Has Ryanair been hacked?
Join Date: Oct 2001
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What??????????????????
£50 for your own resume send by e-mail? Applying for a job is more expensive than flying with them!(which they are getting sponsored for..)Next thing they might do is charge the Cpt for any extra fuel burn more than the flight plan fuel! Beancounter O'Leary will go down in history as the Ultimate Scrooge of 21st century airlines! Oh Molière, rien a changer!!
£50 for your own resume send by e-mail? Applying for a job is more expensive than flying with them!(which they are getting sponsored for..)Next thing they might do is charge the Cpt for any extra fuel burn more than the flight plan fuel! Beancounter O'Leary will go down in history as the Ultimate Scrooge of 21st century airlines! Oh Molière, rien a changer!!
Join Date: Oct 2001
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If it bothers you that much then dont apply. I'm sure there's plenty out there that will. O'Leary may be a 'beancounter' but one thing you can never accuse him of being is stupid. FR are offering an excellent package by industry standards (with the added incentive of job security) £50 is not that much to someone who has spent most of their adult life and a small fortune trying to get into their dream career.
I thank god I'm not in a position to need to apply but there are plenty of people out there that will be grateful for the opportunity
I thank god I'm not in a position to need to apply but there are plenty of people out there that will be grateful for the opportunity
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Pilot Wanted
Please write a blank cheque made payable to Suggs for the following expesnses,
£4,000 PPL (taster)
£50,000 Training Course
£5,000 Accomodation + living expenses
£5,000 MCC Course
£15,000 Type Course
£150 Interview
£50 CV
£***** Cost of lost income
P.S. No garenntee of a job at the end.
Absolutely bloody crazy!
Please write a blank cheque made payable to Suggs for the following expesnses,
£4,000 PPL (taster)
£50,000 Training Course
£5,000 Accomodation + living expenses
£5,000 MCC Course
£15,000 Type Course
£150 Interview
£50 CV
£***** Cost of lost income
P.S. No garenntee of a job at the end.
Absolutely bloody crazy!
Join Date: Jan 2000
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Bill
Read the first post, it want meant to be taken literally, but its near enough right
Suggs
I wrote my cheque, but see ing as though you didnt give an address, I gave the money to my old mother.
Read the first post, it want meant to be taken literally, but its near enough right
Suggs
I wrote my cheque, but see ing as though you didnt give an address, I gave the money to my old mother.
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He's a cute hoor that MOL if ever there was one & from what I hear recently from a number of people who've met him he's even cheesier in real life. The shoes on the other foot now lads and MOLs no eejit, he knows it & he intends like the go getter businessman with the colourful language that he is to milk the situation for what's it worth. Fraid he's pulling the strings so you'se are going to have to play by his tough cookie rules whether you like them or not. Ce la vie!
Emerald
Emerald
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Celtic Emerald I believe the IT business is doing very badly in Ireland. Lot's of workers becoming unemployed. Are you at risk of losing your job? I really hope not. But if you do...well...c'est la vie. 
Join Date: Sep 2000
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Very well put 'Vref+50 and Bill.
At the end of the day, if you don't want to apply if you think it's a ripoff etc,'DON'T!'
O leary or no one is asking or begging you to join them, there are loads of people without jobs that will be happy to have a job with one of the most profitable and secure companies around!
After all it is a buisness they are running not a charity.........
And again, those of you that feel the passion to attack 'the guv' for his contributions instead of coming up with something worthwhile to add to the debate, you are the ones that need a life!
Have a nice day!
At the end of the day, if you don't want to apply if you think it's a ripoff etc,'DON'T!'
O leary or no one is asking or begging you to join them, there are loads of people without jobs that will be happy to have a job with one of the most profitable and secure companies around!
After all it is a buisness they are running not a charity.........
And again, those of you that feel the passion to attack 'the guv' for his contributions instead of coming up with something worthwhile to add to the debate, you are the ones that need a life!
Have a nice day!
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At the moment this wretched little man has you over a barrel, so pay him his £50 and smile.
If you get a job you will have unlimited opportunities to get your own back over the next thirty years.
If you don't get a job with him you will get one somewhere else and then you will have unlimited opportunities to get your own back over the next thirty years.
Aviation has always been a small community with a long memory. What goes around comes around folks!
If you get a job you will have unlimited opportunities to get your own back over the next thirty years.
If you don't get a job with him you will get one somewhere else and then you will have unlimited opportunities to get your own back over the next thirty years.
Aviation has always been a small community with a long memory. What goes around comes around folks!
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I got this 'send us 50 quid or sod off' message from the Ryanair postmaster as well, and almost fell over in disbelief. How would they expect applicants who are applying to even a small a number of different organisations to feel happy about paying for EACH???? I don't very often post on PPrune, but I did want to check the chat carefully to ensure that this wasn't a hoax. I think it's quite outrageous (as far as I know this practice would be totally illegal if they were based in the UK).
So, instead I went to yahoo.com and just typed in 'flight crew jobs'...
I'm still aghast at the arrogance of Ryanair, and it would be natural justice if nobody paid up, but as has been said, it may be a sign of the times.
So, instead I went to yahoo.com and just typed in 'flight crew jobs'...
I'm still aghast at the arrogance of Ryanair, and it would be natural justice if nobody paid up, but as has been said, it may be a sign of the times.
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We all have a choice; pay the money or not.
I enquired of the Employment Service whether the £50, and all the others, was a legitimate expense which they would pay for those in search of gainful emlpoyment. The answer was a profound NO !
If you elect to pay the man his pound of flesh that is your choice, however, if there is one single thing we need right now more than anything it is unity; those folks with jobs should be helping those without jobs and if MOL and his admin staff think it's a good idea to stiff people for money when times are bad.......well, why dont we all simply not bother applying and send the Cvs to Stelios instead ?
When MOL has airplanes he cant crew he'll change his mind.
If you run with him you do nothing more than f**k it up for yourself and everyone else.
Those who say pay the money and get a secure job ? Get a life;nothing in aviation is secure.
I enquired of the Employment Service whether the £50, and all the others, was a legitimate expense which they would pay for those in search of gainful emlpoyment. The answer was a profound NO !
If you elect to pay the man his pound of flesh that is your choice, however, if there is one single thing we need right now more than anything it is unity; those folks with jobs should be helping those without jobs and if MOL and his admin staff think it's a good idea to stiff people for money when times are bad.......well, why dont we all simply not bother applying and send the Cvs to Stelios instead ?
When MOL has airplanes he cant crew he'll change his mind.
If you run with him you do nothing more than f**k it up for yourself and everyone else.
Those who say pay the money and get a secure job ? Get a life;nothing in aviation is secure.
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As I said before, the £50 charge is really just there to make people think twice (or more) before applying and to avoid all of those 'chancer' CVs every airline is inundated with. I'd do the same if I was in his shoes. It means that pretty much every person that's applying is properly qualified and is confident that they would be able to do the job if they get it.
Sure, it will put some people off. But so what? He only needs what, four or at the most five crews for each aircraft, so it's not as if we're talking thousands of pilots required - and given the current market situation I am sure that there will be plenty of suitably qualified applicants.
Given the choice between sitting at home on the rock and roll or paying a few quid and flying again, I know what option I'd take!
Sure, it will put some people off. But so what? He only needs what, four or at the most five crews for each aircraft, so it's not as if we're talking thousands of pilots required - and given the current market situation I am sure that there will be plenty of suitably qualified applicants.
Given the choice between sitting at home on the rock and roll or paying a few quid and flying again, I know what option I'd take!
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Right then, whats this little bit of spare change in my back pocket?
Good old mummy and daddy won't mind if I spend a tad of pocket money.
Hmm... ten possible interviews and sim rides this year at £50 then £150 comes to about £2000... lets get the calculator out - maths was never my strong point. Oh good, that's just a tiny portion of what I've forked out so far, just need to cut back a bit on wifeys expenses and a few less nappies for kiddo there.
Guvnor - if you want 'prima donnas' this seems the way to find them, not what you suggest. Do you really believe that the best pilots are those with the most money to waste? That those more fortunate are BETTER than those who are not? What right thinking person just puts good money after bad into the claws of aviation scavengers/vultures?
One can comprehend the implications of the costs of going through the CVs of time-wasters, which is why the idea of £50 refunds for successful 'interviewees' would seem to be a good idea. Not too sure about the idea of the sim ride cost, perhaps refundable on accepting employment with the company. At least that way the company will not be financing the 'joy-riders' who go along for the sim ride and then turn down the employment opportunity.
Condoning the 'rights' of these money grabbing employers though is absolutely Draconian. Would you have it that the airlines are full of 'Nigels' (no offence meant to anyone of that name)? Would you go back to the days when the only way you could get a job as a shopgirl in Harrods would be to pay them for the privilege of working there? - Watch out boys, do you have your debutante dancing cards & wear only the best make-up!
Despite the fact that some people will pay their money in desperation, poor s*ds, I for one will NOT be amongst them. This can be done in a more correct manner, including the two suggestions above. This leads on to the idea of individual bank loans for the pilots type-rating. This is currently in practise and is fair. It makes absolutely no difference to the employee pilot so long as s/he doesn't leave the company before the loan is paid, because at that point the onus is on her/him to pay it. As I see it, it just proves that the employee shows some degree of integrity, and the employer does not have the hassle of chasing after someone to pay the remains of their decreasing bond.
Let us get some even ground between pilots and airlines. A bit of double-sided empathy,
instead of the current breeding ground of greed and resentment.
Good old mummy and daddy won't mind if I spend a tad of pocket money.
Hmm... ten possible interviews and sim rides this year at £50 then £150 comes to about £2000... lets get the calculator out - maths was never my strong point. Oh good, that's just a tiny portion of what I've forked out so far, just need to cut back a bit on wifeys expenses and a few less nappies for kiddo there.
Guvnor - if you want 'prima donnas' this seems the way to find them, not what you suggest. Do you really believe that the best pilots are those with the most money to waste? That those more fortunate are BETTER than those who are not? What right thinking person just puts good money after bad into the claws of aviation scavengers/vultures?
One can comprehend the implications of the costs of going through the CVs of time-wasters, which is why the idea of £50 refunds for successful 'interviewees' would seem to be a good idea. Not too sure about the idea of the sim ride cost, perhaps refundable on accepting employment with the company. At least that way the company will not be financing the 'joy-riders' who go along for the sim ride and then turn down the employment opportunity.
Condoning the 'rights' of these money grabbing employers though is absolutely Draconian. Would you have it that the airlines are full of 'Nigels' (no offence meant to anyone of that name)? Would you go back to the days when the only way you could get a job as a shopgirl in Harrods would be to pay them for the privilege of working there? - Watch out boys, do you have your debutante dancing cards & wear only the best make-up!
Despite the fact that some people will pay their money in desperation, poor s*ds, I for one will NOT be amongst them. This can be done in a more correct manner, including the two suggestions above. This leads on to the idea of individual bank loans for the pilots type-rating. This is currently in practise and is fair. It makes absolutely no difference to the employee pilot so long as s/he doesn't leave the company before the loan is paid, because at that point the onus is on her/him to pay it. As I see it, it just proves that the employee shows some degree of integrity, and the employer does not have the hassle of chasing after someone to pay the remains of their decreasing bond.
Let us get some even ground between pilots and airlines. A bit of double-sided empathy,
instead of the current breeding ground of greed and resentment.
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Greedy M-Fur's !!!
50 Quid for an ONLINE application !!
THAT is SERIOUSLY taking the **** . What, like it really costs 50 quid (per applicant) for a computer to do an automated search of its database ?
All they gotta do is print out a list of suitable candidates and phone numbers. Probably that will take a maximum of one minute for the whole process !!!
150 Quid for a sim ride !! Why dont they charge you to park in their car park whilst you are at the interview too !!!
Just imagine if all airline employers started to do that. When I finished my frozen ATPL course I struggled to find the money for 150 stamps to post off applications.
I can't imagine how this must make new graduates of flying schools feel. 150 * 50 quid = 7.5k. Yeah, that is just a little extra on top of the 50k+ to get the basic training, right? no one would mind that surely ?
Or would we just let Ryan charge ? It's the principal of it all too.
It wont filter out the unsuitable candidates either. They will still "try it on". We all know that when employers get desperate they reduce the requirements.
PAY FOR YOUR OWN TYPE RATING (BEFORE EMPLOYMENT,TOO) ?
- NOW THAT HAS GOT TO BE A JOKE RIGHT ?
Last time I fly with that bunch of F-ing, cheap skate, theiving gypsy bastard dick-heads. Even if it cost 50p a ticket, I'd rather swim - Less sharks about too.
Except Perhaps imagine this scenario :
We all apply on line,
Pay the 50 quid,
Get the interview,
Check bags in at the Ryan desk,
Go to the bar,
Turn up at the gate at departure +10mins,
Board,
Get a panic attack and decide not to travel,
Get off, bag does also (20 minutes later - after it is found.)
Get on a later flight....Almost....
....Repeat as necessary.... until you have taken the **** out of them as much as you feel that they have taken the **** out of you...
...Arrive in Dublin.
Leave "dodgy looking package" outside Ryan head quarters as you enter the building.
Go to interview and just before you enter the room tell the receptionist that you saw someone leave a package outside and then you saw them drive off in a car.
Have interview.
Tell the guy doing the interview that you lied on your application form and that you love his tie.
Invoice him for your time at the interview and your costs incurred in completing the on-line application, along with an invoice for your suit, shirt, tie, shoes, lunch, and bar bill.
Leave room at some point (possibly soon after entering )
On way out, go to top floor toilet,
Put all plugs in plug holes, turn on taps,
Fly Home.
Now perhaps that would be 50 quid well spent, after all.
When someone says Ryanair to me now I will think of something that starts with "C" and rhymes with PUNTS !!!
50 Quid for an ONLINE application !!
THAT is SERIOUSLY taking the **** . What, like it really costs 50 quid (per applicant) for a computer to do an automated search of its database ?
All they gotta do is print out a list of suitable candidates and phone numbers. Probably that will take a maximum of one minute for the whole process !!!
150 Quid for a sim ride !! Why dont they charge you to park in their car park whilst you are at the interview too !!!
Just imagine if all airline employers started to do that. When I finished my frozen ATPL course I struggled to find the money for 150 stamps to post off applications.
I can't imagine how this must make new graduates of flying schools feel. 150 * 50 quid = 7.5k. Yeah, that is just a little extra on top of the 50k+ to get the basic training, right? no one would mind that surely ?
Or would we just let Ryan charge ? It's the principal of it all too.It wont filter out the unsuitable candidates either. They will still "try it on". We all know that when employers get desperate they reduce the requirements.
PAY FOR YOUR OWN TYPE RATING (BEFORE EMPLOYMENT,TOO) ?
- NOW THAT HAS GOT TO BE A JOKE RIGHT ?
Last time I fly with that bunch of F-ing, cheap skate, theiving gypsy bastard dick-heads. Even if it cost 50p a ticket, I'd rather swim - Less sharks about too.
Except Perhaps imagine this scenario :
We all apply on line,
Pay the 50 quid,
Get the interview,
Check bags in at the Ryan desk,
Go to the bar,
Turn up at the gate at departure +10mins,
Board,
Get a panic attack and decide not to travel,
Get off, bag does also (20 minutes later - after it is found.)
Get on a later flight....Almost....
....Repeat as necessary.... until you have taken the **** out of them as much as you feel that they have taken the **** out of you...
...Arrive in Dublin.
Leave "dodgy looking package" outside Ryan head quarters as you enter the building.
Go to interview and just before you enter the room tell the receptionist that you saw someone leave a package outside and then you saw them drive off in a car.
Have interview.
Tell the guy doing the interview that you lied on your application form and that you love his tie.
Invoice him for your time at the interview and your costs incurred in completing the on-line application, along with an invoice for your suit, shirt, tie, shoes, lunch, and bar bill.
Leave room at some point (possibly soon after entering )
On way out, go to top floor toilet,
Put all plugs in plug holes, turn on taps,
Fly Home.
Now perhaps that would be 50 quid well spent, after all.
When someone says Ryanair to me now I will think of something that starts with "C" and rhymes with PUNTS !!!
Join Date: Apr 2001
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Looks like Invalid Delete is going to be one of the first to literally 'pull the plug' on RyanAir and 'dampen' their spirits.
But have you got the message yet Guvnor and other RyanAir sympathisers?
How long will it take, do you think, for the jokes to become actively practised resentment from a group of disrespected professionals?
(ref bottom page 5)
But have you got the message yet Guvnor and other RyanAir sympathisers? How long will it take, do you think, for the jokes to become actively practised resentment from a group of disrespected professionals?
(ref bottom page 5)
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Interesting, this matter of the airline demanding money up front for the privelige of working for them. But this sort of practice is actually very common in the business world. Usually its called 'buying a franchise'. For instance, if you were now qualified to sell financial services products (having passed all the necessary exams, etc) and applied to Zurich for a job, they will actually charge you £2,500 (the last figure I heard) to do the Franchisee induction course.
Looking back through history, too, one could buy a commission in the regiment of your choice. This would then entitle you to do the job, wear the uniform, and also get paid etc.
However, having stumped up with the cash to buy the position then you should be actually entitled TO SELL THE JOB ON (AT THE GOING MARKET RATE) to anyone who might be interested later.
Looking back through history, too, one could buy a commission in the regiment of your choice. This would then entitle you to do the job, wear the uniform, and also get paid etc.
However, having stumped up with the cash to buy the position then you should be actually entitled TO SELL THE JOB ON (AT THE GOING MARKET RATE) to anyone who might be interested later.
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I think this might also have something to do with trying to make as much money as possible other than from charging pax fares.
The more revenue they can generate from other sources, the easier it is for the airline to maintain low airfares, and thus maintain loyalty from the punters.
You as pilots may find the practise disgusting, but it actually makes good business sense.
And despite many saying they won't now apply to Ryanair/fly Ryanair, the fact is there are many more that will, for many reasons, and the charges won't put them off.
That's the reality.
Regards
The more revenue they can generate from other sources, the easier it is for the airline to maintain low airfares, and thus maintain loyalty from the punters.
You as pilots may find the practise disgusting, but it actually makes good business sense.
And despite many saying they won't now apply to Ryanair/fly Ryanair, the fact is there are many more that will, for many reasons, and the charges won't put them off.
That's the reality.
Regards
Thread Starter
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AJ, it doesn't make good business sense at all.
With the policies Ryanair have now adopted, they will end up with pilots (if they get any) who have no sense of loyalty at all. Since they have been taught that the general principle in Ryanair is "Shaft them before they shaft you", when the boot is on the other foot as sooner or later it will be, they will get their revenge. Far more sensible is to engender a sense of loyalty in your staff, and have them defend you to the last breath, and want to work for you whatever.
Furthermore, since they will not be bonded if they are having to pay for their ratings, and, a year or so down the line, with poor pay and conditions, but with a popular type rating and heading for 1000 hours jet time under their belt, they will be out of the door in seconds.
Recruitment costs money. Not just type training, but in using up valuable resources (training captains' time, sim time, difficulties with rostering if you have to pair an inexperienced pilot only with a senior one, etc. etc.
Lose an experienced, qualified pilot, and you have to pay just to replace him/her with an inexperienced one.
This does not make good business sense. Ryanair are storing up many many problems for themselves in the future for simply short-term gain and the pleasure of kicking their workforce simply because they can.
With the policies Ryanair have now adopted, they will end up with pilots (if they get any) who have no sense of loyalty at all. Since they have been taught that the general principle in Ryanair is "Shaft them before they shaft you", when the boot is on the other foot as sooner or later it will be, they will get their revenge. Far more sensible is to engender a sense of loyalty in your staff, and have them defend you to the last breath, and want to work for you whatever.
Furthermore, since they will not be bonded if they are having to pay for their ratings, and, a year or so down the line, with poor pay and conditions, but with a popular type rating and heading for 1000 hours jet time under their belt, they will be out of the door in seconds.
Recruitment costs money. Not just type training, but in using up valuable resources (training captains' time, sim time, difficulties with rostering if you have to pair an inexperienced pilot only with a senior one, etc. etc.
Lose an experienced, qualified pilot, and you have to pay just to replace him/her with an inexperienced one.
This does not make good business sense. Ryanair are storing up many many problems for themselves in the future for simply short-term gain and the pleasure of kicking their workforce simply because they can.
