Any Police Helicopters used as Air Ambulances
 

Just do any UK Police Helicopters double up as Air Ambulances when not in use ?

Joint Machines that are Dual Role, as in carry a Bobbie and Paramedic as crew that I am aware of are Wiltshire and Sussex, can't think of anyone else.

Thanks thats very interesting - the reason i ask is, my local police helicopter only flies on average 3hrs per day and i think this vital resource could be used to help others in need.

your right Ulster man it is. wilts unit and sussex works very very well............probably why some Ambulance trusts somewhere:ugh: are trying to change it. You can always tell when something is value for money.. as some self serving self promoting **** will try and change it!!!!!!!.

Most (if not all) Police A/C can carry out casevac, usually done after the AA finish for the night. As for the amount your helo flies a day do you know what fit it has? How much to fit all the specialist Med kit then find and train Paramedics? How much capacity does the A/C have? ISTR its a 135, Its not as simple as you seem to think.

vortexadminman > that's because (in general) it's the Ambulance trusts that have the money, not the police, and thus the power to make such changes. Sussex Air Ambulance are putting £250K into the Sussex Police helicopter for example (source)

Skyhigh-Ulster > that's average, most police units are somewhere in the range 2-3½ hours a day average in the air, but that means nothing unless you take into account the on-call hours and the number of tasks per day. Remember that EMS tasks take the helicopter out for much longer periods of time - in many cases the helicopter lands and shuts down while the medics do their work in readying the patient for flight. Time when the Police maybe pacing up and down their Portacabin wanting their helicopter back. I know it does work in Wiltshire and Sussex, but their police usage is well below average (Wiltshire's helicopter averages a mere 1.7 hours a day - EMS included - on basis of it had flown only 5295 hours at Dec06 from delivery Jul98)

Here's a thought... In Devon, they have a population of 1.12M and two EMS helicopters, and are currently replacing one with a new EC135 bought for cash. On that basis, Northern Ireland with a population of 1.74M could afford three helicopters, and London with a population of 7.5M could afford THIRTEEN helicopters. Bravo to Devon Air Ambulance for showing what can be done through hard work and successful fund-raising. Embarassing for London with their one helicopter, though, they always seem to appear in the press suggesting they are short of money. Short of organised fund-raising, more like....

The worst of both worlds
 

Those that believe that a heli can be dual-tasked are deluding themselves. Superficially it sounds like a good idea but the competing priorities are incompatible.

Imagine you spend 6 months setting up a big drugs bust, you 't'-up all the players and the chopper cover is vital to success (covering escape routes, covert observation and video surveillance as well as providing down-linked pictures to C & C. Then there is a motorway pile-up from hell and the whole job is blown because the dispatch protocols call the need for medical assistance from the chopper unit.

or..... the other way round

You are sitting on the ground in AA role awaiting the return of paramedic/doc with patient and the cops demand the chopper because they have a bank robbery in progress with possible hostages......

I could go on. Yes, it works after fashion but dual-rolling will only ever be a very very poor second.

Now.... if you want to be like the French who have a pool of public service helicopters ..... that's a different kettle of fish.

Dual Roll = THE WORST POSSIBLE COMPROMISE - dont do it!!!!!

CKD

:ugh:

I agree, the two roles are, in the main, specialist and incompatible.
Would we expect to use a police car as an ambulance?
Who decides the operational priorities?

I have done several night casevac jobs as a Police Pilot, as mentioned earlier in this thread, only when AA go off line. Normally attend these with only one observer so we have room for doc + medic + cas. Its not ideal but it does save lives.

Well as a tax payer i don't think i'm getting value for money - maybe thats why the PSNI are refusing to answer a number of FOI requests.

SIKOARSKIE

On a scale of:

0 = I will buy shares in your company:ok:
to
10 = you should run for office:yuk:

I will give you an 11.:mad:

Sky high.....it costs roughly £1200 per hour ISTR. £5000 a day not enough for you? You would also need to change your heli to one that can do both roles, therefore more costs.

Bring back 72 Sqn :)

God save us......
 

Bring back 72 Sqn ..... I should coco. := Within the year the entire public service fleet would be tied up with Crab bureaucracy and costs going off the clock. Whatever happens we need military involvement but we most definately do not need military leadership. The words 'piss-up' and 'brewery' spring to mind.

This does not mean that I don't rate the organisational skills of many miliary men and women - they can be mind-boggelling good - but the baggage they bring is not worth the pain. What we need is a National (Light/Medium) Helicopter Resource with a remit to support Police/Fire/Ambulance services and to augment the SARfleet. Economies of scale achieved by centralised maintenance and bulk purchase will allow every region to have access to appropriate equipment including FTDs/FFS.

I sometimes despair at the way each police force, each ambulance service and each fire service thinks that it is a good, morale-boosting philosophy to do-down the neighbouring forces and talk-up their own version of what's best for Joe-Public. So much energy and so many resources wasted with in-fighting and turf-wars. Roll on the day the Fire and Ambulance services become one, share their magnificent skills and abilities under one roof and get on with the job of serving the public.

A helicopter can do all of these tasks and the pilots likewise and if you want it done properly, on-time and on-cost ASK A CIVVY !!!

:ugh::ugh::ugh:

CKD


(I had a nightmare where I dreamt that 72 Sqn had a huge fleet of Public Service light twins and became so crabbified that they painted 5 of them Red and formed a display team....... am I going mad or what????)

CKD

:ok: The logistics of finance would be difficult and wrestling ownership of local a/c from local chief constables / execs would be even worse but that's no reason to shy away from the task. Just need a government with the b*lls to grasp the nettle!

:ok::D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

I concur.

They did it in Hong Kong in 1993 under British rule and it worked very well, still does under Chinese rule.

Unfortunately it takes money and as we know, the UK government know the cost of everything and the value of nothing.

Sick Korsky
Been deluding themselves for a long time in Sussex. Funny old thing, there has never been a problem about "competing priorities". It's a system that works very well.

You slag "Dual-rolling" (sic) but you then advocate triple-roleing Make your mind up! http://i.1asphost.com/whoateallthepies/pie.jpg

I was down on the South Coast today and there was a bit on the local news about the Wiltshire Police/Air Ambulance.

Apparently the contract is up for renewal soon and the Chief Constable was being interviewed and said that without the £500kpa contribution from the Air Ambulance charity, they wouldn't be able to finance the aircraft on their own.

So if funds are really limited, maybe there is a place for these combined-roled aircraft?


(Unfortunately, I can't find an online version of the story and I'm not even sure if it was BBC or ITV. :{:O It should be on the local news again this evening though. South Today or Meridian, I guess.)

Interesting stuff - what does ISTR mean ? if its what i think then no there not.

According to Googoo, the most likely candidates appear to be 'I seem to recall' or 'it stands to reason'. In this context, it will be the former.