CRC takes its toll at BA.
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CRC takes its toll at BA.
Rumour has it that BA have lost 80+ employees each month as a result of the Criminal Record Check required for an airside pass. The numbers are expected to increase significantly as many employees have delayed their check until the last possible moment ie. July.
As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
It seems as though the world has gone mad. I just feel sorry for those people who have lost their jobs/houses/marriages as a result of this stupidity.
As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
It seems as though the world has gone mad. I just feel sorry for those people who have lost their jobs/houses/marriages as a result of this stupidity.
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Apparently this figure is rumoured to conveniently include some tens of pilots who have abandoned ship for greener pastures. A Trojan horse for embarrassing statistics.
I’ll take on the opposition anyday. It’s my management I can't beat
I’ll take on the opposition anyday. It’s my management I can't beat
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quote .....
"As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
I wonder if MOL would do that to his Aircrew ? ..... I would like to think he would not!!!
"As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
I wonder if MOL would do that to his Aircrew ? ..... I would like to think he would not!!!
Just another number
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hobie
I think that would depend on where the person was based. These checks are required by the BAA for anyone who has airside access to a BAA airport. The only option would be to move the crewmember to a base that did not fly to the UK. Unfortunately BA does not have that option.
Airclues
I wonder if MOL would do that to his Aircrew?
Airclues
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so BA really had no say in the effective termination of the Skippers career due to a "paper Slip-up" ....... I didn't realize that it was BAA ...... thanks for the clarification CA
do you ever wonder "who is winning the War?" because it sure isn't the good guys !!!!
cheers .....
do you ever wonder "who is winning the War?" because it sure isn't the good guys !!!!
cheers .....
CRC
>As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".<
Just nit-picking but I understood that a shotgun is not a firearm - it is not rifled. Shotguns require a Shotgun Certificate, not a licence.
Maybe he should have fought this insanity.
Sleeve.
Just nit-picking but I understood that a shotgun is not a firearm - it is not rifled. Shotguns require a Shotgun Certificate, not a licence.
Maybe he should have fought this insanity.
Sleeve.
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As I am located alongside the people department I can assure you that the figure of 80 is not correct. BA senior management would be over the moon if we could get rid of 80 bodies per month.
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Having a criminal record does not disqualify you from having an airside pass.
Failing to register a shotgun as the result of a memory slip certainly would not disqualify you, and unless the captain appeared in court and was convicted (not very lightly!) he wouldn't have a CRO record anyway.
As I recall from filling in mine, the question is there as a matter of trust. ie you 'forget' to mention a conviction for attempted murder then you can't really be very trustworthy can you? Also the form mentions something about who the information will be given too, and provides an envelope for you to seal your admission into.
Like all vetting the idea is to reveal anything that makes you suspetable to blackmail, which was why in the 80's if you wanted to be positivly vetted and were gay and did not mention it, you lost your vetting status. This is the same, if you have told the vetting agency you have a conviction it becomes difficult to blackmail you...
There are many other jobs where you have to reveal any criminal conviction, its not just air transport being singled out.
It may interest you to know that as a Policeman at LHR in the 90's I had to fill one in, in spite of the fact that I had obviously been checked when I joined and as they had my fingerprints if I had of been convicted of any offence in between times then my bosses would have known.
Failing to register a shotgun as the result of a memory slip certainly would not disqualify you, and unless the captain appeared in court and was convicted (not very lightly!) he wouldn't have a CRO record anyway.
As I recall from filling in mine, the question is there as a matter of trust. ie you 'forget' to mention a conviction for attempted murder then you can't really be very trustworthy can you? Also the form mentions something about who the information will be given too, and provides an envelope for you to seal your admission into.
Like all vetting the idea is to reveal anything that makes you suspetable to blackmail, which was why in the 80's if you wanted to be positivly vetted and were gay and did not mention it, you lost your vetting status. This is the same, if you have told the vetting agency you have a conviction it becomes difficult to blackmail you...
There are many other jobs where you have to reveal any criminal conviction, its not just air transport being singled out.
It may interest you to know that as a Policeman at LHR in the 90's I had to fill one in, in spite of the fact that I had obviously been checked when I joined and as they had my fingerprints if I had of been convicted of any offence in between times then my bosses would have known.
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CRCs
the CRC process is not geared at 'airside' passes - it is driven at 'restricted zones' of an airport/airfield...how do I know this? A friend of mine is in the process of trying to persude various operators that they have no requirement to have this type of security pass (less paperwork). And yes, it is a ruling made by the Department for Transport....post various security breaches..such as the reporter who managed to get into sensitive areas!! I know it's all for the sake of protecting the aviation world and travelling public, but it seems like it's yet another pile of red tape to get through!!!
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quote ....
"As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
so this isn't true!!!! ...... well thank goodness for that
"As far as flight crew are concerned, there is one BA Captain who forgot to renew his shotgun licence. He renewed it after a couple of months but then he failed his CRC as a result of having owned an unlicenced firearm! He has now "retired".
so this isn't true!!!! ...... well thank goodness for that
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This has nothing to do with the BAA. Its a DOT requirement.
There is a presumption that non UK crews have a similar system in thier own countries.
The form is not issued by the BAA, or any other airport operator or airline, but by the UK Vetting agency. They are the ones that conduct the vetting. Read the form its made very clear on that.
As I said before having a criminal record is not a bar to having airside access, or access to 'restricted zones' (The area where the approach lights are on runway 23 at LHR is a restricted zone, its not protected by a fence and used to be a prime spot for spotters.)
Its a question thats asked to test honesty, in the same way as many other questions on the form are.
You may well think its a waste of time, if you do don't fill it in and go get a job at tescos.
There is a presumption that non UK crews have a similar system in thier own countries.
The form is not issued by the BAA, or any other airport operator or airline, but by the UK Vetting agency. They are the ones that conduct the vetting. Read the form its made very clear on that.
As I said before having a criminal record is not a bar to having airside access, or access to 'restricted zones' (The area where the approach lights are on runway 23 at LHR is a restricted zone, its not protected by a fence and used to be a prime spot for spotters.)
Its a question thats asked to test honesty, in the same way as many other questions on the form are.
You may well think its a waste of time, if you do don't fill it in and go get a job at tescos.
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Talk about red tape..........
I filled my application in last October. Quoted '10 days' for turnaround. My disclosure turned up just before Christmas. I was not 'in' the office during office hours until mid January. I presented it to the company and was then told it had already expired!!! It turns out it was already several weeks 'old' on the date when I got it and then the 10 weeks passed over my Christmas leave etc.. I take some of the blame for that one.
Re-applied and the website was quoting 9 weeks turnaround. Nine weeks passed so I enquired as to where it was. Turns out they lost a load of applications around that time, presumably mine was one of them. Told to apply online as the turnwaround was again 9 days for online apps. Two weeks passed so phoned the number to be told that turnaround is 9 weeks again and that takes me beyond the end of July for new airside pass issue.........
I give up. Disclosure Scotland please don't tickle me any more, my sides and cheeks are hurting too much.
PP
I filled my application in last October. Quoted '10 days' for turnaround. My disclosure turned up just before Christmas. I was not 'in' the office during office hours until mid January. I presented it to the company and was then told it had already expired!!! It turns out it was already several weeks 'old' on the date when I got it and then the 10 weeks passed over my Christmas leave etc.. I take some of the blame for that one.
Re-applied and the website was quoting 9 weeks turnaround. Nine weeks passed so I enquired as to where it was. Turns out they lost a load of applications around that time, presumably mine was one of them. Told to apply online as the turnwaround was again 9 days for online apps. Two weeks passed so phoned the number to be told that turnaround is 9 weeks again and that takes me beyond the end of July for new airside pass issue.........
I give up. Disclosure Scotland please don't tickle me any more, my sides and cheeks are hurting too much.
PP
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bjcc
No surprise you were a cop. Jumped up little Hitler were we?
The point most people are trying to make is that the check is yet another ill thought out knee jerk reation from Transec.
What difference does it make if you have a minor un-spent conviction. Does that make you a potential terrorist. No.
More dangerous are the throngs of immigrant workers at LHR who may have serious relevant convictions from abroard that this pathetic little exercise will not show up.
However a baggage handler (or pilot) may well loose his airside pass and therefore his career because of some irrelevent incident earlier in life.
It would seem that, like most cops I know, you are good at neither reading nor listening.
NN
No surprise you were a cop. Jumped up little Hitler were we?
The point most people are trying to make is that the check is yet another ill thought out knee jerk reation from Transec.
What difference does it make if you have a minor un-spent conviction. Does that make you a potential terrorist. No.
More dangerous are the throngs of immigrant workers at LHR who may have serious relevant convictions from abroard that this pathetic little exercise will not show up.
However a baggage handler (or pilot) may well loose his airside pass and therefore his career because of some irrelevent incident earlier in life.
It would seem that, like most cops I know, you are good at neither reading nor listening.
NN
Last edited by normal_nigel; 19th Jun 2004 at 15:46.
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like iv'e said before, just another department set up by the UK govenment to make the jobless figures look better, does noubt for security whatsoever ! and we wonder why our taxes are going through the roof !!!
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Waited over three months, still no CRC from disclosure scotland, loads of hassle getting through security as pass is out of date with security people haveing to call superiors etc.
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Normal Nigel
First silly insults are really not helping this discussion, and in any case I would have thought a grown man could have done better, still it almost made me smile.
Second, yes, I can read and listen, perhaps if you re read what I wrote you might learn something. A minor incident in your past is NOT going to result in you losing your job, it can't. There is a thing called spent convictions in the UK and unless you want to work in the Police or some other specified jobs they cannot result in you losing your job. If the offence was more serious well, then you should have declared it when you first applied. Most companies ask, if you 'forgot' to mention it, then hard luck. As I said try reading the form it tells you what will happen to the information.
Now turning to your second point, the 'throngs of immigrant workers at LHR' you mention, yes I agree, and I think you will find that not only do the 'throngs' have to prove thier identity, but, and you may find this suprising, a check can be made in their own country.
You way well think its a pathetic excerise, thats your right. Personaly I don't. I would rather something was done than nothing, instead of hurling silly insults perhaps you would be better employed thinking of a better system and sugesting it to your MP. In the meantime, I now work in the aviation industy, not at an airport, and I had to fill in the same vetting form you do, and as I said if you don't like the idea then you are free to work in some other industry.
First silly insults are really not helping this discussion, and in any case I would have thought a grown man could have done better, still it almost made me smile.
Second, yes, I can read and listen, perhaps if you re read what I wrote you might learn something. A minor incident in your past is NOT going to result in you losing your job, it can't. There is a thing called spent convictions in the UK and unless you want to work in the Police or some other specified jobs they cannot result in you losing your job. If the offence was more serious well, then you should have declared it when you first applied. Most companies ask, if you 'forgot' to mention it, then hard luck. As I said try reading the form it tells you what will happen to the information.
Now turning to your second point, the 'throngs of immigrant workers at LHR' you mention, yes I agree, and I think you will find that not only do the 'throngs' have to prove thier identity, but, and you may find this suprising, a check can be made in their own country.
You way well think its a pathetic excerise, thats your right. Personaly I don't. I would rather something was done than nothing, instead of hurling silly insults perhaps you would be better employed thinking of a better system and sugesting it to your MP. In the meantime, I now work in the aviation industy, not at an airport, and I had to fill in the same vetting form you do, and as I said if you don't like the idea then you are free to work in some other industry.