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-   -   Which is the best helicopter for training? (https://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/75186-best-helicopter-training.html)

r22butters 22nd May 2018 16:19


Originally Posted by KNIEVEL77 (Post 10153878)
Some very interesting views on here but the original question hasn’t really been answered.
I suppose it’s all down to opinions.

That's because it all depends on why you want to fly.

aa777888 22nd May 2018 20:43


Originally Posted by KNIEVEL77 (Post 10153878)
Some very interesting views on here but the original question hasn’t really been answered.

It's been answered quite well, at least within the bounds of the questions posed most recently. But perhaps we should check in with those who posed questions: have they been answered?

Helisweet 22nd May 2018 23:12

H300, R22 was not designed for training, Cabri will beat R22 sales. MIL aeroclubs need to buy a few cheap trainers instead of feeding politicians. If money is not a problem, don´t kill your kids on R22.

r22butters 23rd May 2018 00:17


Originally Posted by Helisweet (Post 10154253)
...don´t kill your kids on R22.

:rolleyes:

Ascend Charlie 23rd May 2018 05:10

The best training aircraft was the Huey.

Old Farang 23rd May 2018 05:51


Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie (Post 10154388)
The best training aircraft was the Huey.

Especially so when those disgruntled little fellows on the ground insisted on taking potshots at you!

rotorfossil 23rd May 2018 07:01

I haven’t met an ideal training helicopter and I’ve flown most oft them. The 300 is the only one designed as a trainer, but is now too slow and the pitch attitude changes with speed are untypical. The 22 is too delicate and has bred a generation of instructors who are either “ on” the controls or try to correct student errors before they happen because of the very short intervention window. The old B47 was too sluggish, too slow, untypical in pitch attitude changes and needed far too much engineering time. The Hiiler 12 was even more so, had a very odd cyclic feel and big throttle/ lever coordination challenges. The R44 is the closest to the ideal in terms of handling, power and comfort but too expensive. However it was the type that I felt most comfortable as an instructor as you could allow the student to make mistakes ans see whether he corrected them himself. The Cabri is a good attempt, but also a bit delicate and expensive. I think that the fenestron introduces its own yaw handling peculiarities, ok if you are heading for an Airbus product.

gulliBell 24th May 2018 01:11


Originally Posted by Ascend Charlie (Post 10154388)
The best training aircraft was the Huey.

Yep, for basic training, agreed. The most docile, forgiving, and difficult to break. But for IFR training, if I had a choice I'd take a 76 every time. Different horses for different courses.

HeliHenri 24th May 2018 08:12


Originally Posted by rotorfossil (Post 10154457)
I haven’t met an ideal training helicopter and I’ve flown most oft them.

Hello rotorfossil,
What about the Enstrom 280 ?
.

timprice 24th May 2018 10:20

I agree with Henri, If we had a new Enstrom that would be the best, forgiving handling for the student.

HeliHenri 24th May 2018 10:54


Originally Posted by timprice (Post 10155583)
I agree with Henri, If we had a new Enstrom that would be the best, forgiving handling for the student.

Hello timprice,
The new TH 180 seems dead now ... http://www.pprune.org/rotorheads/560...ighlight=TH180
.

rotorfossil 25th May 2018 05:08

Heli Henri .Deliberately didn't mention Enstrom as haven’t had recent experience. Years ago we evaluated it but didn’t want the engineering problems associated with turbocharging for traning helicopters and the non turbocharged model was short of power. No issues with the handling but ultimately cost considerations led to the R22.


timprice 25th May 2018 07:49

Certainly taking along time, I don't know why could be a number of reason's plus change of owners.

Ascend Charlie 26th May 2018 05:21


the non turbocharged model was short of power.
The rotten Enstrom that was in my school needed 29" just to maintain level. No turbo, no level.

timprice 26th May 2018 07:09

We cruise in ours 21' MP solo and 22' MP dual, you must have had Shetland ponies in yours! (non turbo)

KNIEVEL77 26th May 2018 09:48

The school I was at leased a Cabri only because they couldn’t find an R22 but it was always in maintenance. I hope the newer Cabris are more reliable as I think this one was number 9 off the production line and well used. I wonder if the new schools are choosing the Cabri these days over the R22 even though the cost to both the school and student is higher.
I see Helicentre in Leicester only have Cabris and no R22s.

SASless 26th May 2018 12:16

Bell 47 G2, Hughes 269, or Hiller 12E.

As the question was qualified to require "helicopter" that excludes Robbies in my Book.

KNIEVEL77 26th May 2018 12:35



As the question was qualified to require "helicopter" that excludes Robbies in my Book.
Could you qualify your comment please.

gazpad 26th May 2018 15:47


Originally Posted by KNIEVEL77 (Post 10157270)
The school I was at leased a Cabri only because they couldn’t find an R22 but it was always in maintenance. I hope the newer Cabris are more reliable as I think this one was number 9 off the production line and well used. I wonder if the new schools are choosing the Cabri these days over the R22 even though the cost to both the school and student is higher.
I see Helicentre in Leicester only have Cabris and no R22s.

Interesting to read about your experience with the Cabri and maintenance.

My first trial flight was on a Cabri and the flight had to be rescheduled two times on short notice due to maintenance (at least I was told so...)

Awesome looking heli from outside and inside but I went on the 269C after that...

r22butters 26th May 2018 15:53


Originally Posted by KNIEVEL77 (Post 10157408)


As the question was qualified to require "helicopter" that excludes Robbies in my Book.
Could you qualify your comment please.

Don't bother, he's just another robbophobe.:ugh:


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