O'Leary going to Jail?
I call you back
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This is a stunning victory for Ryanair
the good lads and lasses at Aer Lingus flight crew, without whose deep pockets
Might I suggest setting up a low-cost legal/spinning firm as FR shareholders must be getting tired of watching mountains of cash being spent on more stunning victories.
Maith thú John.
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Leo
Whatever about you Leo, none of the press seem to agree. So it looks like you are again out of step with both your so-called "pilot colleagues" (really!!??) and public opinion. You must think we are all complete idiots to believe anything you say. BTW, do you happen to know this fellow:
The_Bean_Counter who says
I cannot track down the source of this notion. Can you advise where this bit of news comes from ....??
This is a stunning victory for Ryanair
The_Bean_Counter who says
Ryanair have agreed to pay a sum equivalent to 50% of the complainants costs
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delwy
Happy to oblige, the source was an RTE Aertel teletext report of the case outcome which appeared yesterday, unfortunately it is no longer there and I cannot provide a link as the RTE website appears to have no archive
Happy to oblige, the source was an RTE Aertel teletext report of the case outcome which appeared yesterday, unfortunately it is no longer there and I cannot provide a link as the RTE website appears to have no archive
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A more detailed report
Here's some reaction from the main morning news programme on RTE Radio (Morning Ireland, Thursday 9th June):
170 complaints against Ryanair says IALPA
Captain Evan Cullen of the Irish Air Line Pilots' Association discusses the implications for other pilots of the settlement for pilot John Goss following High Court action against Ryanair.
Audio file here
And below is a more detailed report from The Irish Times. Interesingly, the lawyers did entirely wrap up the main case: it comes up again in a month's time, at which point they can seek to "vacate" the orders and abandon the contempt proceedings (don't ya just love legalese?). So if there's any rowing-back by Ryanair, or if they don't comply with the agreement, the proceedings will not have be re-started from scratch.
Then there is the earlier case, in which attachment/jailing of MOL et al were sought for non-compliance with the interim injunction(because Capt Goss had been restored straight away to flying duties while the main case was pending, as ordered by the Court). This will have to go back to the other High Court judge who originally heard it, in order to be terminated. But that's a technicality, as abandoning it is clearly covered in the agreement. A deal which, as has been pointed out, clearly has the standard non-disclosure clause. So any crowing or spinning has to be done rather cleverly or indirectly...
Shamrock 602
Ryanair row with senior pilot 'entirely resolved'
Irish Times, Thursday 9th June 2005
The legal dispute between Ryanair and one of its senior pilots, Captain John Goss, has been "entirely resolved", the High Court was told yesterday [Wed 8th June]. The terms of settlement were not disclosed.
On the sixth day of the hearing of the proceedings yesterday, Mr Justice Declan Budd was told that the parties had agreed the terms of settlement, which were received by the court but not outlined.
It is thought that Ryanair has agreed to pay the legal costs of Capt Goss which, together with the airline's own legal costs, could amount to legal fees of as much as €800,000. It is also believed that the company's disciplinary proceedings against the pilot have been withdrawn and that he will be trained on new Ryanair aircraft at Dublin.
It is understood the pilot has been given a guarantee that he will be based in Dublin for the period ahead.
Mr Justice Budd was also told told that an application will be made to another High Court judge, Mr Justice Barry White, not to give his judgment in related proceedings brought by Capt Goss seeking to have Ryanair chief executive Michael O'Leary and two other company executives jailed for alleged contempt of a court order.
Mr Justice White heard the contempt proceedings last month but deferred his judgment until the outcome of the hearing before Mr Justice Budd.
In the case before Mr Justice Budd, Capt Goss claimed Ryanair made serious allegations in a letter of December 10th, 2004, that he intimidated other pilots at Stansted airport and had warned them not to accept positions on the company's new Boeing 737-800 based in Dublin. He denied making any such allegations and denied any intimidation. He claimed the company alleged he failed to co-operate and they had initiated disciplinary proceedings against him.
He was suspended by the company but reinstated after he brought the High Court proceedings heard by Mr Justice White.
After yesterday's settlement, Ryanair spokesman Capt David O'Brien, director of flight operations, said he looked forward to Capt Goss flying again with the company.
He said he was pleased the pilot had withdrawn and abandoned all his claims and was delighted with what was an "excellent settlement". Asked if the company would recognise Ialpa - the pilots' organisation - Capt O'Brien said it never had and was not expected to in the future.
Capt Goss told reporters that he was very pleased to be returning to flying duties and delighted that his good name had been vindicated. He regretted that his difficulties with Ryanair management had to be settled in the High Court.
Earlier, when announcing the settlement to Mr Justice Budd, Mr Roddy Horan SC, for Capt Goss, said they were not looking for an order from the court but asked for the matter to be adjourned to a later date when they would apply for the vacation of various orders and for abandonment of contempt of court applications as part of the settlement.
Mr Justice Budd said one of these applications had been adjourned for him to hear at the end of the proceedings brought by Capt Goss. The judge also asked counsel not to lose sight of the fact that one of the contempt motions was before Mr Justice White.
Mr Richard Nesbitt SC, for Ryanair, said that the latter issue was being dealt with in the settlement agreement. Counsel for both sides would need to mention it to Mr Justice White and would be asking him not to deliver his judgment. Mr Horan said the sides had devised a mechanism which they hoped would address the matter.
Mr Justice Budd adjourned the matter until June 29th. He said both parties were to be congratulated on the settlement and on taking a "cool look" at the matter.
170 complaints against Ryanair says IALPA
Captain Evan Cullen of the Irish Air Line Pilots' Association discusses the implications for other pilots of the settlement for pilot John Goss following High Court action against Ryanair.
Audio file here
And below is a more detailed report from The Irish Times. Interesingly, the lawyers did entirely wrap up the main case: it comes up again in a month's time, at which point they can seek to "vacate" the orders and abandon the contempt proceedings (don't ya just love legalese?). So if there's any rowing-back by Ryanair, or if they don't comply with the agreement, the proceedings will not have be re-started from scratch.
Then there is the earlier case, in which attachment/jailing of MOL et al were sought for non-compliance with the interim injunction(because Capt Goss had been restored straight away to flying duties while the main case was pending, as ordered by the Court). This will have to go back to the other High Court judge who originally heard it, in order to be terminated. But that's a technicality, as abandoning it is clearly covered in the agreement. A deal which, as has been pointed out, clearly has the standard non-disclosure clause. So any crowing or spinning has to be done rather cleverly or indirectly...
Shamrock 602
Ryanair row with senior pilot 'entirely resolved'
Irish Times, Thursday 9th June 2005
The legal dispute between Ryanair and one of its senior pilots, Captain John Goss, has been "entirely resolved", the High Court was told yesterday [Wed 8th June]. The terms of settlement were not disclosed.
On the sixth day of the hearing of the proceedings yesterday, Mr Justice Declan Budd was told that the parties had agreed the terms of settlement, which were received by the court but not outlined.
It is thought that Ryanair has agreed to pay the legal costs of Capt Goss which, together with the airline's own legal costs, could amount to legal fees of as much as €800,000. It is also believed that the company's disciplinary proceedings against the pilot have been withdrawn and that he will be trained on new Ryanair aircraft at Dublin.
It is understood the pilot has been given a guarantee that he will be based in Dublin for the period ahead.
Mr Justice Budd was also told told that an application will be made to another High Court judge, Mr Justice Barry White, not to give his judgment in related proceedings brought by Capt Goss seeking to have Ryanair chief executive Michael O'Leary and two other company executives jailed for alleged contempt of a court order.
Mr Justice White heard the contempt proceedings last month but deferred his judgment until the outcome of the hearing before Mr Justice Budd.
In the case before Mr Justice Budd, Capt Goss claimed Ryanair made serious allegations in a letter of December 10th, 2004, that he intimidated other pilots at Stansted airport and had warned them not to accept positions on the company's new Boeing 737-800 based in Dublin. He denied making any such allegations and denied any intimidation. He claimed the company alleged he failed to co-operate and they had initiated disciplinary proceedings against him.
He was suspended by the company but reinstated after he brought the High Court proceedings heard by Mr Justice White.
After yesterday's settlement, Ryanair spokesman Capt David O'Brien, director of flight operations, said he looked forward to Capt Goss flying again with the company.
He said he was pleased the pilot had withdrawn and abandoned all his claims and was delighted with what was an "excellent settlement". Asked if the company would recognise Ialpa - the pilots' organisation - Capt O'Brien said it never had and was not expected to in the future.
Capt Goss told reporters that he was very pleased to be returning to flying duties and delighted that his good name had been vindicated. He regretted that his difficulties with Ryanair management had to be settled in the High Court.
Earlier, when announcing the settlement to Mr Justice Budd, Mr Roddy Horan SC, for Capt Goss, said they were not looking for an order from the court but asked for the matter to be adjourned to a later date when they would apply for the vacation of various orders and for abandonment of contempt of court applications as part of the settlement.
Mr Justice Budd said one of these applications had been adjourned for him to hear at the end of the proceedings brought by Capt Goss. The judge also asked counsel not to lose sight of the fact that one of the contempt motions was before Mr Justice White.
Mr Richard Nesbitt SC, for Ryanair, said that the latter issue was being dealt with in the settlement agreement. Counsel for both sides would need to mention it to Mr Justice White and would be asking him not to deliver his judgment. Mr Horan said the sides had devised a mechanism which they hoped would address the matter.
Mr Justice Budd adjourned the matter until June 29th. He said both parties were to be congratulated on the settlement and on taking a "cool look" at the matter.
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The grape vine is buzzing with further details of this deal.
Not quite true Leo. Can't say more than that right now - I'm waiting for further corroboration, but the terms are NOTHING LIKE the original offer if my info is correct.
Care to comment now, before the whole truth is revealed and you get egg on your face?
The pilot has agreed to undergo conversion training for the new 737-800 planes under the terms of the original offer made last November.
Care to comment now, before the whole truth is revealed and you get egg on your face?
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Maybe somebody(LEO?)can educate me in the finer detail of tax-deductable items for corporate tax,but I fail to see what the **** Ryanair think they achieved by giving 800,000 bloody Euros to these parasites(with deepest apologies to"Flying Lawyer" if he is reading this thread )when all that seems to have been achieved is more bad press in PPRuNe & the press in general at a time when new aircraft are coming at us from Seattle like a scheduled service; sorry if I'm missing something obvious Hairy but are we not supposed to be attracting new bums-on-seats not convincing them that RYR is "not" the place to go?
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Wrapping up the case (for now)
As a postcript to the last few months down at Four Courts, the threat to jail Michael O'Leary for contempt of court has been lifted. It had to go back to the original judge in order to terminate the process. Report from RTE here .
Interestingly, the report says:
"Judge White said that if he had concluded there had been a serious contempt of court he would not agree to the application [to end the contempt proceedings] made to him by both sides, but he had not reached that conclusion and therefore acceded to the application.
Shamrock 602
Interestingly, the report says:
"Judge White said that if he had concluded there had been a serious contempt of court he would not agree to the application [to end the contempt proceedings] made to him by both sides, but he had not reached that conclusion and therefore acceded to the application.
Shamrock 602
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Ryanair’s Director of Flight and Ground Operations, David O’Brien, said: "I am delighted with this morning's finding which follows this week's excellent settlement of the dispute between Captain Goss and Ryanair.
"Captain Goss will shortly commence retraining on Ryanair’s new 737-800 series aircraft on the exact terms that were offered to him last November and which were opposed by IALPA (the pilots' union).
"This morning’s decision is another defeat for IALPA in its continuing effort to mislead Ryanair’s Dublin pilots. I look forward to resuming direct negotiations with our Dublin pilots without any further intermeddling by IALPA in this process".
"Captain Goss will shortly commence retraining on Ryanair’s new 737-800 series aircraft on the exact terms that were offered to him last November and which were opposed by IALPA (the pilots' union).
"This morning’s decision is another defeat for IALPA in its continuing effort to mislead Ryanair’s Dublin pilots. I look forward to resuming direct negotiations with our Dublin pilots without any further intermeddling by IALPA in this process".
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i love the way both wilson and o'brien use the phrase "intermeddling" in interviews.a phrase not so original as it was coined by their boss m o'l.the only difference being he can make up his own speak whereas the good ol' boys just try to imitate him.pathetic losers!
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This is a stunning victory for Ryanair and those of us within it who hold the prospect of union recognition in the same boundless joy usually reserved for pancreatic carcinoma.
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More detail on settlement
Here's a bit more detail about the settlement, from yesterday's High Court hearing in Dublin in which contempt proceedings were ended at the request of both parties.
The extract is from the report in The Irish Times of Saturday 11th June 2005
Shamrock 602
Mr Justice White said that, had he come to the conclusion there had been a serious contempt, he would not agree to the application not to give judgment.
The judge said he had concluded it had been appropriate for Capt Goss to bring the matter to the court's attention.
However, the judge said he had not concluded there had been a contempt of court and, in the circumstances, he would accede to the application.
It emerged yesterday that the terms of settlement between Capt Goss and Ryanair contained a clause that Capt Goss's employment "as a pilot in command will continue", and that Ryanair would make a contribution of €200,000 towards his legal costs, plus VAT.
In respect of the company's offer of conversion training on its new aircraft, the Boeing 737-800, Capt Goss had accepted the offer in the terms of a company letter of November 17th, 2004.
Accommodation during training would be at Capt Goss's expense.
(In evidence during the hearing before Mr Justice Budd, Capt Goss had said senior pilots regarded the offer in that letter as punitive and believed they were being bullied and intimidated. Under the terms of the offer, the pilots argued they would be bonded for five years following training and, if they left within that period, they would have to pay €15,000 to Ryanair.)
The settlement also contained a statement that Ryanair would not initiate disciplinary/dismissal action against Capt Goss "in the absence of valid and substantial grounds as would apply to all Ryanair employees".
Captain Goss also agreed to withdraw all his claims of victimisation or intimidation.
Ryanair judicial review
In separate proceedings involving Ryanair yesterday, Mr Justice Michael Hanna reserved judgment on the airline's challenge to a Labour Court finding that it had jurisdiction to hear complaints by pilots against Ryanair.
The company is challenging a finding by the Labour Court that there is a trade dispute between Ryanair and the trade union IMPACT, which represents the Irish Airline Pilots Association.
The extract is from the report in The Irish Times of Saturday 11th June 2005
Shamrock 602
Mr Justice White said that, had he come to the conclusion there had been a serious contempt, he would not agree to the application not to give judgment.
The judge said he had concluded it had been appropriate for Capt Goss to bring the matter to the court's attention.
However, the judge said he had not concluded there had been a contempt of court and, in the circumstances, he would accede to the application.
It emerged yesterday that the terms of settlement between Capt Goss and Ryanair contained a clause that Capt Goss's employment "as a pilot in command will continue", and that Ryanair would make a contribution of €200,000 towards his legal costs, plus VAT.
In respect of the company's offer of conversion training on its new aircraft, the Boeing 737-800, Capt Goss had accepted the offer in the terms of a company letter of November 17th, 2004.
Accommodation during training would be at Capt Goss's expense.
(In evidence during the hearing before Mr Justice Budd, Capt Goss had said senior pilots regarded the offer in that letter as punitive and believed they were being bullied and intimidated. Under the terms of the offer, the pilots argued they would be bonded for five years following training and, if they left within that period, they would have to pay €15,000 to Ryanair.)
The settlement also contained a statement that Ryanair would not initiate disciplinary/dismissal action against Capt Goss "in the absence of valid and substantial grounds as would apply to all Ryanair employees".
Captain Goss also agreed to withdraw all his claims of victimisation or intimidation.
Ryanair judicial review
In separate proceedings involving Ryanair yesterday, Mr Justice Michael Hanna reserved judgment on the airline's challenge to a Labour Court finding that it had jurisdiction to hear complaints by pilots against Ryanair.
The company is challenging a finding by the Labour Court that there is a trade dispute between Ryanair and the trade union IMPACT, which represents the Irish Airline Pilots Association.
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Welcome back to the Ryanair Supporters Club
Welcome back Hansol.
Now can you tell me something? Why is that yourself and a number of other members of the "Ryanair supporters club" suddenly disappeared, literally overnight? As the coincidence would have it, that was around the time Ryanair started having some problems with the courts in Dublin, if I remember correctly.
Then, suddenly, you all start appearing over the week following the settlement of the case against Captain Goss, clearly with a view to declaring victory in that disasterous enterprise! Leo led the charge and you, like a proper courtier, follow obediently. Is there is no sense of shame or embarassment to be found anywhere in the organisation!?
Now can you tell me something? Why is that yourself and a number of other members of the "Ryanair supporters club" suddenly disappeared, literally overnight? As the coincidence would have it, that was around the time Ryanair started having some problems with the courts in Dublin, if I remember correctly.
Then, suddenly, you all start appearing over the week following the settlement of the case against Captain Goss, clearly with a view to declaring victory in that disasterous enterprise! Leo led the charge and you, like a proper courtier, follow obediently. Is there is no sense of shame or embarassment to be found anywhere in the organisation!?
