Chairman of Air Ambulance trustees steps down.
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cockney steve - where on earth do I start with that? Thank you for your scathing summary of my both my morals and ethics but like I said, goodwill and philanthropy will never operate a HEMS service in todays world. But goodwill and self sacrifice was EXACTLY how this charity was started. What on earth is a 'Community Service'? Does it have to be something free or something that serves the community? There is nothing fraudulent about GNAAS! It is a charity that raises money to provide the people of the North with a advanced medical repsonse using helicopters.
The alturistic Joe Public have a choice, mate. If they support something they believe in it certainly is not your place to patronisingly suggest they have been exploited! One hears about the plight of the worlds children regularly and
The CEO of GNAAS is a full time post and I am defending somebody who had to take great personal risk to start a charity because it was something they believed in - not to get rich. There is most definitely scope for charitable management to expoit generosity but you can't tar all CEOs with that and that is my problem with all of the people who seem intent on pulling this CEO to bits - they really have no idea of the truth.
How can you possibly comment on anyone's level of dedication or what they do? You simply don' know how dedicated the CEO is - and I'm afraid that to achieve what he has achieved has taken an incredible level of dedication.
The alturistic Joe Public have a choice, mate. If they support something they believe in it certainly is not your place to patronisingly suggest they have been exploited! One hears about the plight of the worlds children regularly and
The CEO of GNAAS is a full time post and I am defending somebody who had to take great personal risk to start a charity because it was something they believed in - not to get rich. There is most definitely scope for charitable management to expoit generosity but you can't tar all CEOs with that and that is my problem with all of the people who seem intent on pulling this CEO to bits - they really have no idea of the truth.
How can you possibly comment on anyone's level of dedication or what they do? You simply don' know how dedicated the CEO is - and I'm afraid that to achieve what he has achieved has taken an incredible level of dedication.
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Dr Z you keep alluding to 'the truth' but still not seeking to clarify our 'wrong' ways with it. Can you describe the 'dedication' you mention, that would help us a lot.
The 60 y/o Director of Research I described in my previous post was also very dedicated, he joined the charity at age 19 and never worked anywhere else. Very dedicated yes but the general consensus was he was as thick as a plank.
Or to put it in another more practical way - he denied anyone else with better talents from performing the role.
The 60 y/o Director of Research I described in my previous post was also very dedicated, he joined the charity at age 19 and never worked anywhere else. Very dedicated yes but the general consensus was he was as thick as a plank.
Or to put it in another more practical way - he denied anyone else with better talents from performing the role.
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Dr Z, once again thank you for your replies......
Would I take a pay rise? Yes I would, as long as it were to industry standard sort of levels. If someone offered to double my money because the charity 'could afford it', I would actually fight against that and the person trying to do it. Think I wouldn't??? Then you don't know me. Industry standard being the important thing here.
Thank you for clearing up the outsourced company dilemma. Unfortunately it wasn't really clear how you explained it. Profits?? Profits from what?? do they sell stuff?? What is taken off before this profit is declared?? Admin costs/wages?? Does this company have any links to staff or their families?? If so, was it tendered out or just awarded?? See where I am coming from??
If admin costs are higher "due to investment and future proofing", WTF!!! That sounds like management speak to me. However, I will take your word that it actually means something. Not sure what though, as long as that doesn't mean it goes on wages.......
Would I take a pay rise? Yes I would, as long as it were to industry standard sort of levels. If someone offered to double my money because the charity 'could afford it', I would actually fight against that and the person trying to do it. Think I wouldn't??? Then you don't know me. Industry standard being the important thing here.
Thank you for clearing up the outsourced company dilemma. Unfortunately it wasn't really clear how you explained it. Profits?? Profits from what?? do they sell stuff?? What is taken off before this profit is declared?? Admin costs/wages?? Does this company have any links to staff or their families?? If so, was it tendered out or just awarded?? See where I am coming from??
If admin costs are higher "due to investment and future proofing", WTF!!! That sounds like management speak to me. However, I will take your word that it actually means something. Not sure what though, as long as that doesn't mean it goes on wages.......
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Well let's put a few true facts in this thread instead of just making things up!
1, Nobody has a company car within GNAAS, there are only pool cars which are used by the fund raising teams etc.
2, The paramedic's are all employed by the charity and not seconded from the NHS.
3, Some staff actually took a pay cut to work for the charity including the CEO, not to mention the risk of leaving a secure job to do something they believed in.
4, The CEO of GNAAS has created over a hundred jobs in this region.
5, The CEO received a MBE for his efforts.
6, It takes a massive effort by everyone concerned to raise the 4 million plus pounds a year the charity need to keep the service running.
7, The aircraft attend over a thousand emergency calls a year and make a massive difference to a lot of peoples lives.
I could go on but I have no doubt that some people will take great pleasure in turning all the positives into negatives! I would really like to see some of the people who seem to know it all get of their arse and try to provide such a valuable and complex service of which they clearly have no real knowledge of and I doubt could ever comprehend just what it takes in both personal and professional dedication to maintain.
1, Nobody has a company car within GNAAS, there are only pool cars which are used by the fund raising teams etc.
2, The paramedic's are all employed by the charity and not seconded from the NHS.
3, Some staff actually took a pay cut to work for the charity including the CEO, not to mention the risk of leaving a secure job to do something they believed in.
4, The CEO of GNAAS has created over a hundred jobs in this region.
5, The CEO received a MBE for his efforts.
6, It takes a massive effort by everyone concerned to raise the 4 million plus pounds a year the charity need to keep the service running.
7, The aircraft attend over a thousand emergency calls a year and make a massive difference to a lot of peoples lives.
I could go on but I have no doubt that some people will take great pleasure in turning all the positives into negatives! I would really like to see some of the people who seem to know it all get of their arse and try to provide such a valuable and complex service of which they clearly have no real knowledge of and I doubt could ever comprehend just what it takes in both personal and professional dedication to maintain.
Last edited by cherrypicker; 28th May 2014 at 14:28.
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jayteeto - my pleasure. My motives for replying to this in the first place were to stop the gossip about an individual but I guess this is never going to happen. You can come on here and say you wouldn't accept a pay rise and that is admirable. Very noble of you and you have more in common with the CEO than you think because he did exactly the same. The difference between you is that if the charity you fly for gets into trouoble you will find another job and fly elsewhere. You have no responsibilty for the future of it. The CEO has constant pressure and stress to keep the charity moving and it's head above water, coupled with the responsibilty to it's employees. That is a huge burden and not something I personally would ever want to have to deal with.
I agree with all of you who express a problem with some individuals becoming rich from managing charities. I share your sentiments completely but at the same time I also believe that GNAAS was never a get rich scheme (initially it was a one-way ticket to being skint) but through dedication and belief in the service the CEO has built it from nothing.
I agree with all of you who express a problem with some individuals becoming rich from managing charities. I share your sentiments completely but at the same time I also believe that GNAAS was never a get rich scheme (initially it was a one-way ticket to being skint) but through dedication and belief in the service the CEO has built it from nothing.
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Hi cattletruck - I do allude to the truth but only because it seems these threads are a haven for heresay and gossip. The dedication I speak of was the act of leaving a well paid and very secure job to start a charity that he personally believed would make a difference to the region. There is a difference than someone who joined at a young age and merely stayed there the longest, but I respect your experience within this sector.
We could all recount experiences of bad practices and work place horror stories but that would be an entirely different thread.
As I said to jayteeto, I have a problem with generalisations and gossip about an individual, but I have to say that the majority of you who are engaged in this discussion have valid points and concerns. My issue is with the people who hold personal vendettas and use this forum to spread abit of BS
We could all recount experiences of bad practices and work place horror stories but that would be an entirely different thread.
As I said to jayteeto, I have a problem with generalisations and gossip about an individual, but I have to say that the majority of you who are engaged in this discussion have valid points and concerns. My issue is with the people who hold personal vendettas and use this forum to spread abit of BS
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Dr Z, I agree, thank you for being patient and replying.
Cherrypicker, thank you for the information, especially about the cars. If he chooses to spend his own money on a flashy car, then good on him. Glad to hear it is not a company car.
You are absolutely correct, I for one would never have the dedication to start up an air ambulance charity, a commendable action. However by doing so, any individual must expect to be scrutinised by any tom, dick, harry or PPrune who takes an interest. Most of us on this site read about instances of less than perfect practises and quite rightly ask questions. We do because we can. Your list of good points is wonderful and very important to bear in mind when looking at the overall picture. What it doesn't answer is some of the questions asked earlier that are relevant. Trust me, I am not asking difficult questions because I have an agenda, I don't know of any of the individuals involved, just initials posted here.
Cherrypicker, thank you for the information, especially about the cars. If he chooses to spend his own money on a flashy car, then good on him. Glad to hear it is not a company car.
You are absolutely correct, I for one would never have the dedication to start up an air ambulance charity, a commendable action. However by doing so, any individual must expect to be scrutinised by any tom, dick, harry or PPrune who takes an interest. Most of us on this site read about instances of less than perfect practises and quite rightly ask questions. We do because we can. Your list of good points is wonderful and very important to bear in mind when looking at the overall picture. What it doesn't answer is some of the questions asked earlier that are relevant. Trust me, I am not asking difficult questions because I have an agenda, I don't know of any of the individuals involved, just initials posted here.
Cherrypicker - who owns the 4-door Jaguar then? GNAAS Trading?
As for MBEs. There are people out there who have been awarded MBEs, OBEs and Knighthoods that shouldn't have been. Fred Goodwin had his Knighthood taken off him and there have been plenty of people in court recently with various awards. I think personally think the honors system has lost it's way.
GNAAS, along with other Air Ambulances do do an excellent job. No doubt about it. And certainly the front line staff work very hard to deliver.
Maybe a solution would be for the Charities Commission to stipulate all fundraising material has to have the wage packages of the top three earners in the charity listed on it? Then the public can decide.
As for MBEs. There are people out there who have been awarded MBEs, OBEs and Knighthoods that shouldn't have been. Fred Goodwin had his Knighthood taken off him and there have been plenty of people in court recently with various awards. I think personally think the honors system has lost it's way.
GNAAS, along with other Air Ambulances do do an excellent job. No doubt about it. And certainly the front line staff work very hard to deliver.
Maybe a solution would be for the Charities Commission to stipulate all fundraising material has to have the wage packages of the top three earners in the charity listed on it? Then the public can decide.
So did Grahame buy the car himself with his own money? Or maybe there was a company car and it is no more? Perhaps it was leased back in 2010? I suppose a typical lease lasting 3 years would be up by now and then the car would be sold on by the leasing company.
Thanks for clarifying things cherrypicker!
Thanks for clarifying things cherrypicker!
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jayteeto - thank you too for debating this issue in a respectful and professional manner. I think you are right that such a position does leave you open to scrutiny but I do think that scrutiny should remain fact-based and not 'word in the pub' etc. (at no point am I referring to your posts here). Certainly mis practice in aviation or medicine tends to be fact based and with science and best practice guidleines to refer to, and therefore lends itself more to debate? Rattling on about someones car (which again I must point out does not refer to you) just stinks of some sort of grudge.
The problems in discussions such as these are just perpetuated by more infantile statements (misterbonkers) that I would believe had been written by some errant teenager if I thought any of them were remotely interested in our crap.
The problems in discussions such as these are just perpetuated by more infantile statements (misterbonkers) that I would believe had been written by some errant teenager if I thought any of them were remotely interested in our crap.
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misterbonkers you seem to be obsessed by a car and seen to think you know what your talking about when you obviously don't. My last word on the subject -the car the CEO of GNAAS owns is not and never has been a company vehicle. Get over it!
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I asked a couple of NEAS paramedics (road ambulance staff) about the GNAA paramedics while at the local hospital about who pays for them?
According to the NEAS staff, the government pay for the GNAA paramedic wages. They are not seconded anymore but are still paid for by the government. The road staff were unsure if the wages had to be claimed for, or they were paid directly by the NHS? Correct me if I'm wrong DrZzz.
I've also asked the DTV Airport staff about the CEO, and its not the first Jagg which was a lease car from GNAA.
DrZzz as you seem to have an interest in GNAA, can you ANSWER the following questions?
1. Is the Jagg leased or was it purchased by the CEO or GNAA?
2. Is the CEO ON £150k a year??
3. Is it true the CEO also received a commission on top of his wage at the start of his charity after being given the ex Barbour clothing Blyth air ambulance G-NAAS? I have since been told that is was a percentage on takings? True of not?
As I have previously donated to the GNAA I think its a very good idea to know where the charity cash actually goes?????
While on the subject of the separate "GNAA Trading Company" which sells goods from its warehouse. I believe the PROFITS go towards the charity. Again how much are the paid staff there?
If the trading company doesn't make a profit who's benefiting from the separate income which is paid to the staff at the GNAA trading company?
Surely the full wages should be put on their own website for all supporters to see instead of being hidden in accounts.
I have seen no accounts to say the CEO has made HUNDREDS of jobs here in the north east.
Where are they, or are we talking about volunteers like the lady mentioned in the second news article about Cumbrian Friends??
There are according to the accounts less than 6 office staff who take approx £500k each year out of the charity cash.
I might be rattling on about the Jag, but if its my money thats paying for it, I'm entitled to ask
According to the NEAS staff, the government pay for the GNAA paramedic wages. They are not seconded anymore but are still paid for by the government. The road staff were unsure if the wages had to be claimed for, or they were paid directly by the NHS? Correct me if I'm wrong DrZzz.
I've also asked the DTV Airport staff about the CEO, and its not the first Jagg which was a lease car from GNAA.
DrZzz as you seem to have an interest in GNAA, can you ANSWER the following questions?
1. Is the Jagg leased or was it purchased by the CEO or GNAA?
2. Is the CEO ON £150k a year??
3. Is it true the CEO also received a commission on top of his wage at the start of his charity after being given the ex Barbour clothing Blyth air ambulance G-NAAS? I have since been told that is was a percentage on takings? True of not?
As I have previously donated to the GNAA I think its a very good idea to know where the charity cash actually goes?????
While on the subject of the separate "GNAA Trading Company" which sells goods from its warehouse. I believe the PROFITS go towards the charity. Again how much are the paid staff there?
If the trading company doesn't make a profit who's benefiting from the separate income which is paid to the staff at the GNAA trading company?
Surely the full wages should be put on their own website for all supporters to see instead of being hidden in accounts.
I have seen no accounts to say the CEO has made HUNDREDS of jobs here in the north east.
Where are they, or are we talking about volunteers like the lady mentioned in the second news article about Cumbrian Friends??
There are according to the accounts less than 6 office staff who take approx £500k each year out of the charity cash.
I might be rattling on about the Jag, but if its my money thats paying for it, I'm entitled to ask
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Beafer, if you are at the airport why don't you pick up the internal phone or call in the base and ask the paramedic's who pays for them instead of asking NEAS paramedic's who obviously don't know. The charity has employed and payed for it's paramedic's for 10 years! When you say DTVA staff who do you mean and how would they know? I have already put the Jag thing to bed incase you failed to notice and yes you seem to be rattling on! What the CEO is payed is his business but as previously stated look on the charity commission website if it bothers you that much. I'm not sure what your ramblings about the trading company mean? all profits are donated to the charity. The charity and the trading company employ over 100 full time staff, not sure what accounts you have been looking for in that respect? There are at least 19 office staff so don't know where you got 6 from? As I say pick up the phone instead of just rambling on!
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Beafer - It's Dr. Zoidberg. You left your finger on the z a bit too long and then didn't type the rest of the letters...take more time to read too - those questions have been answered on this post previously, except the whole barbour thing of which I'm not really sure what you're on about. I wouldn't take too much notice of people in the pub, or the NEAS guys outside the hospital. I hope you aren't involved in police work because if you want answers it's best to ask those who know as opposed to blokes in the pub, or road crews who actually admitted to you they didn't know all the facts (whilst actually being 100% wrong).
The money goes on providing a HEMS service 365 days a year, which is continuing to deliver the highest level of pre-hospital care in the uk. Look on the GNAAS website - read about the survivors, fundraising activities and more. The infrastructure to maintain a HEMS charity is quite simply mind boggling and to have a CEO who is capable of leading such a large organisation is going to cost. As I said previously - it's a huge responsibility, just like any other CEO.
Do people not choose to donate to a charity based on whether or not they believe in what it achieves or whether they have been personally assisted by the charity in some way? The cost to deliver a HEMS service is very high but people choose to support it because the speed with which it delivers such an advanced level of pre-hospital care is genuinely the difference between death and survival. It is up to you as an individual whether you want to donate and if your issue with the CEO means you don't now believe in what this charity achieves then that is a shame. Maybe you should focus more on the positive achievements than winding yourself up about the CEO. Like any large concern a CEO will have to paid accordingly?
Bronx - as previously stated the wages are on the internet so they are public knowledge. You appear to be slightly more pragmatic about this issue - could I direct you to the charity website or facebook for some more information about the incredible work that is done every day in the North of England...and indeed by some other air ambulances.
The money goes on providing a HEMS service 365 days a year, which is continuing to deliver the highest level of pre-hospital care in the uk. Look on the GNAAS website - read about the survivors, fundraising activities and more. The infrastructure to maintain a HEMS charity is quite simply mind boggling and to have a CEO who is capable of leading such a large organisation is going to cost. As I said previously - it's a huge responsibility, just like any other CEO.
Do people not choose to donate to a charity based on whether or not they believe in what it achieves or whether they have been personally assisted by the charity in some way? The cost to deliver a HEMS service is very high but people choose to support it because the speed with which it delivers such an advanced level of pre-hospital care is genuinely the difference between death and survival. It is up to you as an individual whether you want to donate and if your issue with the CEO means you don't now believe in what this charity achieves then that is a shame. Maybe you should focus more on the positive achievements than winding yourself up about the CEO. Like any large concern a CEO will have to paid accordingly?
Bronx - as previously stated the wages are on the internet so they are public knowledge. You appear to be slightly more pragmatic about this issue - could I direct you to the charity website or facebook for some more information about the incredible work that is done every day in the North of England...and indeed by some other air ambulances.