Gimme, gimme - I'm a BA pilot!
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I think that most people would agree that the pilot whose letter was published in the "friday firelighter" is as ignorant as he is greedy, and i'm convinced they published it to make him look like a complete t*ss*r in front of the entire airline!!
On the wider issue of airline pilot remuneration please consider this;
(British Airways) flightcrew today earn considerably more than their predessessors(?) 20+ years ago. Gross salaries are higher in real terms, and net income is A LOT higher due to the fact that the higher rate of income tax used to be 60%, and there was no cap on NI contributions. (Why do you think film stars like Michael Caine p*ss*d off to America, and then returned in the mid 80's when the tax/NI rates were cut!)Also there was no such thing as profit share.
My father was a F/E at BA for 25 years, and a total 30 years with the company. The pension he now receives is a fraction of the pensions that comparable new retirees are getting. Some of this can be accounted for by depreciation due to the system of determining the annual increase (using the inflation figure and not average earnings)but the rest is due to the good percentage increases flightcrew have had over the intervening years. Remember each % increase is worth a lot more the higher your salary is to begin with, e.g 5% of £100k yields a larger pay rise than 5% of £20k!!
I am a F/E myself, although I am not with BA, I earn less than my equivalent in BA but it is still, I think, a damn good salary. I am always amazed at the greed displayed by a number of pilots from time to time.
FLIGHTCREWS SHOULD (AND DO) EARN GOOD MONEY for reasons that are obvious to us all.
Some people will argue that salaries should be higher due to productivity increases ( more flying hours/sectors per annum) This is true to a point, but remember that the older aircraft e.g Boeing 707, were much harder work to operate- with much less automation and were much more prone to tech problems such as engine failures and such like. Also some of the duty days were very long, multiple sectors, 12-16 hours without a heavy crew, and trips were longer, up to 3 weeks away. Makes those crew whinging today about big double digit increases look a bit pathetic doesn't it? A lot of big jet drivers today, mainly those who are ex sponsored cadets who did not have to go deep into debt to finance their career ambitions, or work their way up via the regional airline slave route DO NOT KNOW WHEN THEY ARE WELL OFF!!
On the wider issue of airline pilot remuneration please consider this;
(British Airways) flightcrew today earn considerably more than their predessessors(?) 20+ years ago. Gross salaries are higher in real terms, and net income is A LOT higher due to the fact that the higher rate of income tax used to be 60%, and there was no cap on NI contributions. (Why do you think film stars like Michael Caine p*ss*d off to America, and then returned in the mid 80's when the tax/NI rates were cut!)Also there was no such thing as profit share.
My father was a F/E at BA for 25 years, and a total 30 years with the company. The pension he now receives is a fraction of the pensions that comparable new retirees are getting. Some of this can be accounted for by depreciation due to the system of determining the annual increase (using the inflation figure and not average earnings)but the rest is due to the good percentage increases flightcrew have had over the intervening years. Remember each % increase is worth a lot more the higher your salary is to begin with, e.g 5% of £100k yields a larger pay rise than 5% of £20k!!
I am a F/E myself, although I am not with BA, I earn less than my equivalent in BA but it is still, I think, a damn good salary. I am always amazed at the greed displayed by a number of pilots from time to time.
FLIGHTCREWS SHOULD (AND DO) EARN GOOD MONEY for reasons that are obvious to us all.
Some people will argue that salaries should be higher due to productivity increases ( more flying hours/sectors per annum) This is true to a point, but remember that the older aircraft e.g Boeing 707, were much harder work to operate- with much less automation and were much more prone to tech problems such as engine failures and such like. Also some of the duty days were very long, multiple sectors, 12-16 hours without a heavy crew, and trips were longer, up to 3 weeks away. Makes those crew whinging today about big double digit increases look a bit pathetic doesn't it? A lot of big jet drivers today, mainly those who are ex sponsored cadets who did not have to go deep into debt to finance their career ambitions, or work their way up via the regional airline slave route DO NOT KNOW WHEN THEY ARE WELL OFF!!
Controversial, moi?
Basil
I think you are drifting somewhat off the point. Bourbon started this thread with the deliberate intention of attacking BA pilots in general for the rather tenuous reason that one person had written an ill-considered letter to BA News. I am not sure why he feels the way he does and alludes to the fact that he is a BA pilot himself but has not always been. Perhaps he is disgruntled because he didn't want to join BA but has found his company taken over, we will never know. But his offensively worded titling of this thread and his subsequent attack on me and my many decent colleagues could not go unchallenged.
I cannot disagree with much of your post but equally much of what you say goes for every other profession/trade etc. in the UK. My father was a board member of a substantial UK company and compared with today his remuneration and pension were poor but on the other hand his council tax was not in four figures and did not increase by many times the rate of inflation each year nor did he pay £4.00 a gallon for fuel. I fear the comparisons are an irrelevance.
Nobody is claiming that relatively speaking we are not well off (although compared to equivalent jobs of responsibility it is arguable) but I do not see why I should not aspire to be paid the market rate for the job.
Finally you claim that the job is now much easier. I agree that the aeroplanes are easier to manage and offer better reliability but in other areas such as congested airspace, 4+ sector days, minimum slips at destinations the modern job is much more demanding.
To return to my original point all this is an irrelevance. Bourbon made an unpleasant and untrue attack on me and my colleagues and I could not let that go unchallenged.
I think you are drifting somewhat off the point. Bourbon started this thread with the deliberate intention of attacking BA pilots in general for the rather tenuous reason that one person had written an ill-considered letter to BA News. I am not sure why he feels the way he does and alludes to the fact that he is a BA pilot himself but has not always been. Perhaps he is disgruntled because he didn't want to join BA but has found his company taken over, we will never know. But his offensively worded titling of this thread and his subsequent attack on me and my many decent colleagues could not go unchallenged.
I cannot disagree with much of your post but equally much of what you say goes for every other profession/trade etc. in the UK. My father was a board member of a substantial UK company and compared with today his remuneration and pension were poor but on the other hand his council tax was not in four figures and did not increase by many times the rate of inflation each year nor did he pay £4.00 a gallon for fuel. I fear the comparisons are an irrelevance.
Nobody is claiming that relatively speaking we are not well off (although compared to equivalent jobs of responsibility it is arguable) but I do not see why I should not aspire to be paid the market rate for the job.
Finally you claim that the job is now much easier. I agree that the aeroplanes are easier to manage and offer better reliability but in other areas such as congested airspace, 4+ sector days, minimum slips at destinations the modern job is much more demanding.
To return to my original point all this is an irrelevance. Bourbon made an unpleasant and untrue attack on me and my colleagues and I could not let that go unchallenged.
PPRuNe Person
Join Date: Jun 2001
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Bourbon-on-the-Water:
Your posting was offensive to me, I am a BA pilot, not motivated by money, for if I was, I surely wouldn't be working for this lot!
It may come as a surprise to you but a 20-year BA Captain is on £75k basic.
To the guy who came out with the 'best paid in Europe' gem, you're way off the mark, buddy. I had a wry chuckle when I read it.
For the record:
BA pilots are the most productive of any major airline. Their pay is way behind the 'market rate'
This is an unstable situation!
PS: Don't believe everything you read in the papers!
Your posting was offensive to me, I am a BA pilot, not motivated by money, for if I was, I surely wouldn't be working for this lot!
It may come as a surprise to you but a 20-year BA Captain is on £75k basic.
To the guy who came out with the 'best paid in Europe' gem, you're way off the mark, buddy. I had a wry chuckle when I read it.
For the record:
BA pilots are the most productive of any major airline. Their pay is way behind the 'market rate'
This is an unstable situation!
PS: Don't believe everything you read in the papers!
