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eirjet A320 LANDS AT WRONG AIRPORT!

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eirjet A320 LANDS AT WRONG AIRPORT!

Old 30th Mar 2006, 14:07
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Let's review this a bit.
The pilots did not intent to make the mistake, so between their intentions and the outcome something happened. This something by definition can happen to anyone of us, the likelyhood of it happening more then one at tha same time is rather small, but the fact that it happened to the Eirjet crew is the proof of it being possible.
It would however be of great importance to know why it happened, so that we may all learn and not find ourselfs in a similar situation. Anyone using this forum to blame the crew is not only unfair, but equally stu... because it can happen to anyone of us, given the "right" circumstances.

Nick
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 14:08
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Squeaker.
I think that phraseology was added after the Danair 748 landed at Langford Lodge.
"Is there a similar procedure at Londonderry?" I bet there is now!
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 14:45
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Lets remember that all incidents/accidents are caused by a chain of circumstances rather than one isolated factor. Like the proverbial block of cheese its when all the holes line up that it all goes pear-shaped.

Whilst I am sure some "errors" were made on the flightdeck, this crew has all my sympathy. There have been many occasions over the years where aircraft have landed at the "wrong" airport, Sharjah and Dubai spring immediately to mind. It is too easy to brand "pilot error" as the cause since any incident is a product of the "system".

The investigators will no doubt look at all the circumstances surrounding this incident - no pilot has any intention to land at the wrong airport - perhaps there have been some "near misses" which have not been reported (not necessarily by eirjet) in the past.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 14:48
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Anytime 07 is in use at Aldergrove, Langord Lodge is mentioned in the ATIS and 07 remains lighted all the time. I don't believe LDY has an ATIS to include it in though.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 15:23
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Flight into Ballykelly.

Hi all,

as usual, it seems a number of factors contributed to this incident (ILS, train passing, tight circuit, shower). Thankfully it did not go from being an incident to an accident. It would have been a good idea to check GPS coordinates. Does anyone know if the airbus was cleared to land? While I would assume it was pilot error, I do sympathise with the pilots involved and I believe that much can be learned from what happened.

For an aerial view of the area concerned, check:
http://server4.pictiger.com/img/1887...ld/ryanair.jpg

Will.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 15:33
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Originally Posted by ZICODIAN
Hi all,

as usual, it seems a number of factors contributed to this incident (ILS, train passing, tight circuit, shower). Thankfully it did not go from being an incident to an accident. It would have been a good idea to check GPS coordinates. Does anyone know if the airbus was cleared to land? While I would assume it was pilot error, I do sympathise with the pilots involved and I believe that much can be learned from what happened.

For an aerial view of the area concerned, check:
http://server4.pictiger.com/img/1887...ld/ryanair.jpg

Will.
Zicodian an error of 5 miles doesn't even register as a failure on the FMGC which uses the GPS.

It is obviously pilot error but it is easier to do than one might think. The distractions you mention are all factors along with lack of familiarity ( obviously ). There may be other distractions we haven't heard about.

Certainly when circling with high ground around, if you are urgently looking for an unfamiliar runway and then you see one...it can be difficult not to fixate on it. This of course is one of the many reasons there are two people up front, to cross check. That obviously didn't happen for some reason.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 16:06
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Originally Posted by Faire d'income
Zicodian an error of 5 miles doesn't even register as a failure on the FMGC which uses the GPS.

It is obviously pilot error but it is easier to do than one might think. The distractions you mention are all factors along with lack of familiarity ( obviously ). There may be other distractions we haven't heard about.

Certainly when circling with high ground around, if you are urgently looking for an unfamiliar runway and then you see one...it can be difficult not to fixate on it. This of course is one of the many reasons there are two people up front, to cross check. That obviously didn't happen for some reason.
I agree. I find that GPS coordinates and a paper map are always a good last check to ensure you are at the right place. One should always try to avert this 'tunnel vision'. I have never used the A320 FMGC, but on all systems I have used it is possible to view basic GPS coordinates. It seems as though an error of 5nm should be reported by the FMGC, as can be seen from this event. I would be very interested in what preceded the landing. There must be other factors involved here which resulted the lack of a good cross check etc.

Will.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 16:42
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I really hope I am not opening a can of worms here, and if so, I will withdraw the post. But..

from the BBC coverage, it was reported that the RAF had not been using the airbase since the 1970s. It is pure good luck therefore that the runway was not littered with dangerous obstructions. The consequences might have been unthinkable. If the worst had happened, do you you think there would still be sympathy for the flight crews' plight?
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 16:56
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Ferchristsake! Can we puleeze get some professional pilots on here instead of armchair PC sim amateurs. " find that GPS coordinates and a paper map are always a good last check to ensure you are at the right place."

The aircraft was exactly where it should have been. There was no error between the a/c and it's GPS location. The only error was in the pilots head and any one of us could have made that mistake.

There are obviously some right plonkers posting on here if they think that doing a tight visual circuit in any medium jet, one of the crew is going to start checking GPS co-ordinates against a plotting chart. Where do these jumped up amateurs think they are suggesting such stupid things on a professional pilots website. Sometimes I despair when I read some of the tosh that these Rodneys post on here.

The most likely scenario, and I'm a Boeing boy not a Tuppaware jet jockey, is that if they did a go-around into a tight visual circuit, there was nothing in their equivalent of the FMC and it is also possible that they didn't have the airport symbols selected either. Whoever was non-flying should have either highlighted the airport, reselected the runway if it was in their database or else just entered a fix on whatever the airport reference point was and extended a course line.

The enquiry will no doubt evaluate things such as the experience levels of the crew and any cockpit gradient that may have caused one pilot to become overloaded to the point of losing situational awareness. Just reading some of the comments on here makes me wonder about the qualification of some posters. This was indeed a mistake that hopefully the crew will learn from. However, it is a serious incident, even if the media cannot fathom why. The crew were extremely lucky that they landed on a serviceable runway and not somewhere where there could have been debris, equipment or anything that could have caused damage to the aircraft.

It is obvious to those of us in the job who knows what they are going on about and those who are pretending to know what they are going on about. Just give it a rest if you are not truly jet qualified unless it is a genuine question. Pontification from pretenders grates badly and only makes you appear even more stoopid than you can imagine. The Eirjet crew will no doubt be feeling bad enough about this incident without some of the amateurs pontificating on here about what they should have done. "...but on all systems I have used it is possible to view basic GPS coordinates." Gimme a break.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:16
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arewenearlythereyet?

Do sympathise with some of your sentiments. Those without knowledge of the aircraft navigation systems are not helping by speculating.

However, as a 4,500 hour Airbus guy, I think I can say that there is enough guidance provided in the 320 flight deck to the crew to maintain a pretty good spatial awareness so the question remains why there was there such a loss of awareness. The press seem to have taken a light hearted view but as you say it was extremely good fortune that this did not turn into a more serious incident.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:20
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OK... at first i found this hilarious but i have to show some symapthy for the pilots of the a320.... for the simple reason of the embarassment of having to say "Yes, I was the one who landed the a/c at the wrong airport"... and they are going to get a lot of that from their colleagues...
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:29
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As just a normal member of the occasional flying public and not a pilot...sorry for posting 'arewe nearlythereyet'....I've read all your comments with great interest. I do hope that the attitude that will prevail in the end is one of trying to make this sort of human error easier to avoid rather than one of just blaming the pilots and changing nothing. How often do we see the police after a road accident saying "That's the tenth car that's crashed on this bend this month. These mad drivers need to slow down a bit." Well duh....there's obviously something wrong with the road markings isn't there. I think you pilots do a great job, all things considered, but it is confusing up there and you need all the help you can get from your equipment and from simple visual aids on the ground. I hope you get it.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:34
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What about the pilot concerned?

Anyone know the pilot concerned? Was he experienced or what has he said about the whole story?
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:55
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Originally Posted by teifiboy
...
from the BBC coverage, it was reported that the RAF had not been using the airbase since the 1970s. It is pure good luck therefore that the runway was not littered with dangerous obstructions. The consequences might have been unthinkable. If the worst had happened, do you you think there would still be sympathy for the flight crews' plight?
Don't we have a clear international standard for visually marking closed runways?
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 17:56
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arewenearlythereyet?

For what ever reason, the flight crew screwed up, period. Accept that. Thank God there was nothing heavy ( like a bulldozer ) on the runway.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 18:10
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mbreen,

From what i hear on the grapevine,(Rumour etc.), the poor old boy was due to retire next week.
Unfortunately he may get his gold watch a week early.
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 18:20
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latest i hear they are striping out the galleys and seats to get it out of there for the perf

not nice for the crew and we can all pontificate as much as we like so arewethereyet wind your neck in
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 18:50
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you flyboys have been doing this quite a bit, haven't you??!!

http://www.thirdamendment.com/wrongway.html
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Old 30th Mar 2006, 18:54
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I believe it departed last night ( Wednesday ) to Liverpool.

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Old 30th Mar 2006, 19:05
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I'm not a pilot so can't comment on the "blame" issues, but am concerned from the safety aspect concerning fire cover and the state of the runway - ie how often is the runway inspected and what level of fire cover is available - I guess being mil. it's not to CAA standards.

So has it departed now?
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