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NZ Volcano eruption on White Island
Early reports are often unreliable.
50 tourists were thought to be on the island and 23 have been accounted for so far, five of them confirmed dead. Every survivor had injuries :( Some tourists were from the cruise ship Ovation of the Seas. This link shows a damaged AS 350 (?) adjacent what looks to be a raised pad. https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...no-new-zealand 2018 Video of heli operations. |
White Island Eruption
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/in-pictures-50711958
Third image down, abandoned Helicopter? centre right, hope everyone is ok. Looks like a damned good force landing. https://cimg4.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....08a024802f.jpg |
Another video showed the wreckage of a helicopter that had been flying over the island when the eruption happened.
Volcanic Air, a tour company based in Rotorua, later confirmed that the pilot and four passengers were unharmed and had returned to the mainland via boat on Monday afternoon. https://www.vice.com/en_us/article/q...-island-erupts https://volcanicair.co.nz/fleet/ |
I suspect that the AS350 in that picture was not flying over the island but was on the ground. You can visit White Island via a boat trip of several hours or via a 30 minute helicopter ride. Both tours leave from the closest town - Whakatane (pronounced with an F).
White Island is described as New Zealand's most active volcano, but the activity is mostly steam from fumaroles and a nearly-boiling crater lake. There are occasional, infrequent explosive discharges of steam and ash (phreatic eruptions) like yesterday's. There has not been eruption of lava in at least 200 years. When I visited White Island ten years ago, R44s were being used and one was already on the ground when we arrived. The landing area is about 700 m from the active crater lake which is consistent with the location of the AS350 in Nutloose's picture. Helicopter landing area with the crater in the background: https://cimg2.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....b3c1753fd6.jpg Fumaroles. The steam is continuously venting with a sound like a large, subterranean steam-engine. A strong sulphur smell in the air: https://cimg8.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....fa7c51fb3d.jpg https://cimg9.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....afd3dc12f.jpeg Crater lake - 90ş C and a pH similar to battery acid: https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....db8daa9cb4.jpg Our pilot/guide returning to the helicopter. We were issued with hard hats and respirators, but I imagine these would not have been much use in yesterday's eruption: https://cimg1.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....de269d2324.jpg White Island is private land. I suspect that after this accident, the rules may change or it may even be taken over by the government: https://cimg3.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....08e69b34a.jpeg |
What do you think accounts for the rotor damage, the eruption? |
Originally Posted by NutLoose
(Post 10635740)
What do you think accounts for the rotor damage, the eruption? |
My guess is a big rock coming down. |
Quote" "White Island is private land. I suspect that after this accident, the rules may change or it may even be taken over by the government"
That isn't how the Govt works in NZ. They won't take over the island. There will certainly be a look over operations to the island, especially considering the eruption risk recently increased. People tend to forget that it is VERY active. There are still 10 bodies there somewhere from 1914 when the Sulphur mine disappeared in a mud slide. Only the cat survived. We regularly had Tsunami drills at school. The crater is barely above sea level and if it does blow, the rapid influx of sea water would set up a catastrophic explosion similar but smaller to Krakatoa. In my town we had 4 minutes (from very distant memory!) to get out. So our drill was to hide under our desks. Hmmmmm. It is an unforgettable experience walking in the crater. Even more so when you come to the end of the path, only to find that the path did continue on the day before but has now been swallowed by the volcano! |
I used to fly tours out there for the red rash early in my career. White Island experiences 100's of earthquakes a day somedays but mostly only minor and you'd never know unless you were looking at the seismographs. About the end of my time there I spent two days with the geologists ferrying them around while they installed equipment. That was around the time of the first of the big Christchuch quakes in around 2010/11. We were on our way out when all their phones started pinging, much conversation followed in the aircraft about CHCH going off. WI is a very interesting place and as was said above eye opening when a section of track that you walked yesterday or this morning isn't there anymore. I would not be surprised if this quake is just a warm up.
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According to reports in NZ, four helicopters landed on White Island in the immediate aftermath of the eruption, and rescued all the victims who were accessible - the eight left behind had almost certainly already passed away. One machine was a HEMS, the others were private aircraft.
The pilots - and the onboard paramedic(s) in the HEMS - willingly took themselves and their aircraft into an extremely hazardous landing zone: the wrecked machine shown in the first post being a visible warning to them all. For all any of them knew, the volcano could let loose again at any time. Thanks and major applause to those crews |
Well done these crews... Respect and admiration. Fly safe and sad condolences to families of those who did not escape in time.
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I did a trip to White Island in 1997 about a year before I moved from Gisborne to Wairarapa.
It was with a company called Vulcan Helicopters, but I don't think they exist any more. We flew out there in a Hughes 500, four of us plus the pilot. It was an amazing trip, but I got the feeling it could potentially be a very dangerous place and the air was full of sulphur fumes. |
And as for talk about banning tours to White Island … New Zealand loses hundreds of people in motor vehicle crashes on our roads every year.
So does this mean we should ban using motor vehicles on roads? After all, motor vehicle crashes kill many, many, many times more people than volcanos do in NZ. |
Originally Posted by etudiant
(Post 10635933)
What is that four engined fixed wing type in the background of the second photo?
https://www.google.com/search?q=vulc...Jlbeq-k9OOlpM: Not sure if a Vulcan even went to NZ |
Originally Posted by nomorehelosforme
(Post 10635945)
I might be miles off with this but bearing in mind there was a company called Vulcan, could the fixed wing be this? https://www.google.com/search?q=vulc...Jlbeq-k9OOlpM: Not sure if a Vulcan even went to NZ Here's a further image of the Volcanic Air AS350 from yesterday https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....6dd8feb753.jpg |
Blown off its perch John!
Re Post 15.. What is that four engined fixed wing type in the background of the second photo? |
Just read a news article, the chickenlickens are already asking why people are allowed to go there? OMG THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!!!!!!
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Originally Posted by Autonomous Collectiv
(Post 10636001)
Just read a news article, the chickenlickens are already asking why people are allowed to go there? OMG THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!!!!!!
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News last night had an unfortunate video taken from an elevated position of a party of about four individuals walking a path close to the crater a minute before it blew. RIP I assume.
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Originally Posted by Autonomous Collectiv
(Post 10636001)
Just read a news article, the chickenlickens are already asking why people are allowed to go there? OMG THINK OF THE CHILDREN!!!!!!!!!!
Motor vehicle crashes on NZ roads kill hundreds of people every year … way more than any volcano has ever killed in New Zealand, including the Mount Tarawera eruption and the Tangiwai rail disaster. |
Monday 19th September 1994 Rabaul Airport , Papua New Guinea the BN2 & Cessna 402s belonged to Airlink and the AS350 was owned by Pacific Helicopters. I will never forget that morning we were the only flyable light Aircraft to leave (Airlink Cessna 404) just after 6am minutes after Tavurvur erupted,followed by the Air Niugini F-28 which had overnighted and they were the last Aircraft to ever use the old Airport, we landed at the disused Tokua Airport, now the main Rabaul Airport.
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Originally Posted by Kiwithrottlejockey
(Post 10635911)
I did a trip to White Island in 1997 about a year before I moved from Gisborne to Wairarapa.
It was with a company called Vulcan Helicopters, but I don't think they exist any more. We flew out there in a Hughes 500, four of us plus the pilot. It was an amazing trip, but I got the feeling it could potentially be a very dangerous place and the air was full of sulphur fumes. Yes, Vulcan Helicopters used to operate out to White Island out of Whakatane. Robert was the owner and pilot. I used to work for him as ground crew cleaning his helicopter every day after the last tour. He sold the Hughes and got a BK117 B2, with 10 seats. Being such a corrosive environment, Robert and I spent about 2 hours each day cleaning his aircraft and gear carefully, compressor wash etc. Hard hats and gas masks for all. PJ’s tours was the boat based operator. Every operator out there was very cautious and in contact with GNS volcanologist all the time. These are not cowboy operators. I’m quite frankly disgusted about some of the comments made by the attention seeking volcanologist from Monash that is Captain Hindsight. Obvious attempt to grab his 3 seconds of fame and hopefully life time of infamy. Pratt. Tours have operated to White Island for over 30 years managing the risk carefully. I ve also been to White Island a few times too. You’d land near the water at the flat area where the crater walk has gone. Then it was about a hour walk around the island, often to the crater lake edge, but back from it because it wasn’t sure how stable the edge was. The island is alive. It lives and breathes. It moves and definitely has moods. There are many fumaroles belching out jets of steam at over 150 km/hr. Was like standing next to a jet engine exhaust.The air is acrid. Sour like lemon juice but 10x worse. Hence masks on. Often your clothes would come back bleached from the sulphuric acid vapour. Volcanoes by by their nature are unpredictable. It doesn’t make the loss any more acceptable but a criminal investigation and apportioning blame will achieve very little. But such is the ill considered emotion reaction of the internet generation that doesn’t have the foggiest idea about risk management and judgement. |
Here is some helicopter footage in the immediate aftermath of the eruption.
t starts as a daunting white cloud hanging in the distance - and it doesn't take long for the enormity of the White Island volcano blast to become clear. Footage shows what courageous helicopter rescuers went through as they battled their way through thick clouds of smoke, ash and acidic steam following the eruption on Monday. The death toll is feared to be as high as 13 after the volcano, known locally as Whakaari, blew off the coast of New Zealand's North Island at 2.11pm local time. Footage released by the Auckland Rescue Helicopter Trust shows two brave first responders landing on the island and shielding their eyes from billowing ash. https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...oll-rises.html |
Originally Posted by Kiwithrottlejockey
(Post 10636035)
Those chickenlickens should be asking why people are allowed to drive motor vehicles on New Zealand's roads.
Motor vehicle crashes on NZ roads kill hundreds of people every year … way more than any volcano has ever killed in New Zealand, including the Mount Tarawera eruption and the Tangiwai rail disaster. Personally I never had any interest playing Russia roulette with an active volcano. Same with testing my driving skills in Nigeria :p |
Originally Posted by ApolloHeli
(Post 10635742)
My guess is a big rock coming down. It's not only ash that gets thrown upwards during an eruption....
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Just for reference to what kind of damage a volcanic eruption can do....for tens of miles distant from the Volcano.
Also....for those operating aircraft and vehicles in volcanic dust.....it is very abrasive pumice. Inspect your aircraft very...very carefully to include inside the gearboxes and engines....bearings...bushings....everything. https://www.livescience.com/27553-mo...-eruption.html https://rarehistoricalphotos.com/eru...t-helens-1980/ |
Originally Posted by John Eacott
(Post 10635949)
......
Here's a further image of the Volcanic Air AS350 from yesterday https://cimg5.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune....6dd8feb753.jpg Could it be maneuver caused? |
Two of three blades damaged identically....third looks undamaged.
Seems odd two of three would fail from the same maneuvering forces at the same point on the blades but the third shows no similar failure. |
Considering it looks like it has been blown off the back of the pad, the blades more than likely failed in bending overload in the "up" direction first?
I assume it was "parked" before the eruption facing the direction of the blast? Some serious air velocity there. |
Originally Posted by Nubian
(Post 10636324)
Would bet on the wind generated from the blast, and not falling rocks. The machine has moved off the platform (aft it seems) and I can only imagine the amount of flapping those blades would do being exposed to such wind force. The blades does not seem to have any other damage than them being snapped.
Incidentally, one report says the pilot/guide and his 4 pax were among the less-injured evacuees, presumably because they (and the helo) were at the foot of the cwm near the sea and boat docks, while the eruption came from the upper end (lake area). |
Originally Posted by pattern_is_full
(Post 10636575)
Exactly - the aircraft was parked on the wooden pallet and neither flying nor running. Just sitting there, and damaged and dislodged by the blast wave.
Incidentally, one report says the pilot/guide and his 4 pax were among the less-injured evacuees, presumably because they (and the helo) were at the foot of the cwm near the sea and boat docks, while the eruption came from the upper end (lake area). A down draught effect from the initial ejection of earth as it fell back to ground? Quotes from 1st responder pilot. https://i.stuff.co.nz/national/11810...-chopper-pilot Mjb |
I'm no geologist but could the hot ash "melt" or thermally weaken the blades and cause the structural failures seen in the photo? I agree that it does not look like impact damage now that there are better images.
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Very sadly, the death toll from this will eventually be much higher.
Those seriously injured are very badly burned. An old boss who used to be an ED nurse once told me death is inevitable in situations like that - body simply cannot cope. Usually takes a few days. Dreadful. |
Blade Damage.
Could the blades all have “melted”? Drooped due heat at the end of an internal “spar”? |
Blade failure White Island
Most rotor blades are fabricated by adhesively bonding skins onto the spar and a honeycomb core. Adhesive design properties change significantly with temperature, the hotter the adhesive, the lower the strength and stiffness. If they get hot enough, the temperature may pass what is termed the Glass Transition Temperature where they change from a stiff glassy material to a soft, weak rubbery material. My guess is that the adhesive became so weak that the weight of the blades and the ash caused the blade to fail.
So sad. Blakmax |
Originally Posted by blakmax
(Post 10636937)
Most rotor blades are fabricated by adhesively bonding skins onto the spar and a honeycomb core. Adhesive design properties change significantly with temperature, the hotter the adhesive, the lower the strength and stiffness. If they get hot enough, the temperature may pass what is termed the Glass Transition Temperature where they change from a stiff glassy material to a soft, weak rubbery material. My guess is that the adhesive became so weak that the weight of the blades and the ash caused the blade to fail.
So sad. Blakmax |
Originally Posted by Gate_15L
(Post 10636170)
My condolences to all affected and those that have lost loved ones. Yes, Vulcan Helicopters used to operate out to White Island out of Whakatane. Robert was the owner and pilot. I used to work for him as ground crew cleaning his helicopter every day after the last tour. He sold the Hughes and got a BK117 B2, with 10 seats. Being such a corrosive environment, Robert and I spent about 2 hours each day cleaning his aircraft and gear carefully, compressor wash etc. Hard hats and gas masks for all. PJ’s tours was the boat based operator. Every operator out there was very cautious and in contact with GNS volcanologist all the time. These are not cowboy operators. I’m quite frankly disgusted about some of the comments made by the attention seeking volcanologist from Monash that is Captain Hindsight. Obvious attempt to grab his 3 seconds of fame and hopefully life time of infamy. Pratt. Tours have operated to White Island for over 30 years managing the risk carefully. I ve also been to White Island a few times too. You’d land near the water at the flat area where the crater walk has gone. Then it was about a hour walk around the island, often to the crater lake edge, but back from it because it wasn’t sure how stable the edge was. The island is alive. It lives and breathes. It moves and definitely has moods. There are many fumaroles belching out jets of steam at over 150 km/hr. Was like standing next to a jet engine exhaust.The air is acrid. Sour like lemon juice but 10x worse. Hence masks on. Often your clothes would come back bleached from the sulphuric acid vapour. Volcanoes by by their nature are unpredictable. It doesn’t make the loss any more acceptable but a criminal investigation and apportioning blame will achieve very little. But such is the ill considered emotion reaction of the internet generation that doesn’t have the foggiest idea about risk management and judgement. I agree entirely. |
Gate_15L,
Thank you for that accurate and considered dose of reality and common sense. The public has very little idea of what risk management involves. And instant analyses by those who do not know what they are talking about, and often with demands for instant retribution, do not help at all. Sympathy should be extended to all the victims and there relatives, but also to those who tried to manage the risks in a responsible manner, but were caught out. |
Originally Posted by Twist & Shout
(Post 10636847)
Blade Damage.
Could the blades all have “melted”? Drooped due heat at the end of an internal “spar”? The machine is off the pad, with it's right landing gear and one blade buried in the gravel/ash/sand, partly resting on that blade (look at the position of the blade-root/sleeve/star). Now, I'd like to know how hot ash would cause all of that..... and as John say, why no other melting damages? |
Could the blades all have “melted”? Drooped due heat at the end of an internal “spar”? |
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