U.S. Checking Foreign Airlines for Terror Risks
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Looks like the Mexicans got with the program...
__________________________________________
``Whatever request they make, we will adopt immediately,'' Mexicana spokesman Adolfo Crespo said.
Security Agents on Mexican Flights to U.S.
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: December 30, 2003
Filed at 2:04 p.m. ET
MEXICO CITY (AP) -- Armed Mexican security agents have been on board certain flights to the United States since last week under an agreement reached with the United States before it publicly announced that it would require international carriers to take the measure, a cabinet member said Tuesday.
Mexico also is in talks with Canada about putting guards aboard flights to that country, Public Safety Secretary Alejandro Gertz told Mexican radio stations. Gertz was not available for a personal interview, a spokesman for his office said.
The agents form part of the Special Operations Group of the Federal Preventive Police and use weapons with special ammunition designed to avoid a loss of pressure in airplane cabins when fired, Gertz said.
The decision to put agents on board certain flights ``stems from a series of talks that the Mexican government has had with the U.S. government, and we also have been working with the government of Canada'' on a similar arrangement, Gertz said.
The United States on Monday announced that it was requiring some international flights crossing over or headed to the United States to carry armed law enforcement officers to protect commercial airplanes against terrorist attack.
Department of Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge issued the new directive, which gives the U.S. government the option of denying access to U.S. airspace to airlines that don't cooperate.
Gertz declined to say how many police have participated in the Mexican program or what flights they accompanied, citing security reasons.
Interior Secretary Santiago Creel told reporters on Monday that while Mexico had not received a formal request from the United States to put agents on planes, the country would do so in special circumstances as part of its ongoing cooperation with the United States in the fight against terrorism.
Three major Mexican airlines, Aeromexico, Mexicana and Aviacsa, said Tuesday that they would comply with security measures put in place by national and international officials.
``Whatever request they make, we will adopt immediately,'' Mexicana spokesman Adolfo Crespo said.
Flight attendant unions on Tuesday expressed concern over possible threats to safety posed by having armed guards on board.
On Monday, the spokesman for the national pilots' union, Francisco Esquivelzeta, said that Mexican guards were already on certain flights, but police officials did not confirm the information immediately.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/inte...-Security.html
__________________________________________
``Whatever request they make, we will adopt immediately,'' Mexicana spokesman Adolfo Crespo said.
Security Agents on Mexican Flights to U.S.
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: December 30, 2003
Filed at 2:04 p.m. ET
MEXICO CITY (AP) -- Armed Mexican security agents have been on board certain flights to the United States since last week under an agreement reached with the United States before it publicly announced that it would require international carriers to take the measure, a cabinet member said Tuesday.
Mexico also is in talks with Canada about putting guards aboard flights to that country, Public Safety Secretary Alejandro Gertz told Mexican radio stations. Gertz was not available for a personal interview, a spokesman for his office said.
The agents form part of the Special Operations Group of the Federal Preventive Police and use weapons with special ammunition designed to avoid a loss of pressure in airplane cabins when fired, Gertz said.
The decision to put agents on board certain flights ``stems from a series of talks that the Mexican government has had with the U.S. government, and we also have been working with the government of Canada'' on a similar arrangement, Gertz said.
The United States on Monday announced that it was requiring some international flights crossing over or headed to the United States to carry armed law enforcement officers to protect commercial airplanes against terrorist attack.
Department of Homeland Security Secretary Tom Ridge issued the new directive, which gives the U.S. government the option of denying access to U.S. airspace to airlines that don't cooperate.
Gertz declined to say how many police have participated in the Mexican program or what flights they accompanied, citing security reasons.
Interior Secretary Santiago Creel told reporters on Monday that while Mexico had not received a formal request from the United States to put agents on planes, the country would do so in special circumstances as part of its ongoing cooperation with the United States in the fight against terrorism.
Three major Mexican airlines, Aeromexico, Mexicana and Aviacsa, said Tuesday that they would comply with security measures put in place by national and international officials.
``Whatever request they make, we will adopt immediately,'' Mexicana spokesman Adolfo Crespo said.
Flight attendant unions on Tuesday expressed concern over possible threats to safety posed by having armed guards on board.
On Monday, the spokesman for the national pilots' union, Francisco Esquivelzeta, said that Mexican guards were already on certain flights, but police officials did not confirm the information immediately.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/inte...-Security.html
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Looks like the Italians think the threat is real:
Italy bans flights over Rome
ROME, Dec. 30 (UPI) -- The Italian authorities Tuesday banned flights over Rome until Jan. 6 as a security measure against terrorist attack, the Italian news agency Ansa reported.
This was part of a heightened state of alert in Italy, Ansa said.
On Dec. 24, Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi told a local Milan paper that terrorists had planned to crash a hijacked plane into the Vatican on Christmas Day.
The paper published no details, and there was no attack. But Ansa said the alert continues.
In Germany, security at a Hamburg military air base was tightened following U.S. warnings that Islamic militants planned a suicide bomb attack.
The U.S. air base near Frankfurt was also on high alert, Ansa reported.
http://interestalert.com/brand/sitei...r=World%20News
Italy bans flights over Rome
ROME, Dec. 30 (UPI) -- The Italian authorities Tuesday banned flights over Rome until Jan. 6 as a security measure against terrorist attack, the Italian news agency Ansa reported.
This was part of a heightened state of alert in Italy, Ansa said.
On Dec. 24, Prime Minister Silvio Berlusconi told a local Milan paper that terrorists had planned to crash a hijacked plane into the Vatican on Christmas Day.
The paper published no details, and there was no attack. But Ansa said the alert continues.
In Germany, security at a Hamburg military air base was tightened following U.S. warnings that Islamic militants planned a suicide bomb attack.
The U.S. air base near Frankfurt was also on high alert, Ansa reported.
http://interestalert.com/brand/sitei...r=World%20News
I hope this is of interest to you. Here's what's of interest to me: Why carry out such security checks on arriving pax whose final destination is ATL?
Inter- terminal (Flight Connections) transfer at LHR is exactly the same. Has been since before 11/9.
Last edited by eko4me; 31st Dec 2003 at 21:37.
After having flown trans-atlantic to the US more or less since 1986, and having spent a lot of time there previously, I am very much fed up with the security "hassles" that we are being subjected to.
Add to that the insufferable US TV media on the layover and suddenly Prozac is probably to mild to alleviate the frustration.
I am therefore quite fortunate to have gotten a new assignment (on my bidding) with my company, based in Europe.
Flying to the Caribbean, S-America, Africa and yes even the Middle-East. Grreat!
To my US friends, I say: "I shall return", it might take me a few years as it did Gen.McArthur, when the Bush regime is long gone and the redneck BS blows over
Oceancrosser
Add to that the insufferable US TV media on the layover and suddenly Prozac is probably to mild to alleviate the frustration.
I am therefore quite fortunate to have gotten a new assignment (on my bidding) with my company, based in Europe.
Flying to the Caribbean, S-America, Africa and yes even the Middle-East. Grreat!
To my US friends, I say: "I shall return", it might take me a few years as it did Gen.McArthur, when the Bush regime is long gone and the redneck BS blows over
Oceancrosser
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Over here in the UK, we have banned all jump seat travel; only those that are part of the operating crew are allowed on the flight deck. The FAA forced this ruling upon us.
It is ludicrous that when I return from my holidays, I'm unable to occupy the jump seat on one of our company aircraft that I’m type rated on, despite having flown that exact aircraft the previous week, into the same destination!
Can any of my "cousins" from the other side of the pond confirm that you are working to the same set of rules?
It is ludicrous that when I return from my holidays, I'm unable to occupy the jump seat on one of our company aircraft that I’m type rated on, despite having flown that exact aircraft the previous week, into the same destination!
Can any of my "cousins" from the other side of the pond confirm that you are working to the same set of rules?
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Man I just love when everyone blames the USA for every little thing. I guess its just the latest form of ignorance and bigotry 
.
The only thing the USA can effect is on flights to and from the USA. We have absolutely no say over what would happen on a flight to or from any other two countries in the world that doesn't flight through American airspace. Could it be that MAYBE, just MAYBE others in your government have felt that some of the precautions just might be sensible after all?
Furthermore the jumpseat is still available in the USA to ANY pilot working for the same company. The jumpseat has been restricted to only pilots from our companies now, we can't offer it to pilots of another airline untill the universal ID gets approved so that we can verify that yes infact they are pilots for another airline. So if pilots of your own airline have been banned from your own jumpseat, that was most likely by some spitefull little beaurocrat in your own company that was jealous of you or wanted to make sure that pilots didn't get some extra "perk".
Just to repeat for all the ignorant out there, As an American Airlines pilots I can ride the Jumpseat of ANY of the 800+ (yes over 800 large aircraft) aircraft that American Airlines operate from the MD-80 to the 777 regardless of whether I am typed or have ever operated the aircraft. I am not sure about the 400 or so Aircraft at American Eagle, but I think those as a seperate airline (even though owned by AA) are probably off limits for the moment but I might be wrong.
Cheers
Wino
.The only thing the USA can effect is on flights to and from the USA. We have absolutely no say over what would happen on a flight to or from any other two countries in the world that doesn't flight through American airspace. Could it be that MAYBE, just MAYBE others in your government have felt that some of the precautions just might be sensible after all?
Furthermore the jumpseat is still available in the USA to ANY pilot working for the same company. The jumpseat has been restricted to only pilots from our companies now, we can't offer it to pilots of another airline untill the universal ID gets approved so that we can verify that yes infact they are pilots for another airline. So if pilots of your own airline have been banned from your own jumpseat, that was most likely by some spitefull little beaurocrat in your own company that was jealous of you or wanted to make sure that pilots didn't get some extra "perk".
Just to repeat for all the ignorant out there, As an American Airlines pilots I can ride the Jumpseat of ANY of the 800+ (yes over 800 large aircraft) aircraft that American Airlines operate from the MD-80 to the 777 regardless of whether I am typed or have ever operated the aircraft. I am not sure about the 400 or so Aircraft at American Eagle, but I think those as a seperate airline (even though owned by AA) are probably off limits for the moment but I might be wrong.
Cheers
Wino
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Wino, calm yourself down.
I believe the British Government/DOT have sadly passed rulings without really thinking them through. Being typically British, we will abide by these rules whilst many other countries continue unregulated, and in breach of the rules.
I believe the jump seat policy was dictated by the FAA to CAA operators wanting to operate into the US. We were told that we were no longer permitted to offer the jumpseat to crew unless they were on duty.
If I understand you correctly, you are able to occupy a jumpseat on one of your company aircraft in and out of the US whilst not operating. Very sensible. I am not afforded the same privilege on one of my company aircraft, because the FAA won't allow it. This is where I have an axe to grind. There's are one set of rules for one and another set for the States.
Further to that, the Secretary of State through the DofT has now dictated that this ruling will stand for all flights operated by UK airlines, regardless of destination. This ruling was implemented despite the objection of many UK airlines. It was not a decision made at a company level. I don't blame the US for this, but why have two sets of rules?
Tags.
PS. Any chance of your next post being a little less condescending and patronizing?
I believe the British Government/DOT have sadly passed rulings without really thinking them through. Being typically British, we will abide by these rules whilst many other countries continue unregulated, and in breach of the rules.
I believe the jump seat policy was dictated by the FAA to CAA operators wanting to operate into the US. We were told that we were no longer permitted to offer the jumpseat to crew unless they were on duty.
If I understand you correctly, you are able to occupy a jumpseat on one of your company aircraft in and out of the US whilst not operating. Very sensible. I am not afforded the same privilege on one of my company aircraft, because the FAA won't allow it. This is where I have an axe to grind. There's are one set of rules for one and another set for the States.
Further to that, the Secretary of State through the DofT has now dictated that this ruling will stand for all flights operated by UK airlines, regardless of destination. This ruling was implemented despite the objection of many UK airlines. It was not a decision made at a company level. I don't blame the US for this, but why have two sets of rules?
Tags.
PS. Any chance of your next post being a little less condescending and patronizing?
Just saw on BBC news website that a Brazilian judge has ordered that as of January 1st all US passportholders travelling to Brazil will be photographed and fingerprinted, just the same as the US intends to do to foreign travellers requiring visas.
Way to go Brazil!!! I hope more countries follow suit and that for US carriers and tourists other countries will adopt tit for tat measures to counter US demands.
That will be the only way to stop the endless new demands and bs coming from that direction. A separate immigration and customs channel for Americans would probably have someone screaming in Washington!
Way to go Brazil!!! I hope more countries follow suit and that for US carriers and tourists other countries will adopt tit for tat measures to counter US demands.
That will be the only way to stop the endless new demands and bs coming from that direction. A separate immigration and customs channel for Americans would probably have someone screaming in Washington!
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TAGS,
I just told you that the FAA DOES allow you to ride the jumpseat of your own airline's aircraft. What you cannot do is allow family members or other staff members to ride your jumpseat. ONLY PILOTS.
Again, I will type it slowly, THE FAA HAS NOT FORBIDDEN PILOTS OF AN AIRLINE FROM RIDING THEIR OWN JUMPSEAT. The regulations require that you verify that anyone on your jumpseat is infact a pilot for your company. Presumably your company issues you an ID that proves that you work for the company and that there is some method of controll so that you know the ID is valid (expiration dates or checking records on presentation of such ID) If those conditions are met you can ride the jumpseat of your own airline.
So once again you have just said that the FAA will not allow it, and I have just told you that infact that is FALSE... Its not the FAA doing it to you mate... There is no such prohibition. The prohibition has come from the CAA or your own government but not the FAA. Maybe someone in YOUR government is miffed that they can't ride a jumpseat on holiday anymore and decided to get even with you, but it was not by FAA regulation that a pilot cannot ride his own airline's jumpseat.
Ocean crosser,
Good for them. A sensible precaution in todays day and age! I hope more countries do it. Whats the point of having all this technology if you don't USE it! I wish Europe would do the same. Might catch some terrorists at the border...
Cheers
Wino
I just told you that the FAA DOES allow you to ride the jumpseat of your own airline's aircraft. What you cannot do is allow family members or other staff members to ride your jumpseat. ONLY PILOTS.
Again, I will type it slowly, THE FAA HAS NOT FORBIDDEN PILOTS OF AN AIRLINE FROM RIDING THEIR OWN JUMPSEAT. The regulations require that you verify that anyone on your jumpseat is infact a pilot for your company. Presumably your company issues you an ID that proves that you work for the company and that there is some method of controll so that you know the ID is valid (expiration dates or checking records on presentation of such ID) If those conditions are met you can ride the jumpseat of your own airline.
So once again you have just said that the FAA will not allow it, and I have just told you that infact that is FALSE... Its not the FAA doing it to you mate... There is no such prohibition. The prohibition has come from the CAA or your own government but not the FAA. Maybe someone in YOUR government is miffed that they can't ride a jumpseat on holiday anymore and decided to get even with you, but it was not by FAA regulation that a pilot cannot ride his own airline's jumpseat.
Ocean crosser,
Good for them. A sensible precaution in todays day and age! I hope more countries do it. Whats the point of having all this technology if you don't USE it! I wish Europe would do the same. Might catch some terrorists at the border...
Cheers
Wino
OCEANCROSSER
Some how I just am not offended by the actions of the judge in Brazil. I see it as a legitimate action of a sovereign state. Sorry if I am not put out as you would like.
TAGS
Can you offer conclusive proof that the FAA (or other US entity) is at the heart of your jumpseat problem. Is this the stuff urban legends are made of, or is there a basis of fact for it? Do you really buy into an idea that the FAA won't let you jumpseat in the UK?
I also can jumpseat in the actual on hundreds of aircraft in the US, in the back on thousands more. There is a program in the works that the ATA is pushing to restore the actual jumpseat to offline pilots.
Some how I just am not offended by the actions of the judge in Brazil. I see it as a legitimate action of a sovereign state. Sorry if I am not put out as you would like.
TAGS
Can you offer conclusive proof that the FAA (or other US entity) is at the heart of your jumpseat problem. Is this the stuff urban legends are made of, or is there a basis of fact for it? Do you really buy into an idea that the FAA won't let you jumpseat in the UK?
I also can jumpseat in the actual on hundreds of aircraft in the US, in the back on thousands more. There is a program in the works that the ATA is pushing to restore the actual jumpseat to offline pilots.
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Lets keep crying wolf. We have created aan industry that grows by the day. People had more rights under the nazi govt. All of this is just a power trip for some of the selected few "protectors" that must justify their jobs. Do people really believe that any of tis works?
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From AvFlash 10.02A
FBI Hunts For Al-Qaida Pilot "Mole"
A British newspaper says FBI fears that an al-Qaida operative may be working as a pilot for a British airline are behind flight cancellations last week. The Daily Mirror says American investigators will screen all British pilots flying to the U.S. to try and root out the suspected mole. The paper quotes unnamed sources as saying the infiltrator intends to crash a planeload of people into the White House, Pentagon or Capitol building. Brian Doyle, a senior official with the Department of Homeland Security, confirmed the suspicions. "The intelligence is telling us there are some forms of infiltration from al-Qaida. We are looking hard into it." The worldwide alert has security officials on edge, as passengers on a Paris-bound Air France flight found out on New Year's Day. They ended up spending three hours in St. John's, Newfoundland, after a mix-up at Kennedy Airport resulted in an unaccompanied suitcase getting on the plane. A passenger cancelled his flight after being told he'd have to pay for extra baggage and when his luggage was pulled from the plane, one bag was left behind. "It really goes to show what a minor thing can do," said Rex Ledrew, president of the St. John's International Airport Authority. Meanwhile, Sweden and New Zealand have so far refused to put armed marshals on flights to the U.S. The Swedes say they'll cancel flights if there's a security threat. Italy has banned flights over Rome until Tuesday.
FBI Hunts For Al-Qaida Pilot "Mole"
A British newspaper says FBI fears that an al-Qaida operative may be working as a pilot for a British airline are behind flight cancellations last week. The Daily Mirror says American investigators will screen all British pilots flying to the U.S. to try and root out the suspected mole. The paper quotes unnamed sources as saying the infiltrator intends to crash a planeload of people into the White House, Pentagon or Capitol building. Brian Doyle, a senior official with the Department of Homeland Security, confirmed the suspicions. "The intelligence is telling us there are some forms of infiltration from al-Qaida. We are looking hard into it." The worldwide alert has security officials on edge, as passengers on a Paris-bound Air France flight found out on New Year's Day. They ended up spending three hours in St. John's, Newfoundland, after a mix-up at Kennedy Airport resulted in an unaccompanied suitcase getting on the plane. A passenger cancelled his flight after being told he'd have to pay for extra baggage and when his luggage was pulled from the plane, one bag was left behind. "It really goes to show what a minor thing can do," said Rex Ledrew, president of the St. John's International Airport Authority. Meanwhile, Sweden and New Zealand have so far refused to put armed marshals on flights to the U.S. The Swedes say they'll cancel flights if there's a security threat. Italy has banned flights over Rome until Tuesday.
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>>A British newspaper says FBI fears that an al-Qaida operative may be working as a pilot for a British airline are behind flight cancellations last week. The Daily Mirror says American investigators will screen all British pilots flying to the U.S. to try and root out the suspected mole.<<
Wonder if the crews will be fingerprinted and photographed? I certainly hope so, given the nature of the threat. I was fingerprinted and photographed after 9-11 even though I had an active security clearance and had been vetted many times.
Hey, I had my temperature taken the other day in Asia as a crewmember, I didn't whimper that they were trying to undermine U.S. sovereignty. My image was recorded on countless airport and hotel surveillance cameras and I didn't invoke images of Nazi Germany. Somehow, it's just not that big of an issue in the real world. Not having tight security is a big issue as we have learned the hard way. Now it's time to close the barn door that lets the bad guys get into the U.S. (and the UK) undetected.
Balpa will huff and puff, and moan and groan, but will comply with U.S. security procedures as they always have in the past. Remember all the geniuses here who said a couple of years ago that they would never lock their cockpit door?
Wonder if the crews will be fingerprinted and photographed? I certainly hope so, given the nature of the threat. I was fingerprinted and photographed after 9-11 even though I had an active security clearance and had been vetted many times.
Hey, I had my temperature taken the other day in Asia as a crewmember, I didn't whimper that they were trying to undermine U.S. sovereignty. My image was recorded on countless airport and hotel surveillance cameras and I didn't invoke images of Nazi Germany. Somehow, it's just not that big of an issue in the real world. Not having tight security is a big issue as we have learned the hard way. Now it's time to close the barn door that lets the bad guys get into the U.S. (and the UK) undetected.
Balpa will huff and puff, and moan and groan, but will comply with U.S. security procedures as they always have in the past. Remember all the geniuses here who said a couple of years ago that they would never lock their cockpit door?
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My understanding is that all visa holders will be fingerprinted and photographed. All carriers' pilots and cabin crew hold US visas, whatever their country of origin, if they work in and out of the US, so they will all be fingerprinted and photographed.
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>>My understanding is that all visa holders will be fingerprinted and photographed. All carriers' pilots and cabin crew hold US visas, whatever their country of origin, if they work in and out of the US, so they will all be fingerprinted and photographed.<<
Not exactly, there are exemptions. Also, not all operating crewmembers are required to hold U.S. visas, they can enter and leave on the General Declaration.
______________________________________
List of Those Exempt From U.S. Air Rules
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: January 5, 2004
Filed at 3:01 p.m. ET
Citizens from 27 countries can travel to the United States without a visa and are exempt from being fingerprinted and photographed at U.S. airports and seaports under a new anti-terrorism program the Homeland Security Department started Monday.
Those foreigners can enter the United States with passports for business or pleasure for up to 90 days. To travel for other purposes or to stay longer, they must have a visa and would be subject to the checks for other arriving foreigners under the new US-VISIT program.
By October, visitors from the exempt countries must have a machine-readable passport to enter the United States. If not, they will be required to have a visa and will be subject to US-VISIT checks.
The countries are:
Andorra, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brunei, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, San Marino, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Portugal and Singapore.
Different rules apply for Canada and Mexico. Canadians are allowed into the country simply by providing proof of citizenship. Mexicans can apply for a permit to travel in the United States for up to three days provided they stay within 25 miles of the border. If they want to stay longer or travel further, they must obtain a visa.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/nati...Countries.html
Not exactly, there are exemptions. Also, not all operating crewmembers are required to hold U.S. visas, they can enter and leave on the General Declaration.
______________________________________
List of Those Exempt From U.S. Air Rules
By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: January 5, 2004
Filed at 3:01 p.m. ET
Citizens from 27 countries can travel to the United States without a visa and are exempt from being fingerprinted and photographed at U.S. airports and seaports under a new anti-terrorism program the Homeland Security Department started Monday.
Those foreigners can enter the United States with passports for business or pleasure for up to 90 days. To travel for other purposes or to stay longer, they must have a visa and would be subject to the checks for other arriving foreigners under the new US-VISIT program.
By October, visitors from the exempt countries must have a machine-readable passport to enter the United States. If not, they will be required to have a visa and will be subject to US-VISIT checks.
The countries are:
Andorra, Australia, Austria, Belgium, Brunei, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Iceland, Ireland, Italy, Japan, Liechtenstein, Luxembourg, Monaco, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, San Marino, Slovenia, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Portugal and Singapore.
Different rules apply for Canada and Mexico. Canadians are allowed into the country simply by providing proof of citizenship. Mexicans can apply for a permit to travel in the United States for up to three days provided they stay within 25 miles of the border. If they want to stay longer or travel further, they must obtain a visa.
http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/nati...Countries.html
