue - the national flag carrier of Ireland is about to collapse and Guv has reprinted an article to introduce the subject with some substance. And half the responses are slagging the bloke off instead of debating a very serious issue and it's many facets (EU, low-cost airlines, unions et al). May I also remind you if you disapprove of a thread, by adding petty crap to it you are also putting it back at the top of the pile. I agree Guv has made a few gaffs but even those have served to amuse. The man's a cult figure.
Idiots.
Idiots.
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Ontheairwaves
- The BA cadet posting on Wannabes asked a perfectly straightforward and justifiable question. He was unjustly flamed purely on the basis that he was a BA cadet. Had he posted as a self improver asking for advice as to his next steps then you can bet that the response would have been nowhere near as vociferous. Double standards...?
- The BA cadet posting on Wannabes asked a perfectly straightforward and justifiable question. He was unjustly flamed purely on the basis that he was a BA cadet. Had he posted as a self improver asking for advice as to his next steps then you can bet that the response would have been nowhere near as vociferous. Double standards...?
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Eeper , quite agree, the BA's guys question was perfectly legitimate. No question that double standards are in evidence here. Its quite laughable actually, as if any of his many detractors would have turned down the chance of a BA cadetship. Yeah, I can see it now: "Hmmm, a free CPR/IR with a jet job afterwards, no thanks mate, I rather like the idea of spending 50k of my own money so I can take the moral high ground afterwards."
Ontheairwaves : "if he was REALLY interested in his career"??? No of course he isn't, his question on Pprune was simply an ingenious method to **** off those with chips on their shoulders (you wouldn't be one of them surely?). Obviously his question had no real interest in aviation and he was merely wondering which of Daddy's companies it would be best to work for. The sad thing is that people unable to see the irony of the "daddy's company" bit are actually flying pax out there. Very scary.
Let's hope there ain't too many like you out there, otherwise no one would have any knowledge of the aviation world, any legitimate question getting quashed by the "professionals".
So all you pathetic detractors out there, get a grip, though I guess it was nice to be born with 4000 hours... And a perfect knowledge of the world of aviation!
Ontheairwaves : "if he was REALLY interested in his career"??? No of course he isn't, his question on Pprune was simply an ingenious method to **** off those with chips on their shoulders (you wouldn't be one of them surely?). Obviously his question had no real interest in aviation and he was merely wondering which of Daddy's companies it would be best to work for. The sad thing is that people unable to see the irony of the "daddy's company" bit are actually flying pax out there. Very scary.
Let's hope there ain't too many like you out there, otherwise no one would have any knowledge of the aviation world, any legitimate question getting quashed by the "professionals".
So all you pathetic detractors out there, get a grip, though I guess it was nice to be born with 4000 hours... And a perfect knowledge of the world of aviation!
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I mean, this is a "Rumours & News" forum. I'm sure people would want to validate this one way or another themselves.
In any case, it's worth commenting on, true or not. A lot of people were skeptical when they first heard that Swissair may fold, I remember.
The Guv posts it, everyone can debate it. Isn't that what a forum is all about? If there were no posts like what the Guv is doing, then what is 'news'? What some pilot did for a joke a couple of weeks ago at a party?
In any case, it's worth commenting on, true or not. A lot of people were skeptical when they first heard that Swissair may fold, I remember.
The Guv posts it, everyone can debate it. Isn't that what a forum is all about? If there were no posts like what the Guv is doing, then what is 'news'? What some pilot did for a joke a couple of weeks ago at a party?
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MagPlug, E.Morse, JetA1, OnTheAirwaves.
It would be fair and reasonable to conclude that you all suffer from a Chronic case of Self-Imposed Torment.
The same can be said in relation to all of the other 'Questionably Intelligent' 'Guv-Bashers' that seem to develop an 'Enormous-Chubby' by slinging off at 'The Guvnor'.
Anyhow, in relation to the 'Self-Imposed Torment' , relief is available for all of you. The solution has been staring you in the face for the whole time you've been members of PPRuNe, but quite obviously the simple solution has evaded you all for far too long.
Let me give you all a helping hand along the road of enlightenment and with a bit of luck we can free you from the Chains of which your all so hopelessly entangled.
Ok, here we go. Now, upon entering PPRuNe and the chosen Forum, you are faced with a choice of thingis called 'Topics'.
To the right-hand side of the 'Topics' column is another column. This column has a heading that reads, 'Topic-Starter'.
It is so aptly-named, because it explains who started the 'Topic'.
Now, start the Progressive-Scan and while doing so, keep your eyes peeled for the following words, ' The Guvnor'.
At this particular critical moment, one must make a decision to Click or not to Click.
It's also called, ' Making a Choice'.
When a PPRuNe-Member clicks on a Topic started by 'The Guvnor', or any other PPRuNe-Member, they should read the initial posting and then the Replies that follow below.
Then that person decides whether they have any 'worthwhile comments' to contribute. If no 'worthwhile comments' can be contributed, it is time to continue to the next Topic.
However, if previous readings of 'Guvnor' started Topics or Topics created by any other PPPRuNe-Member have induced feelings of Torment or Contempt, a choice can be made.
In the case of the above persons and fellow like-minded individuals, the only logical and intelligent choice is not to Click on the Topic, full stop.
Once again, it's called a Choice. If you don't like the 'Topic-Starter', move on to another Topic and gain knowledge or give input wherever it is appropriate and more importantly, where it can be beneficial reading for the Members who peruse the Thread.
Then, PPRuNe can have extra Bandwidth available to all the legitimate PPPRuNers who frequent this Site.
See, it's so un-complicated. The choice is, be wise, or be the opposite.
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HATRED IS THE COWARD'S REVENGE FOR BEING INTIMIDATED
It would be fair and reasonable to conclude that you all suffer from a Chronic case of Self-Imposed Torment.
The same can be said in relation to all of the other 'Questionably Intelligent' 'Guv-Bashers' that seem to develop an 'Enormous-Chubby' by slinging off at 'The Guvnor'.
Anyhow, in relation to the 'Self-Imposed Torment' , relief is available for all of you. The solution has been staring you in the face for the whole time you've been members of PPRuNe, but quite obviously the simple solution has evaded you all for far too long.
Let me give you all a helping hand along the road of enlightenment and with a bit of luck we can free you from the Chains of which your all so hopelessly entangled.
Ok, here we go. Now, upon entering PPRuNe and the chosen Forum, you are faced with a choice of thingis called 'Topics'.
To the right-hand side of the 'Topics' column is another column. This column has a heading that reads, 'Topic-Starter'.
It is so aptly-named, because it explains who started the 'Topic'.
Now, start the Progressive-Scan and while doing so, keep your eyes peeled for the following words, ' The Guvnor'.
At this particular critical moment, one must make a decision to Click or not to Click.
It's also called, ' Making a Choice'.
When a PPRuNe-Member clicks on a Topic started by 'The Guvnor', or any other PPRuNe-Member, they should read the initial posting and then the Replies that follow below.
Then that person decides whether they have any 'worthwhile comments' to contribute. If no 'worthwhile comments' can be contributed, it is time to continue to the next Topic.
However, if previous readings of 'Guvnor' started Topics or Topics created by any other PPPRuNe-Member have induced feelings of Torment or Contempt, a choice can be made.
In the case of the above persons and fellow like-minded individuals, the only logical and intelligent choice is not to Click on the Topic, full stop.
Once again, it's called a Choice. If you don't like the 'Topic-Starter', move on to another Topic and gain knowledge or give input wherever it is appropriate and more importantly, where it can be beneficial reading for the Members who peruse the Thread.
Then, PPRuNe can have extra Bandwidth available to all the legitimate PPPRuNers who frequent this Site.
See, it's so un-complicated. The choice is, be wise, or be the opposite.
-------------------------------------------
HATRED IS THE COWARD'S REVENGE FOR BEING INTIMIDATED
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So Guvnor, can you clarify, the original post was merely 'news' and not just gloating?
If so, do you believe everything you read in the papers, or do you have a personal opinion?
If you have a personal opinion, would you be prepared to put some money where your mouth is?
The bet is "Aer Lingus to close within four weeks." I think that's November 25th. The term 'close' means 'shut down permanently in present form...brand dead'. What do you say?
If so, do you believe everything you read in the papers, or do you have a personal opinion?
If you have a personal opinion, would you be prepared to put some money where your mouth is?
The bet is "Aer Lingus to close within four weeks." I think that's November 25th. The term 'close' means 'shut down permanently in present form...brand dead'. What do you say?
Just as well for him because in about 30 hours from now he'd have stood to lose a few bucks.
You see, sadly for The Guvnor...AER LINGUS IS STILL HERE.
I'll tell you what Guv. Here's a new bet, and you don't even have to risk your limited funds.
If Aer Lingus is still in business on Christmas morning you'll give us the best Xmas present ever by getting off the forum for one month...in all your identities!
And if it goes bust? You'll of course have the endless satisfaction of saying 'I told you so', not to mention knowing they're all on the dole for next year.
I dare you.
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Nope, coz I know that the Irish government are planning a typically Irish solution to the problem - they're apparently going to use taxpayer's funds to buy (at a grossly overinflated price) one of the EI 737-400s apparently as a new Head of State aircraft. Strangely, the aircraft already appears to be owned by the taxpayers! 
They seem to think that this will manage to avoid the state subsidy rules ... but will Lola allow it?
They seem to think that this will manage to avoid the state subsidy rules ... but will Lola allow it?
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Guvnor you just can't ever admit being wrong, can you? Rather than simply admit you were wrong you start up a whole new line of blather. Do you ever give up? I probably should be pleased that you at least aren't predicting the demise of the company in another four weeks!
You're full of it matey. Do you have any friends? Or is this the only life you know? Although I've never met you I can picture you as the kind of guy who sits alone in the pub with a half glass of shandy boring everyone within earshot while they attempt to back away quietly.
Do you wear corduroy trousers and those stupid looking golf sweaters? I'll bet you do. I know your type. Pain in the a**e.
Oh, and by the way 
I'll out-smiley you too!
You're full of it matey. Do you have any friends? Or is this the only life you know? Although I've never met you I can picture you as the kind of guy who sits alone in the pub with a half glass of shandy boring everyone within earshot while they attempt to back away quietly.
Do you wear corduroy trousers and those stupid looking golf sweaters? I'll bet you do. I know your type. Pain in the a**e.
Oh, and by the way
I'll out-smiley you too!
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If Aer Lingus can't compete and operate on its own than maybe it should be allowed to fail. The EU decided awhile back to try and privatize all the European flag carriers and to put limits on the amount of state aide that is allowed to flow in to airlines. If the Europeans want their airlines to operate in an environment where competion and free trade determines weather or not an airline is succesful than airlines that cannot compete should go by the wayside. Now, Sept 11 is a different story. The United States injected capital in to the airlines in order to compensate them for losses sustained because of the closing of national airspace, but those airlines with poor balance sheets will probably fail anyway, and they should. Why should healthy airlines have to spend money to compete with airlines that are either protected from creditors while in chapter 11 or enjoy full scale subsidies from their governments. Either we run airlines as a business or we run them as a post office, but not both.
I know all this sounds harsh and that jobs are at stake here, but that's capitalism.
I know all this sounds harsh and that jobs are at stake here, but that's capitalism.
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Epsom hold 2 you said Guv is a cult figure mmmmm....I thinketh not.
Its ok to have opinions and all the rest but for someone from the industry to continually 'bet' on the FAILURE of part of the industry is bizarre at the very least.
Guv, and your chums, I've never had a problem with many of your posts but lately they are those of a doom monger, and that can dent investors confidence. Why not try talking the industry up and not down.
Its ok to have opinions and all the rest but for someone from the industry to continually 'bet' on the FAILURE of part of the industry is bizarre at the very least.
Guv, and your chums, I've never had a problem with many of your posts but lately they are those of a doom monger, and that can dent investors confidence. Why not try talking the industry up and not down.
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Maxalt - stop being childish. You're perfectly well aware that I didn't write that article and this - in case you hadn't seen it - is the Rumours and News forum. The possibility of ALT folding is very obviously news - and that's why it was posted. Reading through the responses, rather more people appreciate its being posted than object.
Logical? I thought so!
As I didn't write the article, I'm therefore not right or wrong. You'll want to take that particular issue up with the author!
flypastflyfast - if I only posted good news, there would be lots of articles about Go, Ryanair, and easyJet (all of which strangely enough I have posted) - and not a lot of anything else. You might be one of those people who prefers to do an ostrich and stick his head in the sand, hoping all the 'bad stuff' will go away - but that's a rather shortsighted view and one that's likely to get you kicked up the backside.
raas767 - I completely agree. In reality, there's not a lot of point in a country like Ireland having a long haul operation in any case; and short haul services are perfectly well covered by Ryanair, bmi etc.
There's far too much in the way of national egos getting in the way of economic reality here - the restart of SN under the guise of DAT+ is one such instance - far better to take the short term pain for long term gain rather than the other way round!
Logical? I thought so!
As I didn't write the article, I'm therefore not right or wrong. You'll want to take that particular issue up with the author!
flypastflyfast - if I only posted good news, there would be lots of articles about Go, Ryanair, and easyJet (all of which strangely enough I have posted) - and not a lot of anything else. You might be one of those people who prefers to do an ostrich and stick his head in the sand, hoping all the 'bad stuff' will go away - but that's a rather shortsighted view and one that's likely to get you kicked up the backside.
raas767 - I completely agree. In reality, there's not a lot of point in a country like Ireland having a long haul operation in any case; and short haul services are perfectly well covered by Ryanair, bmi etc.
There's far too much in the way of national egos getting in the way of economic reality here - the restart of SN under the guise of DAT+ is one such instance - far better to take the short term pain for long term gain rather than the other way round!
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There are times, Guvnor, when I'm not sure if you're being serious or if you're setting out to wind people up.
"There's not much point in a country like Ireland having a long haul operation." Why not? We have as much need and as much right as any other country in Europe or anywhere else to develop new markets. You cannot compare airlines in central Europe with those in a peripheral economy, many of which have - for various good (or, in the case of the SNN stopover, bad) reasons - been forced to carry out government policy.
If the EU really wanted to do something useful, it would crack down on the Irish government on the issue of the US bilateral, which is holding up every other country in Europe; what have we heard on this recently? Not a dickie bird!
SN collapsed because it was monstrously inefficient and a perennial and perpetual basket case. How an airline could be based in the centre of Europe, with all the high revenue traffic potential from the EU gravy train and other agencies and not make a profit is beyond me. Yet EI never had this, and had the government working against it on its most lucrative routes and still managed a fairly good business.
Raas767, you say this is capitalism. Well, I'm all for it, but there comes a time when society has to take precedence over capitalism. When a crisis such as 9/11 takes place, governments should be in a position to protect the interests of their countries; EI is in the position its in largely because of government policies. Why shouldn't it be given a chance to recover? Why should our economy be placed in a precarious situation, purely in the name of some obscure and misplaced economic theory?
As for the proposed 734, I certainly hope it does go ahead and EI deserves no less and, since this will come out of the defence budget, it will not be subject to EU interference.
"There's not much point in a country like Ireland having a long haul operation." Why not? We have as much need and as much right as any other country in Europe or anywhere else to develop new markets. You cannot compare airlines in central Europe with those in a peripheral economy, many of which have - for various good (or, in the case of the SNN stopover, bad) reasons - been forced to carry out government policy.
If the EU really wanted to do something useful, it would crack down on the Irish government on the issue of the US bilateral, which is holding up every other country in Europe; what have we heard on this recently? Not a dickie bird!
SN collapsed because it was monstrously inefficient and a perennial and perpetual basket case. How an airline could be based in the centre of Europe, with all the high revenue traffic potential from the EU gravy train and other agencies and not make a profit is beyond me. Yet EI never had this, and had the government working against it on its most lucrative routes and still managed a fairly good business.
Raas767, you say this is capitalism. Well, I'm all for it, but there comes a time when society has to take precedence over capitalism. When a crisis such as 9/11 takes place, governments should be in a position to protect the interests of their countries; EI is in the position its in largely because of government policies. Why shouldn't it be given a chance to recover? Why should our economy be placed in a precarious situation, purely in the name of some obscure and misplaced economic theory?
As for the proposed 734, I certainly hope it does go ahead and EI deserves no less and, since this will come out of the defence budget, it will not be subject to EU interference.
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Maxalt etc:
You should try to come to terms with this:
regrettably, the Guv will not go away and replying to him just pours petrol (gasoline) on the flames. The best remedy is to ignore, difficult though I find it myself.
Try having a beer!
You should try to come to terms with this:
regrettably, the Guv will not go away and replying to him just pours petrol (gasoline) on the flames. The best remedy is to ignore, difficult though I find it myself.
Try having a beer!
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Guys and gals,
Its only Saturday evening here in the mountains of central Idaho, and I was shocked to hear of the possible demise of the Irish Flag Carrier. My best wishes to those of you that might be affected. I had the chance a few years ago to do some sub-sevice for Aer Lingus while I was at American International, and we all enjoyed working with the staff there! Hold your heads high!
Its only Saturday evening here in the mountains of central Idaho, and I was shocked to hear of the possible demise of the Irish Flag Carrier. My best wishes to those of you that might be affected. I had the chance a few years ago to do some sub-sevice for Aer Lingus while I was at American International, and we all enjoyed working with the staff there! Hold your heads high!
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Well, it's nice to know that the playing field is a little more level. US Airlines have been receiving government money. FR has been benfitting from public subisides. And now, not only will EI survive a little longer, but yet another journo has egg on his face.
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hmmm... at the rate EI is alleged by management to be burning dough, how much would even an overpriced 737 raise? Remember that means a cutback in service, as no way would the EU commission sanction a straight replacement of say a 20m 737 on the open market for the 40m "defence" 737.
Anyway since Atron aren't selling IAC are hardly buying although... it would mean an even faster ticket into the airlines for the mil boys, not only trained for free but type-rated too!
Anyway since Atron aren't selling IAC are hardly buying
although... it would mean an even faster ticket into the airlines for the mil boys, not only trained for free but type-rated too!