Originally Posted by Fareastdriver
(Post 10639579)
It would have made the cabins rattle in that container ship.
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A report on the conditions which the recovery team endured... https://www.smh.com.au/world/oceania/past-the-limits-of-endurance-recovery-team-go-back-to-white-island-to-search-for-last-body-20191215-p53k29.html Mjb |
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Thanks Kiwithrottlejockey its a bit bigger than I thought.
The only missing bit is the scale: Heights in meters, and grid scale in kilometers. |
Snowfella - when you read the article in mjb's link, it becomes quite clear why they used elite troops for the job. Few others would cope with the conditions.
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Originally Posted by [email protected]
(Post 10641033)
Snowfella - when you read the article in mjb's link, it becomes quite clear why they used elite troops for the job. Few others would cope with the conditions.
Now for an insensitive remark (for some I guess) but I fail to understand why we expose large numbers of people to such dangers in order to recover worm/fish food. Rescuing live people is a different story. Believe me, If I'm dead I don't want a group of people dying trying to recover my remains. |
Originally Posted by 212man
(Post 10641048)
Now for an insensitive remark (for some I guess) but I fail to understand why we expose large numbers of people to such dangers in order to recover worm/fish food. Rescuing live people is a different story. Believe me, If I'm dead I don't want a group of people dying trying to recover my remains.
Post traumatic stress of not recovering a body is debilitating to remaining family and friends. Versus.. A member of the armed services dying in a heroic rescue mission is politically acceptable. The outside world was told the odds of a second eruption were 50/50. Presumably there is more to the story than a roll of the dice at those odds? mjb |
Originally Posted by 212man
(Post 10641048)
Very fraught mission and with considerable concerns at senior levels: https://www.nzherald.co.nz/nz/news/article.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=12294356
Now for an insensitive remark (for some I guess) but I fail to understand why we expose large numbers of people to such dangers in order to recover worm/fish food. Rescuing live people is a different story. Believe me, If I'm dead I don't want a group of people dying trying to recover my remains. However: 1. NZ had a mining disaster where some bodies were never recovered - they are still feeling bad about that outcome. In that case, it might have been a “hope fading” situation - Awful. 2. It is important for some families that the remains of loved ones are recovered. Some religions/beliefs I guess? |
Now for an insensitive remark (for some I guess) but I fail to understand why we expose large numbers of people to such dangers in order to recover worm/fish food. Rescuing live people is a different story. Believe me, If I'm dead I don't want a group of people dying trying to recover my remains. |
The only missing bit is the scale: Heights in meters, and grid scale in kilometers. I've already had my 5c worth (or less) on the recovering of the deceased on the other coverage of this topic in JB (Also FWIW). To summarise - I understand why they "had to do it ...." dangerous though it might be. I recall reading somewhere that the risk another eruption at the time of the then projected mission was around 6% . Not bad odds, but who could be totally confident? :eek: Very brave and dedicated people there. I salute them. |
Originally Posted by Twist & Shout
(Post 10641120)
I personally agree with you 100%.
However: 1. NZ had a mining disaster where some bodies were never recovered - they are still feeling bad about that outcome. In that case, it might have been a “hope fading” situation - Awful. 2. It is important for some families that the remains of loved ones are recovered. Some religions/beliefs I guess? |
Originally Posted by GordonR_Cape
(Post 10640985)
Thanks Kiwithrottlejockey its a bit bigger than I thought.
The only missing bit is the scale: Heights in meters, and grid scale in kilometers. The grid squares are 1,000 metres across. The topographical lines on the map are spaced at 20 metres altitude apart. The bolder lines are multiples of 100 metres. I can do you a 3D version if you like. Give me a bit of time and I'll post it. You obviously aren't familiar with New Zealand topgraphical 1:50,000 scale maps. |
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Originally Posted by 601
(Post 10641639)
And we have been conditioned by the media that we all require "closure"
Originally Posted by Twist & Shout
2. It is important for some families that the remains of loved ones are recovered. Some religions/beliefs I guess?
Originally Posted by 212man
Believe me, If I'm dead I don't want a group of people dying trying to recover my remains.
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wrench, your post :ok::D During the Vietnam conflict the Oz government decided they would not repatriate bodies, but inter them in a Malaysian War Grave cemetery. Families objected and had policy overturned, so bodies were returned to the home town and interred with full military protocol, church service, gun carriage, band, firing party etc As someone whose brother was a recipient of such recognition I can only endorse the thrust of your post.
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And I saw his name engraved on the Roll of Honor at the Australian War Memorial in Canberra (9 RAR). We will remember them.
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Originally Posted by megan
(Post 10643242)
wrench, your post :ok::D During the Vietnam conflict the Oz government decided they would not repatriate bodies, but inter them in a Malaysian War Grave cemetery. Families objected and had policy overturned, so bodies were returned to the home town and interred with full military protocol, church service, gun carriage, band, firing party etc As someone whose brother was a recipient of such recognition I can only endorse the thrust of your post.
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Originally Posted by 212man
(Post 10643557)
If my desire to bury a loved one now, rather than in 6-8 weeks, resulted in the deaths of 6 soldiers, the creation of 6 new widows and maybe a dozen fatherless kids I'd probably feel pretty bad about it! It's an emotive topic that does not always bear logical scrutiny.
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TV news here reported that the body retrieval crew on White Island determined the risk at 6% by whatever metrics they used. They deemed that acceptable, who are we sat on the sidelines to criticise. Job well done lasses and lads.
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