Go Back  PPRuNe Forums > Aircrew Forums > Rotorheads
Reload this Page >

Irish Coast Guard search and rescue (SAR) helicopter service €800m contract tender

Wikiposts
Search
Rotorheads A haven for helicopter professionals to discuss the things that affect them

Irish Coast Guard search and rescue (SAR) helicopter service €800m contract tender

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 21st Dec 2021, 21:32
  #1 (permalink)  
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: EU
Posts: 82
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Irish Coast Guard search and rescue (SAR) helicopter service €800m contract tender

Government seeks new operator for €800m search and rescue helicopter service

A new €800m competitive tender for the Coast Guard search and rescue (SAR) helicopter service has been published by the Government.

The contract will see an operator for the search and rescue service appointed by the Department of Transport for a period of 10 years, with the option to extend for a further three.

The current 10-year contract dating from 2012 at a value of €600m is operated by Canadian firm CHC (Canadian Holding Company) via its Irish subsidiary, CHC Ireland. The new contract is worth an additional €20m per year.

Ireland’s five Coast Guard helicopters fly in the region of 700 missions per year, at a cost of roughly €90,000 per flight.
https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40770807.html

tender site:
https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Suppli...urchase/204264
Red5ive is offline  
Old 22nd Dec 2021, 04:02
  #2 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: May 2002
Location: Wanaka, NZ
Posts: 2,569
Likes: 0
Received 2 Likes on 2 Posts
Just spit-balling a bit here, but why doesn't DoT buy 5 new helicopters (€100m), hire 20 crews to fly them = 80 people (€16m/year), hire 20 people to maintain them (€4m/year), hire 20 people to fill the perfect persons and back office staff roles (€3m), flash new hangars and offices at 5 bases (€25m) = €355m for most of the basics. With a total budget of €800m over 10 years that leaves you with about €44m per year to buy the fuel and the spares and the coffee and sandwiches. If you can't run your own show with that big bucket of money to throw at it something is wrong.
gulliBell is offline  
Old 22nd Dec 2021, 09:33
  #3 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,327
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
Then they wouldn't have anyone else to blame if something like R116 happened again..
crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 22nd Dec 2021, 15:15
  #4 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 578
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
5 new helicopters
No - 3 helicopters and 1 fixed wing, the latter only guaranteed for three years, not ten. You know where to find my analysis
helihub is offline  
Old 22nd Dec 2021, 23:12
  #5 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Inverness-shire, Ross-shire
Posts: 1,460
Received 23 Likes on 17 Posts
3?

3?

Really?

It would be interesting to see the stats that support that as a solution. I suppose if you are a tight git in one of the richest countries in the world you can just forget about Northern Ireland and the Irish Sea because Prestwick and Caernarfon just haven't got enough to do.
jimf671 is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 06:10
  #6 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,327
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
It will be interesting to see where the proposed sites are to be able to cover the same areas with 2 less helicopters. It's not as if they can play the same card that MCA used in UK about having new faster helicopters and needing fewer bases.

An extra 20 Million a year for fewer assets? Someone is taking the p*ss.
crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 07:53
  #7 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 578
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
Crab... The proposed sites are to not yet available - each bidder will put forward their suggestions.

More here
helihub is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 08:11
  #8 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,327
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
Thanks Helihub - the number of bases is determined by the number of helicopters surely? ie 3 maximum.

As for locations, there are only so many sites in Ireland you can run a SAR helicopter from if you want to retain the option of an instrument recovery.
crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 09:00
  #9 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: UK
Posts: 578
Likes: 0
Received 5 Likes on 5 Posts
Yes, three bases due to three helicopters. But the choice of the location of those three bases is up to the bidder, and (as you say), there is only a small number of suitably equipped locations to choose from. The more detailed requirements include these four (from a list of 119!)
  • any one helicopter can reach any point onshore in Ireland or within 12 nm of the Irish coast in 45 minutes from becoming airborne
  • any two helicopters can reach any point onshore in Ireland or within 12 nm of the Irish coast in 60 minutes from becoming airborne
  • a helicopter can embark an emergency service team based in Dublin and depart with them onboard at any time of day within 60 minutes of being tasked ‘day’ or 90 minutes ‘night’.
  • all bases to have an approved instrument approach available 24 hours a day for the contracted aircraft types based there, with appropriate mitigations where the approach minima is no higher than CAT 1 ILS minima
helihub is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 15:33
  #10 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Inverness-shire, Ross-shire
Posts: 1,460
Received 23 Likes on 17 Posts
Originally Posted by [email protected]
It will be interesting to see where the proposed sites are to be able to cover the same areas with 2 less helicopters. It's not as if they can play the same card that MCA used in UK about having new faster helicopters and needing fewer bases.
Chickens are currently coming home to roost with the MCA's 10-base solution. The 10-base solution document was written 12 days before the Contract Notice was published, that being a period when a lot of things were rushed! First problem was that it is 10 chosen from a set of 12 that had "evolved" rather than been selected logically. Second problem was that the differing total risk profile of different types of jobs were not taken into account when making the selection: it was only based on the lives saved amongst persons assisted. Many people would be shocked to discover that it is by a hair's breadth that Boulmer went instead of Lossiemouth (Inverness).

So it is possible to make significant errors with this stuff even when considerable effort is being made to get it right in a balanced way. If, on the other hand, your priority is pleasing every Air Corps veteran in the country then you are obviously going to mess this up.


Originally Posted by [email protected]
An extra 20 Million a year for fewer assets? Someone is taking the p*ss.
Maybe it's the cost of NVIS implementation, including processing Irish citizenship for the instructors.

Last edited by jimf671; 23rd Dec 2021 at 15:53.
jimf671 is offline  
Old 23rd Dec 2021, 20:25
  #11 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 95
Likes: 0
Received 4 Likes on 3 Posts
Jim

Chickens are currently coming home to roost with the MCA's 10-base solution
Would you like to expand on that?

P3
P3 Bellows is offline  
Old 24th Dec 2021, 12:20
  #12 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2000
Location: EGDC
Posts: 10,327
Received 622 Likes on 270 Posts
Maybe it's the cost of NVIS implementation, including processing Irish citizenship for the instructors.
That made me chuckle Jim

I suspect the stats were made to fit the desired outcome for the UKSAR bid rather than used intelligently to select the optimum locations.
crab@SAAvn.co.uk is offline  
Old 24th Dec 2021, 12:25
  #13 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Inverness-shire, Ross-shire
Posts: 1,460
Received 23 Likes on 17 Posts
Originally Posted by P3 Bellows
Jim
Would you like to expand on that?
P3
I have already encouraged too much unseemly thread drift.


jimf671 is offline  
Old 24th Dec 2021, 20:54
  #14 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: UK
Posts: 514
Received 21 Likes on 14 Posts
So, early sweepstake, who is the odds on favourite?
helicrazi is offline  
Old 24th Dec 2021, 23:53
  #15 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: OZ
Posts: 281
Received 19 Likes on 5 Posts
Ireland’s five Coast Guard helicopters fly in the region of 700 missions per year, at a cost of roughly €90,000 per flight.
Per flight!
I’d have thought even the established operators could make a profit at that rate. Maybe after sliming down the QA department….. and culling a few “Senior Vice Presidents”?
Twist & Shout is offline  
Old 25th Dec 2021, 05:19
  #16 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Inverness-shire, Ross-shire
Posts: 1,460
Received 23 Likes on 17 Posts
Originally Posted by Twist & Shout
Per flight!
I’d have thought even the established operators could make a profit at that rate. Maybe after sliming down the QA department….. and culling a few “Senior Vice Presidents”?
UKSARH figure for the first four years was just over £78000, so exactly the same. There are differences of course, such as in the UK you got NVIS operation, winching of SAR partners' stretcher, more spare aircraft, soon followed by AW189 running costs. And I recall that 9 years ago in the final stages of the UK contract process, CHC were binned because they were more than 20% more expensive than the cheapest bidder.
jimf671 is offline  
Old 23rd May 2022, 08:35
  #17 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Further on down the road
Posts: 26
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Any word on shortlisted bidders?
ReefPilot is offline  
Old 23rd May 2022, 19:44
  #18 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Inverness-shire, Ross-shire
Posts: 1,460
Received 23 Likes on 17 Posts
Originally Posted by ReefPilot
Any word on shortlisted bidders?
CHC and Bristow will be in the competition. In all probability, that's all we need to know.

Last edited by jimf671; 28th May 2022 at 15:52.
jimf671 is offline  
Old 24th May 2022, 14:38
  #19 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by jimf671
CHC and Bristow will in the competition. In all probablility, that's all we need to know.
im sure the Customer will want as many companies as possible . NHV and PHI could be players . Babcock MCS could also apply .

Franks Town is offline  
Old 23rd May 2023, 14:17
  #20 (permalink)  
 
Join Date: Sep 2019
Location: Melbourne
Posts: 41
Likes: 0
Received 1 Like on 1 Post
Originally Posted by Franks Town
im sure the Customer will want as many companies as possible . NHV and PHI could be players . Babcock MCS could also apply .

This tender must be close to being announced by now
Franks Town is offline  


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

Copyright © 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands. All rights reserved. Use of this site indicates your consent to the Terms of Use.