Ryder Cup In Sept
 

Hello All...!

If there are any Irish Heli Pilots online,I just wanted to know who is doing the ryder cup service.Heading over for it with and just wanted to see who to contact for the landing site information.:ok:

I beleive you need to contact Celtic helicopters in regards to operating at the Ryder Cup.

RYDER CUP 2006
 

Correctamundo,
Celtic Helicopters are gonna be operating a HAAMS service including fuel at the K Club during the Ryder Cup. Suggest you contact them for further info.

Maybe c ya there!:ok:

BC.

BladeCrack.

Thank you very much for that information, had a chat with the IAA today and got the same information from them.The lady who deals with HAMSS was not there today but I had the plesure of attending Punchardstown with Celtic Helicopters HAMSS last year and have to say that they where very professional and done a top job and look forward to seeing you all there.Talking a 430 in so see you there....! By the way any ideas if they are providing night parking....?

Probably as she was at Lasham (UK!) at the BHAB Special Events Spring briefing.

(Jan... I think...!)

The IAA will guide you as a good Ops Manager should. HAMMS available fom Celtic possibly IAA ( What a concept ) in Adobe. Interesting the amount of agency's involved, operators as well. I think there maybe a suprise for ALOT of heli customers, especially with the FATO, Parking and control potential.

I wonder how the Aer Corp Chaps will deal with the massive influx of civilian traffic in their playground? The R15 & R16, the MOA4 and the P23 could be a hindrance? Don't even mention the DELTA.........!!??? They may not be able to conduct their training for....well,...eh.... major economic, sport and touristic national events that need security by Land , Sea and the ever busy, strangely controlled Airspace. Or will there be Clear Sky procedures inplace, with no need to be concerned?? Sorry, I didn't mention the WX and it's accurate reporting / support system by the State......!:rolleyes:

Ryder Cup 06
 

[QUOTE=Helipolarbear]The IAA will guide you as a good Ops Manager should. HAMMS available fom Celtic possibly IAA ( What a concept ) in Adobe. Interesting the amount of agency's involved, operators as well. I think there maybe a suprise for ALOT of heli customers, especially with the FATO, Parking and control potential.

HeliPB,

What do you mean by the above???

Are the IAA running the HAMMS??

What kind of surprises with the FATO parking and control??

:hmm: Celtic Heli's will have the Info as they are the 'Official Helicopter Company' for the Ryder Cup 2006. But they'll be operating on the approval of the IAA. Should be very interesting event :cool:

A commom misconception. The operator of such a site does not require the approval of the authority. It's done off their own approval.

There are published "guidelines" regarding how a site should be setup / run.

I have to argee with you Bladecrack, I've flown into some of the events that Celtic ran and I was very impressed. They could'nt help me enough.

Looking forward to seeing you all at the RC

B111971. Not a 'common misconception' but a fact Ol'Chap! Suggest you read the OAM 08/00 and SI 72 and the 'discretionary powers of the Authority'.......then you won't have any misconceptions and will be well informed...Fly Safe now, ya'hear!:)

mmmhhhh, so what does OAM stand for??

Those fellows in authority must be telling porkies

OAM 08/00 - Helicopter Site Operators - Guidelines

OAM OPERATIONS ADVISORY MEMORANDUM

NO MENTION OF MANDATORY HERE.
:ok:

Hello Ladies and Gentlemen...!

Well first off I have to say well done to HAMMS "Celtic Helicopters" ATC and Jan for a great performance shown at the punchardstown races it was a pleasure to see such a professional team at work.I didnt actually have our chopper over but got a lift in with one of our partners, but I was over to see the set-up and not the racing and how it was all going to pan out and as perdicted 10/10.,as I'm sure anyone who attened would agree.

The other reason I've write this post is that I've come across some new post's regarding the up coming Ryder Cup on Rotor heads which where from people asking what was happening with airspace and landings at it, so may-be we can just use this post for any questions other wise it will only get a bit mad.:ok:

Point of Contact in the IAA for the Ryder Cup is Mr. Peter Kearney. You can email him via the website www.iaa.ie :)

HAMMS Registration Ryder Cup 2006
 

Just registered our 407 with Celtic Helicopters to operate at the K Club for the Ryder cup. Just letting you guys know cut off date for registration is the 18th of August so I suggest you register with Celtic +353 1 8901349 ASAP! They are also hosting a Pilot Brief which will be mandatory on the 25th of August in the Great Southern at Dublin Airport @ 1400hrs. :ok:

Does any one know how many aircraft have registered??

Dont have an answer to your question ketchup,but I have a question for you if you can answer it. On reading the AIC issued from the IAA, they dont give any contact details for HAMMS only an e-mail that will not work.,not that its a problem for me as I have already registeried my two choppers but I think that an offical document from the IAA should give more "CORRECT" information for people travelling to the Ryder-Cup.,I phoned the IAA to let them know on Monday and again on Friday of last week but it seems like I'm :ugh:. Celtic are aware of it but I under-stand its not there area but your IAA dont want to know,well in that I mean theres no one who can help.., is that a normal.:bored:

NORMAL????? Nothing is normal over here, but the word is it's getting better...sort of! If you call the IAA looking for information concerning the Ryder Cup, try ask for Captain Ian Dunn. He is an extremely helpful individual who will no doubt answer all your questions and guide you with great professionalism to a complete understanding of the Ryder Cup Heli Ops. But, in the unlikely event of not being able to contact Captain Dunn and no responses from your messages, you might contact Celtic Helicopters, who by the way, have a FUNCTIONING website!!!:} If that doesn't work, contact the Director and Head of the Safety and Regulation Division, Captain Kevin Humphries. I highly experienced Aviator who is also known to be very helpful to helicopter operators and pilots!!!!

Dublin CTR Revision
 

Remember that with effect from 0800z this thursday 3rd August 2006, the lateral boundaries of the Dublin CTR change to overlap the Weston ATZ and the R15. Weston will be providing an ATC service and have an area of responsibility within the Dub CTR. When Military Airspace is not active, Weston will also have control of traffic in the area of the CTR that covers the R15. Military may still activate & deactivate R15/R16 at very short notice and R23 is still active H24.

So when will a new map come out with this amendment on?

We have had a new map on back order for 12 months.

FNW

Correction.
 

The plan changed - when Military is not active, Dublin South will control traffic in the R15.

The map has been issued as an AIP ammendment. The new boundaries should be displayed on the EIDW Visual Approach Chart.

As a related issue, the Ryder cup TRA, will be the R15 + an area of the R16 (south of R15) and an area north of the R15 & West of the Weston AOR.

Not sure if this one has been published yet.

Follow Link
 

This link shows AIP Ireland Supplement 23/06.

http://www.iaa.ie/safe_reg/pdf/AIP_Supp_23-06.pdf

The third page is a map showing the Ryder Cup TRA. The TRA is superimposed over the new CTR and the lateral/vertical changes are visible.

nibog,

We get the AIP amendments and thankfully the AIP comes on CD. We do not fly around with the full AIP so will they be re-issueing the 1:500000 chart?

FNW

Well they should issue an up to date chart.

The current 1:500,000 dates from June 2002. I think that this is the first change since then that actually changes airspace boundaries, and as such it should have been available & easily accessible to flight crews well before the effective date.

Whether they do issue a new chart remains to be seen. I just don't know.

Ryder Cup 2006 K-Club (18-25 Sep 2006)
 

A Mandatory Pilot briefing is being held for Pilots/Operators flying into the K-Club Helicopter Air Marshalling Site Service (HAMSS) for the Ryder Cup 2006.

The briefing is being held Great Southern Hotel Dublin Airport (Malton 1 & 2) on the 25th August 2006 at 14:00 hours.

A suitably qualified representative from each operator or private owner wishing to use the HAMSS facilities at the K-Club must attend this briefing as it is a mandatory requirement and Ryder numbers will not be released unless a representative is in attendance.

For further information contact Celtic Helicopters Ltd on +3531 8901349

Ryder Cup 2006
 

Hello guys,
I have been asking the questions for the last two months. I agree with you HeliPB. I think it is the IAA that will be opreating the site with their controllers. I don't think they know what they will be letting themselves in for as it will not be at all like Punchestown, more like Galway and they may not have the experience to handle it. I was in Ballybrit, Galway last week for the Races and thought their opertion was excellent as it always is. Their briefing documents and information is first class. The only issue I have is that the number of landing s into Ballybrit was capped by the IAA at 300. Is the event at the Ryder cup capped also? The people at Ballybrit are very experienced at handling a large number of helicopters so if the Ryder cup is not capped why is Ballybrit which I believe have the same number of landing pads as the K Club.

Hello Mr.Conman....! Yes I was in Ballybrit last year and they where very good,and as you ask the question why there is no Cap on movements at the K-Club,well maybe I can see why this is so. It appears that its nearly three times the size of bally-brit,has a radar service from Dublin and if R15 and R16 is active for the duration of the event a radar service from Baldonnel.They have airtraffic controlers which I presume are the same from Punch on the field which where equally as good as Bally-brit and unlike Bally-Brit,provide I think a parking area.I have been in contact with the IAA over the past two weeks and NIBOG has said that the IAA are in charge of the landing area,well this is not the case:= ,they are a goverment/state body, which can only approve not control the site the same as it is every where in Europe:uhoh: .The IAA have said that its HAMMS celtic helicopters who are in charge the same guys from Punch,who I said a few weeks ago in an earlier post:ugh: .Anyway any more questions I'm sure can be answered at that meeting on the 25 see you all there.

The 430-driver:D

Ryder Cup HAMSS 2006
 

For everyones info!

:ok: Basically the extension of the zone is 5nm DME West from the WST VOR 114.7 located at EIWT. If in doubt contact Paul Mullins, Airport Manager and SATCO @ Weston +353 1 628 0435. They are currently operating from 0800 thru 1800 subject to start and end of official VFR.
If you plan on attending the Ryder Cup, suggest you submit your requirements and requests to Celtic Helicopters prior to 30th of August as they have to coordinate slot times for all traffic concerned.
Van Wilder......I do believe it is a ground to air advisory service and not Controlled!!! And I'm equally sure that the IAA will be there promoting and regulating the safety aspects of our biznis to one and all......maybe!!!:ok:
Y'all fly safely now, Y'hear!!!!!:cool:

WTF
 

Where'd I say that???
The IAA is the Regulatory body and has authority to establish TRAs and to designate Responsibility for the Provision of Service within designated areas and the greater FIR also. That is not to say that they must provide that service themselves, but they are responsible for ensuring that the appropriate service is provided nonetheless. Part of this service is to publish maps and charts that accurately reflect the airspace they are responsible for.
The IAA have established a TRA for the Ryder Cup. My previous post links to the appropriate AIP Supplement. Responsibility for the provision of Air Traffic Services within the TRA is with the MATSU (ATC Baldonnel). Celtic have been designated an area of responsibility within that TRA for the provision of HAAMS at the FATO. MATSU will sequence and hold arriving helicopters and they will be released to HAAMS upon passing/exiting the holds. The routes and altitudes have been agreed and test flown. There might be a Military Controller (Co-ordinator) on the Ground at K-Club during the event.

All of this is still subject to change prior to the briefing. Inbound and Outbound routes could be tweaked. There are designated visual reporting points for the event and the routes follow along a series of these VRPs, and the holding points are shown at the relevant VHPs.

Go the the hotel & listen to the briefing. At that stage the procedures should be finalised.

Ryder Cup 2006
 

The only new maps I have seen are in the notams and in th AICs recently issued, the update has gone through for the gpsmap 296 also. Makes sense to increase the area into the Kildare region with the high traffic volumes....

Ryder Cup briefing
 

Thought that went well!

Ryder Brief
 

Thought that Bal ATC have made the procedures overly complex myself, from what it started out as, and I know the area quite well, whats the average low time or visiting pilot gonna make of it? :rolleyes:

I read that they're looking at 600+ movements a day, thats heavy going, especially given that its a non airfield site. Stay safe guys.

As for the event itself... talk about overhyped, its a minor sporting event in global TV terms (last one was outside the top 15) not to mention the security... nah, we won't go there :E

Less of the hype!
 

Easy now! := That figure was not printed in the news paper about three weeks ago and is in no way factual. The predicted figures are closer to 300 movements for the sunday which is the biggest day. This was quoted by Jeanne Schworer, the HAMSS Manager, in the Irish Times two weeks ago. :ugh:

Daily Movements
 

I'd say 600 is reasonably close to the number of movements that there could be per day.

Anyone know how many heli movements the last Ryder Cup had? I heard it was 700+ per day. I also heard that over 150 Helicopters have registered for this Ryder Cup Operation at the K-Club. A fair number of the machines will be dropping off their pax/owners and parking up for the day, but you can bet your ass there'll be plenty of helis ferrying the public to and from the event from the various feeder sites.

I also agree with Bladecrack - the procedures could have been made much much simpler. Complex new procedures in a new airspace layout with lots of sectors either bordering or within 10 miles of each other may lead to confusion on the day and frequencies are likely to be very busy or even saturated. Does anybody know if there'll be an element of Flow-Control in use??

Disipline & Patience will be required from all participants in the air & on the ground. Fly Safe, keep a good look out and don't be pressured into anything.


BTW - I have absolutely NO influence or input into the design or set up of the Ryder Cup HAMSS / MATSU Operations.:ugh:

Test flights
 

Can anyone give me a reason why any pilot should be told to stop flying the routes in order to get acquanted with the hold and VRP's?

You'll need to be more specific about the exact circumstances.

The Routes into and out of the K-Club penetrate controlled/restricted airspace. The controlling authority can and will restrict you in order to protect their IFR routes.

The Approved K-Club Routes interfere to some extent with IFR procedures at Weston and at Baldonnel. During the Ryder Cup there should be some level of priority given to the K-Club traffic, but until then you'll have to get aquainted with the routes by filing a Flight Plan including your intended operarion as a RMK/..., getting up there, requesting to fly the route and being prepared to hold until a suitable gap in traffic allows your flight. If you're asked to "stop flying the routes" then it should only be a temporary restriction.

Military Airspace is often de-activated after 1700. It should be easier to fly in that area of the CTR then.

So how does everyone think it went? Didn't seem as busy as predicted, then the weather played its part too, didn't have to hold at all! :D

Read an article into today's Irish Indo in which an Aer Lingus, Captain (think he's the one that was organising the Punchestown Airshow - Mach1) claims that it was historic as it was the single biggest movement of helicopters ever in the state. Well done to all concerned. Out of interest anyone know how many movements at Ballybrit?