MYT - I can't believe it!!
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Well I am a BALPA member and so are the many who have phoned me on this issue and we are not happy with the way the solutuon has been implemented! Lets remember BALPA only represent, at last count, half the pilot work force. Many who are unhappy with this are not effected either way and have no axe to grind.
Squeaky
Run the PPP past your local solicitor he will have a field day with it. As I have already said you can read it two ways even members of the CC admit that!
If the silent majority agree so be it and I will be very happy to accept that but as it stands this is wrong, lets take a ballot and find out, problem solved. Of course that is not going to happen.
As has been stated by one member of the CC either method could have been right but they have opted for this one, some of the CC were ready to go the other way the day before they voted on this.
Royhud
I am really sorry you are out of work again. Been there myself , four times in one year so I know how you feel. However, this issue is important and needs to be seen to be done correctly. Soft landing.
Squeaky
Run the PPP past your local solicitor he will have a field day with it. As I have already said you can read it two ways even members of the CC admit that!
If the silent majority agree so be it and I will be very happy to accept that but as it stands this is wrong, lets take a ballot and find out, problem solved. Of course that is not going to happen.
As has been stated by one member of the CC either method could have been right but they have opted for this one, some of the CC were ready to go the other way the day before they voted on this.
Royhud
I am really sorry you are out of work again. Been there myself , four times in one year so I know how you feel. However, this issue is important and needs to be seen to be done correctly. Soft landing.
Last edited by kinsman; 27th Sep 2004 at 00:27.
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I too am a BALPA member and am completely underwhelmed at how this has been handled. The organisation i pay hundreds of pounds a year in fees considers my opinion not worth asking, the company administration of the whole affair is, frankly laughable. the representative sent to two of the bases most affected was brusque, inflexible and has managed to alienate a large portion of the membership, indeed it was asked exactly whose side he was on!!
I can only hope that the forecasts come true and the gates at BA and Virgin open, sucking up all who want to go, leaving those who want to stay secure, and leading to a recruitment drive next year.
For the record, I consider the Company to have great potential if the re-financing comes through, and the crews and staff easily make up for the ineptitude of the administrative staff involved in this debacle.
Tin hat on, but not expecting much flak from those on the front line.
I can only hope that the forecasts come true and the gates at BA and Virgin open, sucking up all who want to go, leaving those who want to stay secure, and leading to a recruitment drive next year.
For the record, I consider the Company to have great potential if the re-financing comes through, and the crews and staff easily make up for the ineptitude of the administrative staff involved in this debacle.
Tin hat on, but not expecting much flak from those on the front line.
Alba Gu Brath
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gizard
Just to pick up on 2 of your points
1
Yes, that is what people who run businesses are supposed to do. Instead MYT are getting rid of crews who are trained and experienced on the Airbus and replacing them with people who are not. Hmm, that's a sensible idea.
2
Considering some Boeing pilots have sworn they would rather saw their arms off than fly an Airbus then I guess this opinion goes both ways.
really not
Quite ironic isn't it that the most inept staff in the company seem to have avoided the redundancy axe!
Just to pick up on 2 of your points
1
Think of the training cost,
2
and do we really want those other pilots on our fleet!
really not
Quite ironic isn't it that the most inept staff in the company seem to have avoided the redundancy axe!
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Kinsman, BT, really not, all spot on in my opinion.
I WAS a BALPA member, but like many others in MYT I have awarded myself a 1% pay rise. Their arrogant attitude throughout means they no longer have my respect as a negotiating body.
Any news on the latest rumour that the 75's are staying and there'll be few, if any redundancies ? Let's hope
I WAS a BALPA member, but like many others in MYT I have awarded myself a 1% pay rise. Their arrogant attitude throughout means they no longer have my respect as a negotiating body.
Any news on the latest rumour that the 75's are staying and there'll be few, if any redundancies ? Let's hope
Ut Sementem Feeceris
If the 757's stay how can there be no redundancies? The idea of fleet rationalisation is because MYT have too much capacity - they HAVE to reduce the fleet.
Two bases are closing - period, others are summer only. There WILL be redundacies.
If they keep the Boings then there goes the cost savings (which is what the whole exercise is about) which come from a single fleet.
Whelk stool anyone?
A4
Two bases are closing - period, others are summer only. There WILL be redundacies.
If they keep the Boings then there goes the cost savings (which is what the whole exercise is about) which come from a single fleet.
Whelk stool anyone?
A4
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Derrr!!
The cost saving has been identified to be greater by ditching some of the airbus with their ludicrous lease arrangements, against the cost of keeping the desert rats.
(IF the rumour is true of course)
AND
if enough pilots leave because they have been called out of their respective holding pool(s) there will be no need for any redundancies. It's not rocket science.
Have a word with yourself before your next post!!
The cost saving has been identified to be greater by ditching some of the airbus with their ludicrous lease arrangements, against the cost of keeping the desert rats.
(IF the rumour is true of course)
AND
if enough pilots leave because they have been called out of their respective holding pool(s) there will be no need for any redundancies. It's not rocket science.
Have a word with yourself before your next post!!
Last edited by squeakyunclean; 27th Sep 2004 at 13:28.
Ut Sementem Feeceris
Squeaky
Get out of bed the wrong side? Why are you jumping down my throat? I was replying to Flex's post that "there'll be few if any redundancies".
The fleet is reducing and bases are closing there WILL be redundancies. The management mantra has ALWAYS been that the Airbus leases are too expensive to get out of - hence it has never been an option. The cost savings in engineering and crewing terms for a single fleet are, to use your own words, not rocket science.
Why has this (rumoured) scenario suddenly appeared two whole months into the consultation process? Presumably, now the options (HA!) have changed, the 90 period will have to start again.
Squeaky, I find your explosive repsonse to my last post bemusing - calm down. What do you suggest I "have a word with yourself" about?
To correct my last spelling, whelk STALL anyone? Mind you the whole thing stinks, so perhaps the original spelling was more apt.
Bye
A4
Get out of bed the wrong side? Why are you jumping down my throat? I was replying to Flex's post that "there'll be few if any redundancies".
The fleet is reducing and bases are closing there WILL be redundancies. The management mantra has ALWAYS been that the Airbus leases are too expensive to get out of - hence it has never been an option. The cost savings in engineering and crewing terms for a single fleet are, to use your own words, not rocket science.
Why has this (rumoured) scenario suddenly appeared two whole months into the consultation process? Presumably, now the options (HA!) have changed, the 90 period will have to start again.
Squeaky, I find your explosive repsonse to my last post bemusing - calm down. What do you suggest I "have a word with yourself" about?
To correct my last spelling, whelk STALL anyone? Mind you the whole thing stinks, so perhaps the original spelling was more apt.
Bye
A4
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Okay,
Have a word about if 118 pilots find another job and resign, how many pilots will be made redundant then?
Have a word about the cost of the Airbus being X, the cost of the Boeings, including all the things you mention being Y. If you take X away from Y and the answer is a negative number you have a cost saving despite there still being more than one fleet.
Still bemused?
Explosive, calm down? I must be rubbish at conveying my state of mind. (That’s probably a good thing though ;-))
I’d better go and have a word with myself. (Anyway, I blame BALPA for that as well)
Definitely Bye, bye this time.
FLEX42, IT’S NOT A 1% PAY RISE YOU B***** NUMPTY!!! THE SUBS ARE TAX DEDUCTIBLE. Rant, rave, rant, shout, swear……
(Oh no, not again)
Have a word about if 118 pilots find another job and resign, how many pilots will be made redundant then?
Have a word about the cost of the Airbus being X, the cost of the Boeings, including all the things you mention being Y. If you take X away from Y and the answer is a negative number you have a cost saving despite there still being more than one fleet.
Still bemused?
Explosive, calm down? I must be rubbish at conveying my state of mind. (That’s probably a good thing though ;-))
I’d better go and have a word with myself. (Anyway, I blame BALPA for that as well)
Definitely Bye, bye this time.
FLEX42, IT’S NOT A 1% PAY RISE YOU B***** NUMPTY!!! THE SUBS ARE TAX DEDUCTIBLE. Rant, rave, rant, shout, swear……
(Oh no, not again)
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Squeaky
Time for a CRM course me thinks. Don't forget when the dust settles we are all on the same side even the BALPA CC. Much better not to get personal on these subjects and just stick to the issues. Otherwise we will end up as bad as that lot in Parliment.
Time for a CRM course me thinks. Don't forget when the dust settles we are all on the same side even the BALPA CC. Much better not to get personal on these subjects and just stick to the issues. Otherwise we will end up as bad as that lot in Parliment.
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I think squeaky must have pms 
I am aware of tax deductibles, ya double numpty with brass knobs on
but it's still alot of dosh to be treated in the way that "really not" described when they have got it so wrong on this occasion.
I am aware of tax deductibles, ya double numpty with brass knobs on
but it's still alot of dosh to be treated in the way that "really not" described when they have got it so wrong on this occasion.
Ut Sementem Feeceris
Squeaky, glad you have a sense of humour - we all need it at the moment. 
Silly of me to think that the "da management" might have actually done your X-Y=Z maths before launching into this whole debacle. Did someone come up with an idea last week about taking a closer look at leasing costs?
You've got to admit it seems a bit bloody odd to start coming up with "Boeing retention" scenarios this far down the line. This should have been looked at in the finest detail prior to July 26th!
If it's true.....................
A4
Flex - "ya double numpty with brass knobs on" - like it!
Silly of me to think that the "da management" might have actually done your X-Y=Z maths before launching into this whole debacle. Did someone come up with an idea last week about taking a closer look at leasing costs?
You've got to admit it seems a bit bloody odd to start coming up with "Boeing retention" scenarios this far down the line. This should have been looked at in the finest detail prior to July 26th!
If it's true.....................
A4
Flex - "ya double numpty with brass knobs on" - like it!
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You know when a mad dog barks furiously when looking through a window, and the glass gets splattered in dog spit?
That’s what my computer screen looks like!!!
GRRRR.
pms- pathetic management syndrome?
Who told you about my brass knob?
That’s what my computer screen looks like!!!
GRRRR.
pms- pathetic management syndrome?
Who told you about my brass knob?
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news/confirmed rumours
The main reason for the reduction in pilots for MYT is/was their elimination of the Boeing fleet. The 763s were going to be kept on for the Hajj and then dropped when the lease finished but the latest goss that should be confirmed tomorrow is that the 753s, at leats most of them anyway, will not be going. Apparently this is due to the original buyers, a cargo firm, not being able to convert the a/c for two years and re-leasing them back to MYT under a lower rate...so what happens now?
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Boeings not going??
Guys, not a MYT employee, but I'll tell you how this all looks from the 'outside'......
Personally I saw MYT's city announcement of fleet cutting to be the most positive thing the company has done since it's troubles started. It has troubles, still big ones financially!! This was the first large 'positive' step towards accepting things are not well that I have seen, and I believe gave 'light' for a future ahead.
Staffing wise a bloody disater I know, I've been there before, more than once and know of it's pressures and griefs. I feel for everyone who faces redundancy and wish them all well, they will all get jobs medium term but know of the troubles they'll face until that time.
In the corporate picture however, a decision to change plans now I think is a disaster!! What image of your senior managements business skill does this portray to the city, and it's bankers???? "We're chopping the boeing fleet". "err, well, err perhaps we're not going to cut it all, err, we think........"
MYT's future is still very much in the hands of city confidence, and that of it's bankers. If they see POOR and INCOMPETENT management of the group I fear for it's future. Backtracking on what has been the groups most significant city announcement in some time i really feel will NOT go down well where it matters - with your backers!!
Wish you all good luck.
30W
Guys, not a MYT employee, but I'll tell you how this all looks from the 'outside'......
Personally I saw MYT's city announcement of fleet cutting to be the most positive thing the company has done since it's troubles started. It has troubles, still big ones financially!! This was the first large 'positive' step towards accepting things are not well that I have seen, and I believe gave 'light' for a future ahead.
Staffing wise a bloody disater I know, I've been there before, more than once and know of it's pressures and griefs. I feel for everyone who faces redundancy and wish them all well, they will all get jobs medium term but know of the troubles they'll face until that time.
In the corporate picture however, a decision to change plans now I think is a disaster!! What image of your senior managements business skill does this portray to the city, and it's bankers???? "We're chopping the boeing fleet". "err, well, err perhaps we're not going to cut it all, err, we think........"
MYT's future is still very much in the hands of city confidence, and that of it's bankers. If they see POOR and INCOMPETENT management of the group I fear for it's future. Backtracking on what has been the groups most significant city announcement in some time i really feel will NOT go down well where it matters - with your backers!!
Wish you all good luck.
30W
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Now comfortably OUT of MYT I can't help thinking that this whole thread reminds me of the typical senior management adage of :
'Do More with Less' until I can get out with my Separation Package (usually 5 or 6 figures).
I feel desperately sorry for those of my ex-peers who are in this situation.
That said the writing has been on the wall in bl**dy great big letters 6 feet high for the last couple of years minimum.
Sadly too, it brings out the one of the worst features of our own human natures which is if you think you're safe - pull up the rope ladder sharpish in case anyone manages to get past you. Mortgages to pay, kids to feed etc etc. . .
This sadly leads to the above slanging match where much hot air is re-distributed and little else is constructively achieved.
Clear, the decks, blow main ballast and dive, dive dive.
I only hope the company can smoothly achieve 'periscope depth' and doesn't continue to the ocean floor.
But it's not ALL bad news - Andrex have made a bid for my shares though, so all is not lost - yet.
'Do More with Less' until I can get out with my Separation Package (usually 5 or 6 figures).
I feel desperately sorry for those of my ex-peers who are in this situation.
That said the writing has been on the wall in bl**dy great big letters 6 feet high for the last couple of years minimum.
Sadly too, it brings out the one of the worst features of our own human natures which is if you think you're safe - pull up the rope ladder sharpish in case anyone manages to get past you. Mortgages to pay, kids to feed etc etc. . .
This sadly leads to the above slanging match where much hot air is re-distributed and little else is constructively achieved.
Clear, the decks, blow main ballast and dive, dive dive.
I only hope the company can smoothly achieve 'periscope depth' and doesn't continue to the ocean floor.
But it's not ALL bad news - Andrex have made a bid for my shares though, so all is not lost - yet.
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Dengue_Dude
Atta Boy, can't keep a good man down. We've missed your posts on Arena these last 12 months! I haven't missed you taking sneaky pictures of me with the seat in the reclined position however, something that seems to happen a bit too frequently these days, especially on the night Kos.
All this is too depressing and it's time to move on for a bit of excitement. I see you're worried about the Hadj. Well, probably a bit safer than being firebombed on both sides in Manchester old boy. In Jeddah, you'll never know, but in Manchester you knew they were just adjusting their aim and yours was the next target!
Could be worse; you could be looking at hauling tractor parts down to Africa like the rest of us! Now there's some excitement. Wonder what the nightlife's like in Entebbe at this time of year......!
See you around - it's a small world.
Atta Boy, can't keep a good man down. We've missed your posts on Arena these last 12 months! I haven't missed you taking sneaky pictures of me with the seat in the reclined position however, something that seems to happen a bit too frequently these days, especially on the night Kos.
All this is too depressing and it's time to move on for a bit of excitement. I see you're worried about the Hadj. Well, probably a bit safer than being firebombed on both sides in Manchester old boy. In Jeddah, you'll never know, but in Manchester you knew they were just adjusting their aim and yours was the next target!
Could be worse; you could be looking at hauling tractor parts down to Africa like the rest of us! Now there's some excitement. Wonder what the nightlife's like in Entebbe at this time of year......!
See you around - it's a small world.
