Too short to fly helicopters??
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Join Date: Apr 2003
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Too short??
I am hoping to start my PPL training with the intention of going on to do my CPL afterwards.
I went to the CAA for my medical but while I was there the medical examiner recommended that I get my anthropometrics tested. I mentioned this to the person I did a trial lesson with and he thought that I may also have a problem with being too light to fly some helicopters. I am 156cm tall and about 60kg.
Does anyone know what the minimum my reach and weight can be, for me to stand a chance of being able to fly most helicopters?
I went to the CAA for my medical but while I was there the medical examiner recommended that I get my anthropometrics tested. I mentioned this to the person I did a trial lesson with and he thought that I may also have a problem with being too light to fly some helicopters. I am 156cm tall and about 60kg.
Does anyone know what the minimum my reach and weight can be, for me to stand a chance of being able to fly most helicopters?
Join Date: Jul 1999
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Yes check it out
I too suffer from ducks disease, (Ar$e is too close to the ground), when I learnt to fly a Robbie and then the Jetranger the Chief Pilot pointed out a section in the Bell 206 manual that minimum pilot weight in the 206 was 77kg I was about 64kg at the time.
Training was fine and lead weights carried for the solo stuff.
A while later and now about 74kg I got in and with no pax full fuel and i needed a lot more forward stick to maintain a relative position. I thought I was back in the S76 with the nose high attitude.
Basically I dont think that your stature will be too much much trouble as most machines have adjustable pedals, but your weight might be.
Nick L might be able to confirm this but I read somewhere that Sikorsky modified seats and/or seat rails for the Thai navy S70 and S76's because of the stature of their pilots.
Cheers
and stop calling me shorty lard a$$
Training was fine and lead weights carried for the solo stuff.
A while later and now about 74kg I got in and with no pax full fuel and i needed a lot more forward stick to maintain a relative position. I thought I was back in the S76 with the nose high attitude.
Basically I dont think that your stature will be too much much trouble as most machines have adjustable pedals, but your weight might be.
Nick L might be able to confirm this but I read somewhere that Sikorsky modified seats and/or seat rails for the Thai navy S70 and S76's because of the stature of their pilots.
Cheers
and stop calling me shorty lard a$$
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As the Ops Man, I can assure you that being 60...50 0r 40 kgs is an advantage................
I recently had a client that ask that a particular pilot [134 kgs] not fly on crew change days.
So think yourself lucky............
I recently had a client that ask that a particular pilot [134 kgs] not fly on crew change days.
So think yourself lucky............
Suave yet Shallow
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Yeah its not a big deal, its easier to carry a little extra weight when solo than it is to lose weight when fully loaded and with full fuel and needing to take something out of the machine.
<Joke Mode On>
Mind you...being overweight could be a huge advantage because heli's do make you lose 200(+) pounds per hour!!!!!
<Joke Mode Off>
<Joke Mode On>
Mind you...being overweight could be a huge advantage because heli's do make you lose 200(+) pounds per hour!!!!!
<Joke Mode Off>
The Original Whirly
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Definitely an advantage being light in an R22. You might have to carry extra weight when solo, but it means you can carry a passenger AND full fuel including the auxiliary tank...it always surprises the fuel chap when I ask him to fill both tanks when there are two of us. As for height...I'm 5ft 2ins; I think that's 155cm isn't it. Well, if you're going to fly a Robbie, get used to carrying a cushion around with you to reach the pedals. If you're feeling flush, you can buy a special one from the Robinson factory that fits the seat, and I reckon it's worth it for long flights; best buy I ever made. I'm not an expert on bigger helos, but all the ones I've flown have movable pedals; in fact the huge MI-8, which I flew for a couple of hours in Russia, was the only aircraft I've ever flown, f/w or rotary, where I could reach everything easily. And a woman I know who flies to the North Sea oil rigs is even shorter than I am, and she's been there for years. So I wouldn't worry; you should be fine.
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Tuff,
Don't lose any sleep over it.
Although I am slightly taller than you (166 cm, 60 kg) I have had minimal problems in flying 18 types of helicopters - both military and civil. However, the proportional length of parts of your body and extremities probably differ to the next person. My legs are rather lengthy, 36 percentile, compared with my stature, 6 percentile, based on anthropometry of US naval aviators taken in 1964 (There is a specification document for this data). Currently I fly 3 types of helicopters on a daily basis: the OH-58C, Bell 212 and Hughes 500. The only minor problems I have are with the Bell 212. I have to tighten the seat belt to its tightest setting to get it snug as it was designed for crew with larger girth dimensions. Also I have to be careful I don't adjust the seat to its full up position, as then I can only just reach the collective when it is at flat pitch(full down).
You may find difficulties in the R-22 or Bell 206 series as you cannot adjust the seat fore and aft, although some types do allow the pedals to be adjusted (Bell 206). You could possibly compensate for shorter legs by using some sort of approved seat cushion (Oregon Aero manufactures some excellent products, for example) to move you forward. Please do not consider any non-approved cushion material. If it isn't right you could be seriously injured or worse in an accident!
Most helicopters have ample forward field of view, generally much better than fixed wing. So seeing over the instrument panel never seems to be too much of an issue. My advice to students is to set the seat height (if adjustable) so that your right hand rests on your thigh when operating the cyclic. This helps in reducing any tendancy to over control.
Other advice? Visit a helicopter school and ask them if you could sit in one of their trainers. Also, always, always check the CG. Being light in the helicopter world has great advantages. However if you get the centre of gravity wrong it could set you up for a very painful lesson!
Don't lose any sleep over it.
Although I am slightly taller than you (166 cm, 60 kg) I have had minimal problems in flying 18 types of helicopters - both military and civil. However, the proportional length of parts of your body and extremities probably differ to the next person. My legs are rather lengthy, 36 percentile, compared with my stature, 6 percentile, based on anthropometry of US naval aviators taken in 1964 (There is a specification document for this data). Currently I fly 3 types of helicopters on a daily basis: the OH-58C, Bell 212 and Hughes 500. The only minor problems I have are with the Bell 212. I have to tighten the seat belt to its tightest setting to get it snug as it was designed for crew with larger girth dimensions. Also I have to be careful I don't adjust the seat to its full up position, as then I can only just reach the collective when it is at flat pitch(full down).
You may find difficulties in the R-22 or Bell 206 series as you cannot adjust the seat fore and aft, although some types do allow the pedals to be adjusted (Bell 206). You could possibly compensate for shorter legs by using some sort of approved seat cushion (Oregon Aero manufactures some excellent products, for example) to move you forward. Please do not consider any non-approved cushion material. If it isn't right you could be seriously injured or worse in an accident!
Most helicopters have ample forward field of view, generally much better than fixed wing. So seeing over the instrument panel never seems to be too much of an issue. My advice to students is to set the seat height (if adjustable) so that your right hand rests on your thigh when operating the cyclic. This helps in reducing any tendancy to over control.
Other advice? Visit a helicopter school and ask them if you could sit in one of their trainers. Also, always, always check the CG. Being light in the helicopter world has great advantages. However if you get the centre of gravity wrong it could set you up for a very painful lesson!
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Your height is not a problem, as long as you can adjust the controls to suit, and that when seated and belted in you can make all the controls reach their stops. Sikorsky designs its helos to suit a 95th percentile female, who is about 62", but there is always some margin there, especially that the reach to the farthest switch is the issue, and those can be easily modified (or pre-set) in most helos. Just do your own trial, and it should be fine. FAR also asks for that size person, so most helos should be OK.
Go fly and enjoy!
Go fly and enjoy!
As International Hog Driver will remember, there was also a very short Japanese student, who at home drove a Lincoln Continental by sitting on one leg tucked under himself (to see over the dash) and only used one foot for the pedals, luckily automatic. He could only get full deflection of the R22 pedals if he slid his @ss down the seat.
He went to K-Mart ("Tell him, Ray!" "K-Mart sux!") and bought a foam rubber baby booster seat. Probably not legal and definitely wouldn't meet fire rules, but it did the job.
When you need to carry ballast, use plastic bottles full of water, not lead weights. That way, when the passengers get on board, you can tip the water out and have the extra payload available.
He went to K-Mart ("Tell him, Ray!" "K-Mart sux!") and bought a foam rubber baby booster seat. Probably not legal and definitely wouldn't meet fire rules, but it did the job.
When you need to carry ballast, use plastic bottles full of water, not lead weights. That way, when the passengers get on board, you can tip the water out and have the extra payload available.
G'day A C
The Original Whirly
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One thing taller people rarely think of...when I started flying the R22 I found I couldn't reach all the knobs and switches - the seat belt came to the end of its travel first. So there was no way I could set the altimeter. My instructor more or less panicked; he'd never run into that problem before. A more experienced guy came up with a simple solution - a short length of rubber tubing. I bought a washing machine hose and cut it up, but anything similar will do. Several slightly taller people commented on what a good idea it was, and a flexwing microlight pilot said he'd do it too, as adjusting dials with thick gloves on is really hard for them. Maybe I should market the things and make my fortune. 
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Hello Whirly - not the first time the rubber tubing thing's been tried.
My instructor (for those glorious seven lessons I managed to afford!) was six feet tall, two inches more than me, and he could reach everything on the R-22 just so; the controls, the blade tips, the head. I always had to stretch a bit on the walkround (the tip-toe round?). Never tried the R-44; definitely looked like a step-ladder job.
My instructor (for those glorious seven lessons I managed to afford!) was six feet tall, two inches more than me, and he could reach everything on the R-22 just so; the controls, the blade tips, the head. I always had to stretch a bit on the walkround (the tip-toe round?). Never tried the R-44; definitely looked like a step-ladder job.
