Helicopter max climb altitude
 

Hi, guys

What's the highest altitude a helicopter can climb?

Depends on which machine, all up weight, DA, updrafts, what You had for breakfast, luck, etc etc..........28,500'amsl for a filming job :eek:

After starting the engine, they removed the starter motor to save weight.

Then when the engine flamed out at 40 squillion feet, they set the record for the world's highest autorotation, as there was no way to relight the engine.

PS you are too lazy to Gurgle the answer yourself?

Bit harsh AC, there's lots of stuff asked here that could be Gargoyled but where's the fun in that? All you get then is answers - no banter, no anecdotes, no handbags at dawn.

Record broken in 2002 apparently
 

About thirty years after the record set by Jean Boulet on a SA315 B “Lama” helicopter, Fred North, professional pilot, takes an AS 350 B2 “Squirrel” to the fantastic altitude of 12954 m.

https://www.fred-north.com/record

Good to see you're still with us, VF! Is life treating you alright, Mate?

- Ed

That's it!

G'day Ed...thanks for asking Mate, doing awesomely & having a ball, hope You are too :ok:

Over 40 000' you need pressure oxygen, a demand system won't cope. On the jet at FL420 we are required to keep our masks strung round our necks.

SND

Certainly a daft question.

Generally speaking oxygen is recommended when flying about 10,000 ft in an unpressurised aircraft.

We were trained at RAF North Luffenham how to use a pressure breathing system. It's a very strange sensation, being the opposite of normal breathing.

For the past 25 years I’ve been operating close to sea level. The highest I’ve been to in a helicopter (Bell407) was up to FL110 for a photo mission. Didn’t like it :=

In a previous part of my career we were sometimes required to climb as high as the aircraft could hover without breaking any engine limits and remain there for some time (usually about 10,000 feet or so). One night we were required to be a little higher, about 14,000 feet. I suddenly noticed that the orange sodium streetlights below us no longer looked quite so orange, and my vision became mainly monochrome, like black and white TV. I realised it was likely to be an early symptom of hypoxia. Thankfully, we were able to descend shortly afterwards and as soon as we had gone down a couple of thousand feet, my colour vision returned to normal.

If my memory hasn't completely failed me (and it might have), I think at 14,000 feet the air (and oxygen) density is only about 55% of that at sea level.

Great height and helicopters is, for many of us, NOT a good mix. Did a height climb air test in a Sycamore in Aden and felt distinctly vertiginous from 1000' until back there in descent. Much more relaxed at 500' and below. One of my 'Bosses' on Whirlwinds said the only way he could manage the required 10.000' air test climb was to imagine an enormous pair of swept wings attached, out of sight, to the lower fuselage. A lot to do with low speed - 60 knots at 10K feels like a hover.

Vertical ref can tell you what it's like at 23,000'++, all I have been to is 17,000 in a Huey, the blades going Wok..swish...wok..swish... Minimum speed was about 40kt, Vne was around 50kt so the envelope was substantially reduced. Then when we rolled the throttle off, we had to hold a large amount of collective in to keep the rotor RPM in limits.

can anybody provide some technical insight about the factor of high altitude flying in a helicopter,

my experience is only with a H300 at 10,000ft and AS350 at 12,000tf

• reduced power margin especially in the piston machine, but a lot can still be done if you remain very smooth
• blades having a much more frequent and drier slapping sound
• passengers tend to fall asleep at the back especially young ones
• VNE coming much sooner (at least the pre VNE vibration coming sooner)
• control margin decreasing quickly away from the max rate of climb speed (especially as you get to 0 rate of climb)
• very easy to over NG if you decrease altitude fast ( I have yet to fully understand that one)

any other factors?

In a turbine, you'll always be Ng limited so depending on helicopter type P2 bleed / heating not allowed if you're landing or taking off with max power etc.

G'day R....depends on the countries regs? Usually above 10,000' You've gotta be sucking on O2 if there for over 30mins. Other countries same deal but starts at 14,000'. But also depends on Your Health, smoker, etc....seen many a Pilots get problems above 15,000' even on O2? Also depends on how acclimatioed You are.....when I was flying to 20,000'+ 2, 3 times a day, sleeping at 10,000' every night then landing at 18,000 'for fuel staging without O2 was easy with nil effects, even when I camped there (@18,000' due weather), drunk a half bottle of Ruksi that night & still no effect the next morning ;)


If not acclimatised to high altitudes...I'd be donned O2 continuously operating above 10,000', if You're an asthmatic or a smoker then start sucking above 8,000' :ok:

Seriously.....Ng limited hmmmm not in any American build donks :ooh:
Seriously.....P2 bleed dingle bits do NOT need to be off for take-off, nor landings, use is 'as required' with a caution that performance is degraded (singles that I fly) :ouch:

Agreed, Sometimes it's better to keep the airbleeds on, such as when flying in cold/humid conditions. The chance of the canopy misting up near the ground can be far more serious than losing a little power. I know of one fatal takeoff accident where canopy misting was the cause and another where it was a likely cause.

Unless you are gong to look at something that is 10,000ft. plus there seem little point of going that high.

Well, photography of tall things can sometimes call for it. Back in the early 1980's I was hired to shoot photos for a book on Mexico's national parks and "natural wonders." My publisher wanted some shots of Volcan Popocateptl outside Mexico City, so in addition to the ground visit, we hired a Hughes 500 (if I remember right) and pilot out of Aeropuerto Benito Juárez.

It was a beautiful clear day, flying over to the volcano with the door removed on my side. To get a good angle on the volcano, the pilot kept climbing higher as we slowly circled it. The mountain is 17,802 ft. high. I wasn't paying attention to the gauges but I know we didn't get high enough to see into the caldera, so I'd estimate we reached maybe 14,000-15,000 feet. I remember at one point the pilot said we had set a local altitude record for helicopters. That surprised me; I didn't think we were up that high. The ground looks abstract and difficult to judge height once you get high enough. I do remember how cold it got. I hadn't thought ahead about what it would be like with the door off at that altitude, and wasn't dressed for it. Lesson learned for later air-photo flights in mountainous areas.

I don't remember any ill effects from the altitude. We weren't up there for more than a few minutes, and I had been staying for a couple of weeks in a hotel in Mexico City at 7,000 ft. I guess I was partially acclimated, and so was the pilot working out of that airport.

I was thinking about 10,000ft. AGL.

Max Altitude
 

Fascinating reading!

"...... Because of the ice and clouds, the test pilot had no outside visibility. Attitude instruments had been removed to lighten the helicopter. Boulet looked up through the canopy at the light spot in the clouds created by the sun, and used that for his only visual reference until he broke out of the clouds......"

https://www.thisdayinaviation.com/21-june-1972/

Once flew a Jetranger at 10,000', doors off. Didn't like it either, especially when encountering some light turbulence. :uhoh:

I've been up at 15,000' in a S-92 and a Blackhawk for flight testing. I can tell you the S-92 does not like to do an engine restart at 15,000'. We ended up descending to 13,000' where it did restart.

Some great reads here. What about Link Luckett and his Hiller 12E.... I remember that as a kid. Will have to research a bit... :ok:

We were looking to see if mountain goats really did live in the clouds.

Been to the very top of the Matterhorn (14,692 feet) in an AS350 (Air Zermatt). Brilliant blue skies and the machine handled it easily.
Unfortunately staying in the village for several days did my head in (migraines).

Doing the first turbine endorsement (Huey) one exercise was attempting to get into vortex ring at 14,000, never did, but had to wear parachute for anything over 5,000. Training in the USN oxygen was required above 10,000 day and 5,000 night. FW instrument flying training was done between 10 and 20,000, never used oxygen as found the mask so uncomfortable, never had a problem, 20YO and fit I guess. Some of the US Army chaps I flew with in country had a fear of anything above 1,500 because of MGB failure worries, took one such lad to 16,000 in a Huey trying to quell his fears. Regularly flew IMC at 10,000 on transits in 212, 412, 76, LSALT in our area being 6,000 though airport at each end being at sea level.

Having spent a bit of time on filming jobs at 10k+ AGL in helicopters, I disagree.

Namaste VF

I keep looking at the threads for your contribution, glad to hear you are well, can you give us a clue as to your whereabouts and what you are up to?
Missing the sleek trim photographs of.........helicopters, hope Mrs VF is well.

Regards,
T18

Interesting is one way of putting it. Another way might be hard to actually believe. Reckons he was in the air for an hour and a half after leaving with 25% fuel? I’d need to see better evidence than that piece of writing.

It does seem a bit contradictory unless there is a dramatic reduction in fuel burn with altitude to compensate. Looks like about 180 l/hr is average cruise consumption, so to stretch 132 litres to 1:35 (albeit with about 10+ min in autorotation), looks like a tall order. That said, I flew one type where with full fuel you had about 3 hours endurance at sea level in the cruise, but climbing to 10,000 ft the endurance was now 3:25 even after the climb fuel consumption (fuel burn dropped from 320 kg/hr to 275 kg/hr), so I'm not sure how much lower the consumption would have continued to reduce if we'd climbed higher.

I guess fuel burn reduces with altitude...note to self; I wonder why airliners fly so high :ouch:

Doubting Thomas Club
 

In a B3+ & e I was sucking ~90lph above 20,000' & 70lph @ 28,000' hmmmmm :eek: given 540litres usable petrol tank @ 25% = 135litres (not 132, every drop counts at extreme alt.) so way more than 2hrs of noise time at those scary heights is very achievable :ugh: in a B2 fuel burn even less...so what part is hard to believe again?? :confused:

rehash; wonder why airlines soar up to 35,000' surely not just for the view :ooh:

Keeping it real....do it into wind whenever possible (except pea)