737 crashes into World Trade Centre
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Ok, I concede my comment was inappropriate and way too cynical in the present circumstances. I'll try to refrain from posting on this thread for a short period of time and will heed my own advice about waiting until a few more facts are in.
However, I beg all of you to keep your demands for counter-terror to yourself. Bombing the usual suspects is going to help no one.
LatviaCalling,
it goes without saying that my feelings are with the victims and their families. I consider your question about that to be an insult. My postings on topics like gun-control should have made clear that I am very much concerned with the freedom and well-being of the American people. The fact that I'm not too much surprised about something like this finally happening (especially considering how easy it is) does not mean that I'm not deeply shocked.
Exactly what problems of Germany you are refering to is beyond me - and what they have to do with this thread.
However, I beg all of you to keep your demands for counter-terror to yourself. Bombing the usual suspects is going to help no one.
LatviaCalling,
it goes without saying that my feelings are with the victims and their families. I consider your question about that to be an insult. My postings on topics like gun-control should have made clear that I am very much concerned with the freedom and well-being of the American people. The fact that I'm not too much surprised about something like this finally happening (especially considering how easy it is) does not mean that I'm not deeply shocked.
Exactly what problems of Germany you are refering to is beyond me - and what they have to do with this thread.
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(Perhaps I should add that until now I didn't actually see any pictures of the disaster since I don't own a TV. I'll probably be much more shaken as soon as I get a chance to watch any of the footage.)
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Then I had to watch the Palistinians dancing in the streets, handing out candy to the children, celebrating the attack.
You will not find any Muslim’s supporting the effect, but the cause is something every Palestinian-Muslim will support. And if millions say the cause is a legitimate one, then who are you to deny it’s not. They have seen their loved ones being killed – of course for them it’s a joyful retribution, it’s a real shame you don’t have the ability to care and cry for all the innocent civilians that have been killed.
Still behind the curtain
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Let's forget about Mr. Smith at this point. What is important is how could 2 1/2 buildings be wiped off the face of this earth in a moment and how could four commercial aircraft be downed at almost the same instant.
Since the Internet is so overfilled and shaky at this moment, I don't know if some of you have tried to answer some of the following questions.
1. As a pilot, if you knew death was certain, wouldn't you rather do a quick flip into the Hudson River?
2. Do you think they shot themselves through the door, took out the pilot and did a Holy Jihad with their own trained pilot. Remember, the two aircraft on the Trade Center were 767s and so was the one in Pennsylvania. The one in the Pentagon was apparently a 757. Maybe they had training on them in a third country.
3. How did they get the necessary arms aboard the aircraft to carry out their hijacking. Any thoughts of accomplices?
I think that these are the kind of things we should be following up and thinking about instead of Mr. Smith's thread lead. And I mean following up these things intelligently. After all, this is not Jet Blast.
All respects,
Emil (LatviaCalling)
Since the Internet is so overfilled and shaky at this moment, I don't know if some of you have tried to answer some of the following questions.
1. As a pilot, if you knew death was certain, wouldn't you rather do a quick flip into the Hudson River?
2. Do you think they shot themselves through the door, took out the pilot and did a Holy Jihad with their own trained pilot. Remember, the two aircraft on the Trade Center were 767s and so was the one in Pennsylvania. The one in the Pentagon was apparently a 757. Maybe they had training on them in a third country.
3. How did they get the necessary arms aboard the aircraft to carry out their hijacking. Any thoughts of accomplices?
I think that these are the kind of things we should be following up and thinking about instead of Mr. Smith's thread lead. And I mean following up these things intelligently. After all, this is not Jet Blast.
All respects,
Emil (LatviaCalling)
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Latvia Calling
IMHO, answering your first point. As a pilot, the very moment I knew what the traget was, I most definitely would force the plane into the river. Therefore, I must say pont #2 is the most plausible at this time. These were kamikaze men with at least a basic knowledge of how to guide a jet aircraft. In response to 3, there must have been accomplises among ground staff at BOS, EWR and IAD in order to smuggle some type of weapon on the planes.
IMHO, answering your first point. As a pilot, the very moment I knew what the traget was, I most definitely would force the plane into the river. Therefore, I must say pont #2 is the most plausible at this time. These were kamikaze men with at least a basic knowledge of how to guide a jet aircraft. In response to 3, there must have been accomplises among ground staff at BOS, EWR and IAD in order to smuggle some type of weapon on the planes.
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Guys, guys, guys (&gals) - we do not know the facts so quit the political squabble. Buddies have died in circumstances unknown, so a little decorum is called for. LHR app/dep div W, most a/c activity now ceased. Lot's of UHF MIL activity in LON area. Our thoughts & prayers to you folk across the pond. God speed. 
Chief PPRuNe Pilot
Before some of you try to turn this and other threads into political discussions I would like to ask that you refrain from doing it on any threads in R &N.
These tragedies that have shocked and sickened any normal person will be forever burned into our minds eye. The TV pictures of the 767 crashing into the WTC and the subsequent horror of the collapse of the towers and the undoubtedly massive loss of life have certainly caused me much grief and I will not let a few of you who find it impossible to refrain from the usual pathetic knee jerk reactions to inflame these threads into unmanageable flame wars.
Let us pause and think about the terrible human tragedy of what we have witnessed today and wait for the 'fog of war' clear before we make too many suppositions. The debate can take place on a different forum.
These tragedies that have shocked and sickened any normal person will be forever burned into our minds eye. The TV pictures of the 767 crashing into the WTC and the subsequent horror of the collapse of the towers and the undoubtedly massive loss of life have certainly caused me much grief and I will not let a few of you who find it impossible to refrain from the usual pathetic knee jerk reactions to inflame these threads into unmanageable flame wars.
Let us pause and think about the terrible human tragedy of what we have witnessed today and wait for the 'fog of war' clear before we make too many suppositions. The debate can take place on a different forum.
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Well not a helluva lot one can say except god bless all of those who perished (except the murderous bastards who carried out this crime - may you rot in hell for all eternity for your cowardice) and my sinerece condolonces to all of the families and friends who have been affected by this tragedy.
I hope to god that this does not result in another global type conflict as our fathers saw but I fear that the die has been cast before we even knew about it.
Goodnight and godspeed.
Tunny
I hope to god that this does not result in another global type conflict as our fathers saw but I fear that the die has been cast before we even knew about it.
Goodnight and godspeed.
Tunny
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Terrible day.
A few thoughts.
The BBC and CNN keep on about the amount of organisation required by the scum, but surely only a dozen or so were needed - 2 per a/c plus one at each airport to smuggle arms on board.
My experiences of US security lead my to believe that whilst passenger gate security is good, apron security is poor. I retired less than a year ago, but I had learnt enough about Boston security to avoid it if I chose.
Did the Pittsburg crew realise what was happening and make the ultimate sacrifice?
A few thoughts.
The BBC and CNN keep on about the amount of organisation required by the scum, but surely only a dozen or so were needed - 2 per a/c plus one at each airport to smuggle arms on board.
My experiences of US security lead my to believe that whilst passenger gate security is good, apron security is poor. I retired less than a year ago, but I had learnt enough about Boston security to avoid it if I chose.
Did the Pittsburg crew realise what was happening and make the ultimate sacrifice?
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Terrible day.
A few thoughts.
The BBC and CNN keep on about the amount of organisation required by the scum, but surely only a dozen or so were needed - 2 per a/c plus one at each airport to smuggle arms on board.
My experiences of US security lead my to believe that whilst passenger gate security is good, apron security is poor. I retired less than a year ago, but I had learnt enough about Boston security to avoid it if I chose.
Did the Pittsburg crew realise what was happening and make the ultimate sacrifice?
A few thoughts.
The BBC and CNN keep on about the amount of organisation required by the scum, but surely only a dozen or so were needed - 2 per a/c plus one at each airport to smuggle arms on board.
My experiences of US security lead my to believe that whilst passenger gate security is good, apron security is poor. I retired less than a year ago, but I had learnt enough about Boston security to avoid it if I chose.
Did the Pittsburg crew realise what was happening and make the ultimate sacrifice?
...the thin end thereof
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I am sad but not surprised that there has been the usual PPRuNe slanging match. Well said Danny.
As I have already said, this is not the time and the place guys. There are probably thousands dead, there could be thousands critically injured, let's just remember the human tragedy and not the politics of it.
I think that all here in the UK will agree with me that we stand by our American friends on this awful day for them.
As I have already said, this is not the time and the place guys. There are probably thousands dead, there could be thousands critically injured, let's just remember the human tragedy and not the politics of it.
I think that all here in the UK will agree with me that we stand by our American friends on this awful day for them.
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A CNN correspondent unfortunate to be on the one of the flights (the Pentagon one I think) phoned her husband at the time and reported that the flight had been hijacked by a number of men armed with knives, and that they had all (passengers and flight and cabin crew) had been herded towards the back of the plane.
One would guess that at least one of the doomed flights had an "aviation expert" hijacker with them.
One would guess that at least one of the doomed flights had an "aviation expert" hijacker with them.
...the thin end thereof
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whatsalizad -
I can understand your emotions are high but I think you will look at at reconsider your last post. Arafat has condemned these attacks. If I were you I would stay out of the politics for now, we in the UK are behind the USA but I don't agree with what you have just posted at all. By all means America should retaliate but your reaction seems very knee jerk. Leave it alone for now.
I can understand your emotions are high but I think you will look at at reconsider your last post. Arafat has condemned these attacks. If I were you I would stay out of the politics for now, we in the UK are behind the USA but I don't agree with what you have just posted at all. By all means America should retaliate but your reaction seems very knee jerk. Leave it alone for now.
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What can you say??
A sad day indeed. I would like to express my deepest sympathy to any people out there who have lost friends / relations in this tragic event. A sad day for aviation. A sad day for America.
I hope the USA response to this is carefull, calculated and above all rational.
Does anyone agree that all the aircraft involved were either 757 or 767 is of significance with regard to training?
May the dead rest in peace.
A sad day indeed. I would like to express my deepest sympathy to any people out there who have lost friends / relations in this tragic event. A sad day for aviation. A sad day for America.
I hope the USA response to this is carefull, calculated and above all rational.
Does anyone agree that all the aircraft involved were either 757 or 767 is of significance with regard to training?
May the dead rest in peace.
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WhatsaLizad, well written, there are way too many people in this world that are all to quick to jump on the almighty bandwagon and spout off without proper intel. In his own words....don't own a TV.....would indicate that there is no electrical outlet in his cave. I was glued to my TV for most of the day today, from watching the second aircraft impact the south tower to the collapse of building 7. I am speachless. Clearly an act of cowardice that I personally hope will be rewarded accordingly. I am one of your northern neighbours who send their sympathy and support. God Bless America
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They shall grow not old
As we that are left grow old
Age shall not weary them
Nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will remember them.
For the crew.
As we that are left grow old
Age shall not weary them
Nor the years condemn
At the going down of the sun
And in the morning
We will remember them.
For the crew.
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I think I finally understand what my parents mean when they say they will always remember exactly where and when they found out that JFK was shot.
It was really ironic a few hours before we started the HP and L course by watching a video on the tenerife crash un til today the worst ever incident in aviation history. And the lesson where we found out we started on the Tokyo convention dealing with unlawful interference. I couldn't wouldn't believe the person who told me, and now that i've seen that ac crash into the building probably hundreds of times i still find it impossible to believe. pilots get trained to do whatever a terrorist tells them to do, with the full expectation tat they are going to land at some airport and eventually get freed. pilots never get trained in the expectation that they are going to die. Is the the new form of terrorism then???if so, i hear sheep farming in the australian outback is still quite cheap to get into
It was really ironic a few hours before we started the HP and L course by watching a video on the tenerife crash un til today the worst ever incident in aviation history. And the lesson where we found out we started on the Tokyo convention dealing with unlawful interference. I couldn't wouldn't believe the person who told me, and now that i've seen that ac crash into the building probably hundreds of times i still find it impossible to believe. pilots get trained to do whatever a terrorist tells them to do, with the full expectation tat they are going to land at some airport and eventually get freed. pilots never get trained in the expectation that they are going to die. Is the the new form of terrorism then???if so, i hear sheep farming in the australian outback is still quite cheap to get into