AW139 Doors open, CAT A performance question.
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 185
Likes: 4
From: Downwind of a smelly passenger
AW139 Doors open, CAT A performance question.
Good morning,
I have a question for the room, on the supplement for flight with cockpit doors removed it mentions restricted to Cat B operations, but what is the penalty for CAT A operations with cabin door open for landing? Some HEMS operators are landing with cabin door open.
apart from doors falling off, is there a penalty for Cat A operations with Cabin door(s) open for landing abs takeoff?
I have a question for the room, on the supplement for flight with cockpit doors removed it mentions restricted to Cat B operations, but what is the penalty for CAT A operations with cabin door open for landing? Some HEMS operators are landing with cabin door open.
apart from doors falling off, is there a penalty for Cat A operations with Cabin door(s) open for landing abs takeoff?
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 696
Likes: 10
From: Shropshire
Good morning,
I have a question for the room, on the supplement for flight with cockpit doors removed it mentions restricted to Cat B operations, but what is the penalty for CAT A operations with cabin door open for landing? Some HEMS operators are landing with cabin door open.
apart from doors falling off, is there a penalty for Cat A operations with Cabin door(s) open for landing abs takeoff?
I have a question for the room, on the supplement for flight with cockpit doors removed it mentions restricted to Cat B operations, but what is the penalty for CAT A operations with cabin door open for landing? Some HEMS operators are landing with cabin door open.
apart from doors falling off, is there a penalty for Cat A operations with Cabin door(s) open for landing abs takeoff?
If they are operating into a site requiring CAT A/Class 1 performance e.g. a hospital site in a congested and hostile environment then they will not be able to open the doors during the procedure. If they are operating at an unsurveyed/ad-hoc HEMS operating site for instance, then they can't be CAT A/Class 1 and can therefore open the doors as that is permitted in the RFM supplement.
Cheers
TeeS
Last edited by TeeS; 4th July 2021 at 12:00.
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 187
Likes: 37
From: N/A
Most of the time, performance as depicted in the RFM CAT A part is simply not “proven” and most likely (slightly) affected (more drag) in case of an engine failure…. Mostly relevant before LDP where you want to accelerate again in case of an engine failure. Once past LDP there probably isn’t really an issue, but as it is not “proven/certified” it is officially prohibited to open the door if really flying a CAT A procedure.
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 185
Likes: 4
From: Downwind of a smelly passenger
Hi Fun
If they are operating into a site requiring CAT A/Class 1 performance e.g. a hospital site in a congested and hostile environment then they will not be able to open the doors during the procedure. If they are operating at an unsurveyed/ad-hoc HEMS operating site for instance, then they can't be CAT A/Class 1 and can therefore open the doors as that is permitted in the RFM supplement.
Cheers
TeeS
If they are operating into a site requiring CAT A/Class 1 performance e.g. a hospital site in a congested and hostile environment then they will not be able to open the doors during the procedure. If they are operating at an unsurveyed/ad-hoc HEMS operating site for instance, then they can't be CAT A/Class 1 and can therefore open the doors as that is permitted in the RFM supplement.
Cheers
TeeS
Doors have also fallen off Irish machines in flight
Thread Starter
Joined: Nov 2005
Posts: 185
Likes: 4
From: Downwind of a smelly passenger
Most of the time, performance as depicted in the RFM CAT A part is simply not “proven” and most likely (slightly) affected (more drag) in case of an engine failure…. Mostly relevant before LDP where you want to accelerate again in case of an engine failure. Once past LDP there probably isn’t really an issue, but as it is not “proven/certified” it is officially prohibited to open the door if really flying a CAT A procedure.
Joined: Apr 2021
Posts: 40
Likes: 4
From: Underground
You won’t find it in the RFM supplements as it doesn’t cover operational guidance for different roles. The overriding guidance for performance classes when flying HEMS is in SPA.HEMS and more specifically the exemptions granted to the operator from SERA 5005
