Walter Mitty?
Joined: Oct 1999
Aviation Qualifications: ATPL
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From: Den Haag
To expand on this comment/advice - many of us value the award of a flight brevet. It represents a considerable degree of effort for most. None would 'trash' that treasure - that is none who were of the right stuff. To do so certainly does not send the right message.
Joined: Apr 2000
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From: EGDC
You may be awarded wings at the end of AFT but you are not allowed to keep them if you do not make it to an operational Sqn - I believe this is still the case as it always was.
Unless Siam had his wings confirmed (usually 6 months or CR) he should not wear them or claim to be an ex-RAF pilot - by his own admission he is a 'failed pilot'. Perhaps a little more detail on his service career is required.
I, like many others, treasured the award of wings and hate to see poseurs like this devaluing them.
Siam, I think your 'honesty' in posting here to clear the air is nothing more than a cynical attempt at damage limitation and, while you are continuing to trade on things like CAC and Afghanistan, you will continue to attract negative feedback.
BTW, in your philanthropic outlook on business, how does you taking a commission and a percentage from consumers' utility bills reduce their costs?
Unless Siam had his wings confirmed (usually 6 months or CR) he should not wear them or claim to be an ex-RAF pilot - by his own admission he is a 'failed pilot'. Perhaps a little more detail on his service career is required.
I, like many others, treasured the award of wings and hate to see poseurs like this devaluing them.
Siam, I think your 'honesty' in posting here to clear the air is nothing more than a cynical attempt at damage limitation and, while you are continuing to trade on things like CAC and Afghanistan, you will continue to attract negative feedback.
BTW, in your philanthropic outlook on business, how does you taking a commission and a percentage from consumers' utility bills reduce their costs?
Joined: May 2002
Aviation Qualifications: ATP+Mil
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From: Downeast
I once worked for an outfit that made us wear USAF wings on our pickle suits.
That was a huge source of embarrassment to me as I felt wearing military wings on a civilian flight suit was inappropriate....and personally insulting as I was an Army Pilot.
A point to be considered.....it is not the fact you earned the Wings ...but what you did with them after you got them that matters. Until you have gone "Down Town" so to speak....you were just in training and have not put them to use for what they are designed for.
There are all sorts of Wannabee's....and the definition varies by who is setting the terms of the definition so we should all be a bit careful about holding our nose's well up into the rain. If one kicks that fuss off....there's going to be some very ruffled feathers in the Hen House.
That was a huge source of embarrassment to me as I felt wearing military wings on a civilian flight suit was inappropriate....and personally insulting as I was an Army Pilot.
A point to be considered.....it is not the fact you earned the Wings ...but what you did with them after you got them that matters. Until you have gone "Down Town" so to speak....you were just in training and have not put them to use for what they are designed for.
There are all sorts of Wannabee's....and the definition varies by who is setting the terms of the definition so we should all be a bit careful about holding our nose's well up into the rain. If one kicks that fuss off....there's going to be some very ruffled feathers in the Hen House.
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 573
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From: England
That was a huge source of embarrassment to me as I felt wearing military
wings on a civilian flight suit was inappropriate....and personally insulting as
I was an Army Pilot.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Alles über die platz
I don't personally knock those who do wear their wings on civilian flight suits, but it's not just this chap who is doing it - have a look in the Air Ambulance/Police flying community!
What is wrong with wearing a set of wings, on a flying suit when you are on flying duty, that you are entitled to wear in perpetuity and that you are proud to wear?
Joined: Jan 2001
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From: North Queensland, Australia
If it's anything like our situation down under, I've always been of the understanding that RAAF wings are part of the uniform, and therefore to wear them as part of some cobbled-up civvy garb is wrong*.
*The exception being Anzac Day, where I will feel fully justified in wearing them plus medals on my jacket when I'm playing two-up in the pub and swilling grog like there's no tomorrow.
*The exception being Anzac Day, where I will feel fully justified in wearing them plus medals on my jacket when I'm playing two-up in the pub and swilling grog like there's no tomorrow.
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 250
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From: all over?
As proud as I was to be an army pilot and receive my wings (even though i did tic-toc march up to collect them, much to everyones amusement), the day I took off my uniform for the last time was the last day I wore them. Not everyone in the civilian world is pleased to see you flashing your military pride in their faces! Rules and regs aside, I just find it a bit naff. Different roles might be a bit different, but in the offshore world, it just seems a bit OTT. You have got to move on. Nothing wrong with being proud of you past but people soon get sick of the old "when I was in the army/airforce/navy" lines and you just look like a washed up has been. If you really need to continue to wear old bits of uniform then do it at home or do what i do and just sew your wings onto your under-crackers.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Joined: Nov 2002
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From: Alles über die platz
No worries P6, I got it first time round 
Horror box,
I guess offshore they would be a bit naff, especially if you had to ditch and the water started to seep through the stitching
Don't remember ever wearing wings on a green immersion suit, beside the vest would have hidden them :roll eyes:
Anyway, I hear what you say and will seriously consider replacing my military wings with these;
In the meantime I will continue to wear my AFB, Why?...because I can. After all as I said earlier, on the ground I don't want to be mistaken as someone I am not
p.s. Even non exmil in the police/ambo role wear wings
Horror box,
I guess offshore they would be a bit naff, especially if you had to ditch and the water started to seep through the stitching
Don't remember ever wearing wings on a green immersion suit, beside the vest would have hidden them :roll eyes:
Anyway, I hear what you say and will seriously consider replacing my military wings with these;
In the meantime I will continue to wear my AFB, Why?...because I can. After all as I said earlier, on the ground I don't want to be mistaken as someone I am not
p.s. Even non exmil in the police/ambo role wear wings
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 44
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From: In the clouds
Thread drift alert!
The point here seems to be that it's questionable whether Mr Kidd is entitled to his wings (ie was he ever CR?), does he even hold a professional licence to fly? He likes to wear four bars on his suit too!
He gives presentations on sensitive subjects, purporting to be something he is not whilst at the same time coming on here and trying to pull the wool over our eyes and expressing remorse.
Google is not your friend Siam Kidd, but it is very good at indexing
PPRuNe.org
The point here seems to be that it's questionable whether Mr Kidd is entitled to his wings (ie was he ever CR?), does he even hold a professional licence to fly? He likes to wear four bars on his suit too!
He gives presentations on sensitive subjects, purporting to be something he is not whilst at the same time coming on here and trying to pull the wool over our eyes and expressing remorse.
Google is not your friend Siam Kidd, but it is very good at indexing
PPRuNe.org
Joined: Jun 2010
Posts: 2,422
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From: Milano, Italia
I still do not appreciate why the character in this story felt it was necessary to create the impression that he was something which he is not - most adults understand that such actions only result in tears.
If he desperately wanted to don a pair of wings he could have considered one of several half-wing badges available for ground crew, perhaps within the context of his management role in the operation of his charter effort etc.
The half-wings worn by ground-based members of the Royal Flying Doctors Service Down Under (1980's)
Cladosporangium: Please can you post an image of your winged pyjamas!
If he desperately wanted to don a pair of wings he could have considered one of several half-wing badges available for ground crew, perhaps within the context of his management role in the operation of his charter effort etc.
The half-wings worn by ground-based members of the Royal Flying Doctors Service Down Under (1980's)
Cladosporangium: Please can you post an image of your winged pyjamas!
anyone know where I could find a set....
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 19
Likes: 0
From: North Yorkshire
Really necessary?
I know Siam and I am qualified military aircrew although not RAF. (Thank god!)
I'm a bit disappointed he has had such rough criticism.
I think that him trading on his award of RAF wings is entirely fair. He did achieve the temporary award albeit without reaching limited combat ready status. He has something to be proud of and if entering the aviation industry why not market his award?!
In the time I knew him, personally and at a very difficult time on a difficult course Siam was never dishonest and he is just trying to get on in life at a difficult time. You trade with what you've got.
Best of luck Siam.
I'm a bit disappointed he has had such rough criticism.
I think that him trading on his award of RAF wings is entirely fair. He did achieve the temporary award albeit without reaching limited combat ready status. He has something to be proud of and if entering the aviation industry why not market his award?!
In the time I knew him, personally and at a very difficult time on a difficult course Siam was never dishonest and he is just trying to get on in life at a difficult time. You trade with what you've got.
Best of luck Siam.
Avoid imitations
Joined: Nov 2000
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From: Wandering the FIR and cyberspace often at highly unsociable times
RAF rules in my time were that the flying badge could only be retained upon reaching CR status on a squadron. Until then, in effect, it's worn only a probationary basis.
One of my colleagues through training failed to reach CR and he eventually re-mustered to the education branch. He was no longer allowed to wear his wings. Very disappointing for him but that was the rule. As far as I know, this rule hasn't changed.
If Siam didn't reach CR, then he's not entitled to wear RAF wings, Endex. To do so is dishonest.
One of my colleagues through training failed to reach CR and he eventually re-mustered to the education branch. He was no longer allowed to wear his wings. Very disappointing for him but that was the rule. As far as I know, this rule hasn't changed.
If Siam didn't reach CR, then he's not entitled to wear RAF wings, Endex. To do so is dishonest.
Joined: May 2005
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From: nocte volant
If it's anything like our situation down under, I've always been of the understanding that RAAF wings are part of the uniform, and therefore to wear them as part of some cobbled-up civvy garb is wrong*.
*The exception being Anzac Day, where I will feel fully justified in wearing them plus medals on my jacket when I'm playing two-up in the pub and swilling grog like there's no tomorrow.
*The exception being Anzac Day, where I will feel fully justified in wearing them plus medals on my jacket when I'm playing two-up in the pub and swilling grog like there's no tomorrow.
If he desperately wanted to don a pair of wings he could have considered one of several half-wing badges available for ground crew, perhaps within the context of his management role in the operation of his charter effort etc
Siam, thanks for your honest post.
Last edited by Trojan1981; 22nd April 2012 at 03:30.
Joined: Apr 2012
Posts: 19
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From: North Yorkshire
Actually I am not so confident that it is endex actually. I know in the Army that the receipt and wearing of wings commences before you are qualified on type.
I have seen numerous failed jet pilots wearing wings whilst on multi or rotary conversion.
I don't believe it was dishonest of Siam to wear them if he was awarded them even if only probationary. It wasnt entirely upfront but it is a business page why broadcast you never made LCR? He was awarded probationary wings he achieved that therefore wear them.
I have seen numerous failed jet pilots wearing wings whilst on multi or rotary conversion.
I don't believe it was dishonest of Siam to wear them if he was awarded them even if only probationary. It wasnt entirely upfront but it is a business page why broadcast you never made LCR? He was awarded probationary wings he achieved that therefore wear them.