bmibaby Ops Dir resigns (Who shot JR?)

[acbus1]

You are quite correct that the new guys/gals are as capable as any of the staff......

Disagree!

That's like saying that a newly qualified car driver would be able to cope with abnormal situations as well as a driver who'd held a Driving Licence for decades.

Common sense tells us that the experienced driver would, over a range of situations, measuring the overall average performance, cope better. He/she might rescue a situation and avoid an accident which the newly qualified driver would'nt. The experienced driver might even anticipate a problem and avoid it altogether, whilst the newly qualified would sail into the situation, blissfully unaware.

Hence my argument that high pilot turnover is bad news.

It's common sense, lets face it.

It's also what I've observed to be true, without question, based upon decades of watching it go on from the sharp end.


PS -- I've no doubt, whatsoever, that you could twist my analogy in order to suit your own particular viewpoint, but you ain't fooling most of the people reading this thread.

Experience counts!

[Anne.Nonymous]

Acbus

You may disagree but what you have not taken any account of is that, unlike new car drivers, the new pilots have to acheive a set standard before they are allowed to join the company. Recent intake have been pilots with years of experience from Maersk / Duo. The most recent have been jet Captains from bmiRegional. As you say experience counts but, with your favourite myopic view, you fail to recognise that these are all experienced pilots.

Hence my argument that high pilot turnover is bad news. is a falsehood if you replace like with like.

You may have seen it all 'from decades in the sharp end' but so have I and, unlike you, I am still working for bmi. What I can tell you is that every one of the new pilots into baby is of the highest quality. The base training is good and they get excellent line training to ensure they are fully up to speed.

Anne

[acbus1]

......the new pilots have to acheive a set standard before they are allowed to join the company.

That standard has varied enourmously over the years, with market conditions and pilot turnover being one of the major influences.

My experience during periods of high pilot turnover/shortage of supply is that recruited pilot standards fall, both in terms of ability and in terms of experience.

One Chief Pilot was once quoted, by several witnesses, as stating that the only objective was to put "bums on seats".

So much for "set standards"!

[Krysten]

Anne

These experienced jet captains from bmi Regional....do they include the one who didn't quite make the grade as a captain with baby and actually struggled to get through in the RHS?

Baby have a big problem with recruitment/retention, training and the maintenance of "standards". Not ability per se, but keeping everyone operating to the same procedures is proving difficult. This is due, mostly, to the high turnover and the dearth of experienced and motivated trainers.

ACBus may have other issues but he is not far off the mark on this one.

[alterego]

Guys/Gals

Have to say I think we are arguing about the same thing.

Yes, the majority of the new pilots are very capable but no, they do not have the extra benefit of experience.

Retention is better than recruitment, even TB has inferred this in today's E-mail (purely on the theme of roster disruption).

[salapilot]

I’m a lour hour pilot and desperate to get into baby. I'm also a senior manager within my organisation and have to concur that you can’t beat experience, and a high turnover of staff is always a problem for us, as the training can take up to 2 months. Now when you add in the cost of all this, I would always try and retain staff. You can’t always count on people moving onto bigger and better things, but you can create an atmosphere within a company to make employees feel valued, listened to and respected. Then again I’ve also come to realise that no matter what you do, you'll always have some moaners for the sake of it and there isn't a company in the world that hasn't got them !

sp

[I.C.Nosignal]

or have got rid of them (and the rest of the world gets to hear about how "awful" they are for ever more!!)

[alterego]

There are problems at baby at present.

The trouble now is that too many guys have heard too many promises which have achieved nothing. Many guys I fly with day today are actively looking elsewhere.

Management have not sent BALPA details they promised but have sent some kind of apology. This for a paydeal due last April. Whoever is/was to blame, the men in the Pathfinder building need to understand the desparation that they are about to find themselves in. There are so many good guys with interviews/sim rides that it is hard to see how the programme will not be affected.

[Arkroyal]

I’m a lour hour pilot and desperate to get into baby.

but you can create an atmosphere within a company to make employees feel valued, listened to and respected.

If the former is true, and you are looking for the latter. You are barking up the wrong tree, old son.

[Banzai Eagle]

how many pilots are there at Baby vv how many aircraft would give us outsiders an insight into the beef of the problem

[alterego]

Not sure of total numbers but in CWL there are 2 A/C.

Based there are 7 Captains, 1 Captain who flys only in RHS & 10 First Officers.

This seems to add to thetheory that you can get qualified guys/gals but not experienced ones.