Avro Evacuation at ZRH - Sunday
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Avro Evacuation at ZRH - Sunday
Anyone with any info regarding the above?
Just heard that one of the Swiss ARJ's had a 'smoke event' coming in from Paris. Evac'd on taxiway apparently.
This is a genuine enquiry, and not intended to sling mud!
BD
Just heard that one of the Swiss ARJ's had a 'smoke event' coming in from Paris. Evac'd on taxiway apparently.
This is a genuine enquiry, and not intended to sling mud!
BD
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And here's a loose translation of said article:
Cause of smoke aboard a Swiss Jumbolino still unclear. The BFU (AAIB) has launched an investigation. Head of BFU Jean Overney mentioned first taking the case to experts (?), and not knowing how long the investigation would take.
The Swiss machine, inbound from Paris, arrived at Zurich on Sunday. As smoke developed inside the aircraft, all 95 pax and 4 crew had to evacuate using the slides. As a safety measure, the fire brigade attended.
A similar case happened more than 3 month ago, at the beginning of December: A Jumbolino had to return after take-off following smoke appeared on the fdk. The reason was an oil leak in an engine.
Though both machines involved were Jumbolinos, the one of Sunday's evacuation was an Avro RJ100, the one in December of the smaller type Avro 146 R (ARJ85 probably meant)
Cause of smoke aboard a Swiss Jumbolino still unclear. The BFU (AAIB) has launched an investigation. Head of BFU Jean Overney mentioned first taking the case to experts (?), and not knowing how long the investigation would take.
The Swiss machine, inbound from Paris, arrived at Zurich on Sunday. As smoke developed inside the aircraft, all 95 pax and 4 crew had to evacuate using the slides. As a safety measure, the fire brigade attended.
A similar case happened more than 3 month ago, at the beginning of December: A Jumbolino had to return after take-off following smoke appeared on the fdk. The reason was an oil leak in an engine.
Though both machines involved were Jumbolinos, the one of Sunday's evacuation was an Avro RJ100, the one in December of the smaller type Avro 146 R (ARJ85 probably meant)
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Doesn't matter who operates these aircraft, smoke will always appear in strange ways due to the poor design of the pnuematic system, awful engines and tardy APU...Good old British design!
It would be good to know if it was one of BACX's machines?
It would be good to know if it was one of BACX's machines?
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Dani
In other words Dani this one
But the newspaper says that it was an RJ100 and this is - whereas the December one was an RJ85. Or is that what you were saying and I am just misinterpreting your words - that I think say the contrary.
If memory serves IXS is not a BA machine but an old Crossair.
Sorry gofer
But the newspaper says that it was an RJ100 and this is - whereas the December one was an RJ85. Or is that what you were saying and I am just misinterpreting your words - that I think say the contrary.
If memory serves IXS is not a BA machine but an old Crossair.
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was working that day. my impression on the radio was, that the crew sounded very calm. they reported smoke during roll-out and decided to take the first one right (twy h1), came to a stop. one a/c landed behind (minimum separation), then about 8 g/a... (although a/c was parked on a twy and rwy was clear, probably safety measure).
after they came to a stop, they had the impression that conditions obviously improved as the crew asked to taxi to the gate, which they were not allowed to. had to change frequency then.
after they came to a stop, they had the impression that conditions obviously improved as the crew asked to taxi to the gate, which they were not allowed to. had to change frequency then.
Some time ago another SWISS RJ landing in LGAV reported smoke and ask for emergecy crew presence at the landing.
I don't remember the date though...
Rwy in Sight
I don't remember the date though...
Rwy in Sight
Last edited by Rwy in Sight; 28th Mar 2006 at 05:05.
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I'm sorry I caused some confusion. Of course IXS is ex-CRX, it is an RJ100 and the old incident was an RJ85.
I agree that those two incidents might not be the only one (although I don't have any numbers). The ball bearings of the Lycoming engine is often losing oil, that's why smoke or "bad socks smell" is pretty common on this type - you all know the court cases of passengers and cabin attendants. But obviously the Avro is not the only aircraft with this problem.
Dani
I agree that those two incidents might not be the only one (although I don't have any numbers). The ball bearings of the Lycoming engine is often losing oil, that's why smoke or "bad socks smell" is pretty common on this type - you all know the court cases of passengers and cabin attendants. But obviously the Avro is not the only aircraft with this problem.
Dani
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With smoke you have to think of the heirarchy Voeni, like what stages has the air gone through before it arrives in the cabin/cockpit, and what potential smoke sources exist? A leaking engine bleed seal for example will fill the whole aircraft with smoke and trigger all kinds of warnings from lav to cargo smoke, but they're not the real source.
And if anyone is wondering what a 'Jumbolino' is, it was a name given by the lugubrious Moritz Suter to the BAe 146's, he also called the turboprop Saab 2000 'Concordino', so we call his pilots 'Pilotinos'!
And if anyone is wondering what a 'Jumbolino' is, it was a name given by the lugubrious Moritz Suter to the BAe 146's, he also called the turboprop Saab 2000 'Concordino', so we call his pilots 'Pilotinos'!
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...another self-explanatory remark from Aeropers 
Voeni, why is smoke in the cockpit not possible from the engine? Smoke has the remarkable property to propagate. So even in an aircraft from your world there is one pack of one engine delivering air to the cabin, the other to the cockpit. I know, your background is the knowledge of MUC MD80 and SR111, where the smoke source laid within the cockpit. That doesn't necessarily mean that it always has to be that way. Think out of the box!
Dani
Voeni, why is smoke in the cockpit not possible from the engine? Smoke has the remarkable property to propagate. So even in an aircraft from your world there is one pack of one engine delivering air to the cabin, the other to the cockpit. I know, your background is the knowledge of MUC MD80 and SR111, where the smoke source laid within the cockpit. That doesn't necessarily mean that it always has to be that way. Think out of the box!
Dani
Last edited by Dani; 25th Mar 2006 at 02:33.
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Junglehead, you're spot-on!
I just hear from people who know it that it was the APU. It happened already once on IXS, last time they didn't know the source and continued with smoke removal. This time the crew was smart enough to realize that it just happened after the APU change-over, and switched APU bleed off, thus smoke disappeared.
The APU is due to be changed now.
Dani
I just hear from people who know it that it was the APU. It happened already once on IXS, last time they didn't know the source and continued with smoke removal. This time the crew was smart enough to realize that it just happened after the APU change-over, and switched APU bleed off, thus smoke disappeared.
The APU is due to be changed now.
Dani
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You're right Dani, no objections. I just said, it "might not have been" the engine, but of course, there's the possibility. At least there was no smoke visible outside the engine cowlings, but as you've said, it's still possible.
I'm looking forward reading the investigation report.
I'm looking forward reading the investigation report.
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Hi all,
One possible cause is to do with de-icing fluid entering the APU exhaust, this has caused a number of a/c (RJ100, BAE146) to divert back into LGW in the last few years due to this causing smoke in the cockpit
One possible cause is to do with de-icing fluid entering the APU exhaust, this has caused a number of a/c (RJ100, BAE146) to divert back into LGW in the last few years due to this causing smoke in the cockpit
Last edited by X ONE; 26th Mar 2006 at 06:56.
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HON 1R, what do you mean by
Frankly, the 146 and its ARJ offspring is an outdated (just look how the fans work
) and over-engineered piece of after War British design. It's only value nowadays lies in short or steep approach ops, such as the LCY, LUG etc.
With LHs credentials, LH South surely could afford some real aeroplanes...
recently
Frankly, the 146 and its ARJ offspring is an outdated (just look how the fans work
) and over-engineered piece of after War British design. It's only value nowadays lies in short or steep approach ops, such as the LCY, LUG etc.With LHs credentials, LH South surely could afford some real aeroplanes...
