F-16 intercept unidentified 737 over the Netherlands
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Doesn't matter that he might be WRONG - JUMPING to conclusions and being what you guys call a"monday morning quarterback".
Yes he has some good points but it is the method and delivery that are the problem. The holier than thou and "WIWO" attitude just rubs some people up the wrong way. Perhaps it is just as well he ain't flying for the moment as the CRM leaves a lot to be desired.
Yes he has some good points but it is the method and delivery that are the problem. The holier than thou and "WIWO" attitude just rubs some people up the wrong way. Perhaps it is just as well he ain't flying for the moment as the CRM leaves a lot to be desired.
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Hi Jon
At least you don't need 'assertiveness' training.
Could you not have handled the situation with your golfing capt with a view to a better outcome?
What goes around has a habit of coming 'round, and none of us are so hot as to be bulletproof!
Happy landings, if you're still flying!
edited to add. See you're grounded due medical. Bet they're missing you........
At least you don't need 'assertiveness' training.
Could you not have handled the situation with your golfing capt with a view to a better outcome?
What goes around has a habit of coming 'round, and none of us are so hot as to be bulletproof!
Happy landings, if you're still flying!
edited to add. See you're grounded due medical. Bet they're missing you........
More than just an ATCO
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Due to the football in Germany, NATO has an AWACS in the air over Germany in case a repeat of 911 should be attempted so any such incident is obviously being taken very seriously.
From conversation last night it seems the flight concerned was not on the usual direct route (Possibly on a radar vector when original contact was lost?).
There is often a possibility to contact the aircraft through, IIRC, Copengagen Radio, but I believe this requires SELCAL or HF.
Hi OT, seems they're still keeping you all busy
From conversation last night it seems the flight concerned was not on the usual direct route (Possibly on a radar vector when original contact was lost?).
There is often a possibility to contact the aircraft through, IIRC, Copengagen Radio, but I believe this requires SELCAL or HF.
Hi OT, seems they're still keeping you all busy
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Okay, so as far as I can tell from the replies, is that there will be internal investigation, but he pilots will not receive any "spanking".
Fair enough, I guess the thought of being blown out of the sky, and the related stress when you see an F16 on your left side ( knowing that there's a second and possibly third one 1 NM behind with it's radar locked on you ) will make them more vigilant the next time they don't hear anything on the radio for more than 10 minutes
( Lon : we keep beating our record # of flights/day on a weekly bases, we're up to 47xx last Wednesday... )
Fair enough, I guess the thought of being blown out of the sky, and the related stress when you see an F16 on your left side ( knowing that there's a second and possibly third one 1 NM behind with it's radar locked on you ) will make them more vigilant the next time they don't hear anything on the radio for more than 10 minutes
( Lon : we keep beating our record # of flights/day on a weekly bases, we're up to 47xx last Wednesday... )
Last edited by OscarTango; 26th Jun 2006 at 15:36.
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F-16 intercept unidentified 737 over the Netherlands
Hmm.....
Hope I'm not interfering to much here, must admit I have not read most of the posts on this thread because quite frankly I find niggling quite boring.
Getting back to the gist of the original post, we all listen out on 121.5 (or should do) and I find that in Europe transmittions on that frequency occur regularly and on a daily basis and are occuring so often that one tends to turn the volume down to mange the distracion particularly when one is in the terminal areas. The Swiss and French airspaces are particularly bad.
121.5 is an Emergency Frequency and should be used as such.....
Hope I'm not interfering to much here, must admit I have not read most of the posts on this thread because quite frankly I find niggling quite boring.
Getting back to the gist of the original post, we all listen out on 121.5 (or should do) and I find that in Europe transmittions on that frequency occur regularly and on a daily basis and are occuring so often that one tends to turn the volume down to mange the distracion particularly when one is in the terminal areas. The Swiss and French airspaces are particularly bad.
121.5 is an Emergency Frequency and should be used as such.....
JonDC9: The number of blocked or partially-transmitted radio calls with almost no "hear-back" can cause enough problems. Think about how often we need three tries to contact a controller who is on the "land-line" with Cleveland or, heaven forbid, Wash. Center 
etc.
What? Flight Attendants resting feet in the c0ckp1t? No more, even if they had enough room. Anyway, many of the young ones got sort of old (and some quit)-so did many of us become older and more wrinkled, like aged, smoked-cured ham.
Because of the regs since 9/11, we never see them inflight (we gave up pilot crewmeals, among other foolish things, in order too finish a TA with those low-life b@$^@&^$), and many flights on a certain "classic" twin-turbofan are too short. If we go to the lav, they are up there for just a minute.
The old days are gone, and this is no exaggeration, at least on a classic type.
etc.What? Flight Attendants resting feet in the c0ckp1t? No more, even if they had enough room. Anyway, many of the young ones got sort of old (and some quit)-so did many of us become older and more wrinkled, like aged, smoked-cured ham.
Because of the regs since 9/11, we never see them inflight (we gave up pilot crewmeals, among other foolish things, in order too finish a TA with those low-life b@$^@&^$), and many flights on a certain "classic" twin-turbofan are too short. If we go to the lav, they are up there for just a minute.
The old days are gone, and this is no exaggeration, at least on a classic type.
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Good one..don't know.
Having said, the fighters identified themselves as "Nato Air Defence", so that would lead me to believe that they can. But I have a friend who's in the Belgian Air Force...I'll ask and get back to you...
OT
Having said, the fighters identified themselves as "Nato Air Defence", so that would lead me to believe that they can. But I have a friend who's in the Belgian Air Force...I'll ask and get back to you...
OT
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Would say that NATO co-ordinate intercepts but someone else can answer for sure.
Have to side with Jon the DC9 jockey on this one. Not because I'm critical of other pilots and think that I can always do better, far from it. I make mant errors myself for which I retropesctively slap myself on the forehead. No, I side with the old smoke maker because we need to be alert. If we start to justify our mistakes we are on a VERY slippery slope. I haven't been intercepted yet but been 'victim' of one of the afore mentioned events leading to a loss of radio contact. MY mistake, no-one else's. It will happen to others and probably to you. Be a professional and be alert (even at 2 a.m.) so that you don't look like a weekend warrior.
Up to you but 121.5 is REALLY easy to listen to. (Don't know who's transmitting a 'practice' pan-pan but if you're listening, this can be done without pressing the PTT.)
Cheers,
Chips
Have to side with Jon the DC9 jockey on this one. Not because I'm critical of other pilots and think that I can always do better, far from it. I make mant errors myself for which I retropesctively slap myself on the forehead. No, I side with the old smoke maker because we need to be alert. If we start to justify our mistakes we are on a VERY slippery slope. I haven't been intercepted yet but been 'victim' of one of the afore mentioned events leading to a loss of radio contact. MY mistake, no-one else's. It will happen to others and probably to you. Be a professional and be alert (even at 2 a.m.) so that you don't look like a weekend warrior.
Up to you but 121.5 is REALLY easy to listen to. (Don't know who's transmitting a 'practice' pan-pan but if you're listening, this can be done without pressing the PTT.)
Cheers,
Chips
More modern military radios also include band-associated Guard receivers. So, if you're on VHF you have 121.5 as the +G freq, on UHF 243.0.
Can't imagine much worse than having to monitor some company frequency - unless it has SelCal, perhaps.
Back in the old pre-123.45 Oceanic days, I once overheard a long and involved chat between Virgin and ba about "Have you got a Mr. (so-and-so) on board?" This went on for some minutes until they said they had. "Please tell him that Miss (someone-or-other) will meet him in the bar of the Hotel Whatever at 1800."
"Well, he won't be the only one then!"
"I'll be there"
"So will I!"
....came the replies in stereo from everyone else within 100 miles or so!
Can't imagine much worse than having to monitor some company frequency - unless it has SelCal, perhaps.
Back in the old pre-123.45 Oceanic days, I once overheard a long and involved chat between Virgin and ba about "Have you got a Mr. (so-and-so) on board?" This went on for some minutes until they said they had. "Please tell him that Miss (someone-or-other) will meet him in the bar of the Hotel Whatever at 1800."
"Well, he won't be the only one then!"
"I'll be there"
"So will I!"
....came the replies in stereo from everyone else within 100 miles or so!
And in August 2005 - Delta 767 this time. Here's the sound-file of the intercept.
I still find humour in the high octave cockpit response to the F16 pilot...
I still find the "Switch to safe" as the aircraft break off eery......
I still find humour in the high octave cockpit response to the F16 pilot...
I still find the "Switch to safe" as the aircraft break off eery......
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Originally Posted by RevMan2
And in August 2005 - Delta 767 this time. Here's the sound-file of the intercept.
I still find humour in the high octave cockpit response to the F16 pilot...
I still find the "Switch to safe" as the aircraft break off eery......
I still find humour in the high octave cockpit response to the F16 pilot...
I still find the "Switch to safe" as the aircraft break off eery......
