Big brother is watching................
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Clearly none Joel...none.
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surely the flight time is recorded AFTER the flight. if you say it was recorded after the flight therefore it is before the next flight, then that is like the plod asking if you were drinking before you got into your car to drive.
why, actually yes i was drinking before i was driving, i had quite a few drinks...last week sometime.... doesnt make sense to me.
why, actually yes i was drinking before i was driving, i had quite a few drinks...last week sometime.... doesnt make sense to me.
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Silsoe ,
Actually, I put my signature on my tech log that confirms I've done an 'A' check on my aircraft. I'm actually very exact with my paperwork. But you still haven't answered the question.
What paperwork do I have to fill in before I fly ?
Educate me.......
Joel
Actually, I put my signature on my tech log that confirms I've done an 'A' check on my aircraft. I'm actually very exact with my paperwork. But you still haven't answered the question.
What paperwork do I have to fill in before I fly ?
Educate me.......
Joel
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Bit of a difference between drink driving and logging flying hours SuperF.
ShyTorque pointed out earlier that this is a professional pilots' forum.
With that in mind, to go flying without doing any paperwork, which according to the CAA includes 'making sure that your licence/rating, certificate of experience and medical are up-to-date. Also that the helicopter’s documents, including Certificate of Airworthiness/Permit to Fly, Airworthiness Renewal Certificates, Maintenance Releases and Insurance, are valid.', doesn't sound very 'professional to me.
Which is why, when this all kicked off, I merely asked the question in post 50, "You don't fill in any paperwork before flying ?!?! ". Do the ?!?! not convey an element of surprise in the question?
Coming from a military background (sorry Nigel) and now public transport flying, where I did & do have to complete paperwork before flying, is that really such an unreasonable question for me to ask?
I certainly don't think it deserved the response ,"In terms of paperwork, unless I'm mistaken, I'm not required to complete any paperwork before a flight", and all the pages of flack thereafter.
Let's just say that every single time I walk to an ac in order to go flying, I say to myself the mantra, "auth'd out, signed out, booked out, walked out." Then I do my walk round etc. I certainly don't have to do all of those things in my mantra, but it's a mental 'paperwork check' that ensures that I know all is well and I can concentrate on the job in hand rather than have any niggling doubts in the back of my head. If there's something I doubt during that process, I go back in and check.
I consider that to be a bit more than the 'kick the tyres and light the fires' attitude some may have. I'm getting the feeling even the kicking the tyres part might be a bit much for some, just incase doing what it says on a piece of paper might be considered paperwork!
ShyTorque pointed out earlier that this is a professional pilots' forum.
With that in mind, to go flying without doing any paperwork, which according to the CAA includes 'making sure that your licence/rating, certificate of experience and medical are up-to-date. Also that the helicopter’s documents, including Certificate of Airworthiness/Permit to Fly, Airworthiness Renewal Certificates, Maintenance Releases and Insurance, are valid.', doesn't sound very 'professional to me.
Which is why, when this all kicked off, I merely asked the question in post 50, "You don't fill in any paperwork before flying ?!?! ". Do the ?!?! not convey an element of surprise in the question?
Coming from a military background (sorry Nigel) and now public transport flying, where I did & do have to complete paperwork before flying, is that really such an unreasonable question for me to ask?
I certainly don't think it deserved the response ,"In terms of paperwork, unless I'm mistaken, I'm not required to complete any paperwork before a flight", and all the pages of flack thereafter.
Let's just say that every single time I walk to an ac in order to go flying, I say to myself the mantra, "auth'd out, signed out, booked out, walked out." Then I do my walk round etc. I certainly don't have to do all of those things in my mantra, but it's a mental 'paperwork check' that ensures that I know all is well and I can concentrate on the job in hand rather than have any niggling doubts in the back of my head. If there's something I doubt during that process, I go back in and check.
I consider that to be a bit more than the 'kick the tyres and light the fires' attitude some may have. I'm getting the feeling even the kicking the tyres part might be a bit much for some, just incase doing what it says on a piece of paper might be considered paperwork!
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Actually, I put my signature on my tech log that confirms I've done an 'A' check on my aircraft. I'm actually very exact with my paperwork. But you still haven't answered the question.
What paperwork do I have to fill in before I fly ?
Educate me.......
Joel
What paperwork do I have to fill in before I fly ?
Educate me.......
Joel
Wouldn't it have been so much easier to have said that back on Page 3?
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Hey JT.
Perhaps there is one little bit of paperwork you should do before going flying, and that would be to read http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP393.pdf
Around the 1:30 mark is interesting
Perhaps there is one little bit of paperwork you should do before going flying, and that would be to read http://www.caa.co.uk/docs/33/CAP393.pdf
The 500 feet rule
Except with the written permission of the CAA, an aircraft shall not be flown closer than 500 feet to any person, vessel, vehicle or structure.
Except with the written permission of the CAA, an aircraft shall not be flown closer than 500 feet to any person, vessel, vehicle or structure.
Around the 1:30 mark is interesting
Last edited by SilsoeSid; 23rd Mar 2012 at 10:29. Reason: spool chucker
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
What was it you said in the first post of this thread?
I'm not up to anything dodgy, so I have no real issues in supplying it, but I do feel slightly perturbed that my movements are potentially being recorded.
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Silsoe,
Oh what a pathetic, cheap, and childish response. You just like controversy don't you? But, I'm pleased you're viewing my blog/youtube channel. But don't preach the 500ft rule either unless
a) you know who is flying the aircraft, and
b) you're in a position to calculate the distance, and
c) correctly able to interpret the rule, which clearly you aren't.
Now, referring to your post 126, it was evident to most people on this forum that an element of this thread was about filing some sort of documentation with a 3rd party prior to a flight. You however changed file to fill - for no apparent reason - and then droned on forever.
Nigelh - why, o why, did i NOT listen to you and leave this saddo alone?
By the way, do you operate your own aircraft or fly someone else's? Just curious?
Joel
Oh what a pathetic, cheap, and childish response. You just like controversy don't you? But, I'm pleased you're viewing my blog/youtube channel. But don't preach the 500ft rule either unless
a) you know who is flying the aircraft, and
b) you're in a position to calculate the distance, and
c) correctly able to interpret the rule, which clearly you aren't.
Now, referring to your post 126, it was evident to most people on this forum that an element of this thread was about filing some sort of documentation with a 3rd party prior to a flight. You however changed file to fill - for no apparent reason - and then droned on forever.
Nigelh - why, o why, did i NOT listen to you and leave this saddo alone?
By the way, do you operate your own aircraft or fly someone else's? Just curious?
Joel
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Silsoe,
The problem with you/your posts is that you clearly show an inability or a desire to consider the circumstances or context.
Firstly, (posts 125, 126 etc) whilst this forum is called the "Professional" Pilots rumour network, we're actually posting in the Non-airline forums section. Now I fully appreciate that this doesn't mean that if you're not airline you're not professional (i.e. commercial).
However it doesn't mean we all are either. My original post was clearly from a Private perspective and most people understood this. Even it were not, the elements relating to having to notify or advise people of our movements would still be valid in my opinion and many others too.
With respect to the paperwork element, you as a professional pilot may be obligated to complete far more detailed paperwork than a privately operated flight. You're inference was also that by not completing this type of paperwork (an expression that a few of us couldn't even agree on the interpretation) some people were being un-professional.
Let me assure you that I, and many of my non-professional aviator friends, conduct our flights very professionally, I am an obsessive compulsive and a stickler for detail.
I'm also quite happy to play around with my machine albeit in certain circumstances. On a given day, with all the right criteria, I will for a minute or so, play in my helicopter. I will do what I can to ensure it's safe, it's legal but also fun. Maybe its safe, maybe it's not. Maybe it breaks the 500ft rule, the land clear rule, or some other rule. Maybe it doesn't.
However, I can do that because I'm pilot in command, because I've evaluated the environmental conditions and applied my 25 years of flying fixed wing and rotary wing aircraft and calculated in my own mind that I can. I'm probably also flying my own personal machine at the time.
Now, I know what you're going to say. It's going to be something along the lines of "on what authority?, or what gives you the right to?, or what makes you so experienced....." etc etc.
The answer is this. I have a brain and I'm capable of applying all the various elements and making a decision. It may be the right one, it may be the wrong one, but it's MY decision - and I will deal with any consequences be they god, bad or indifferent.
And so far, thank g-d. I seem to be doing O.K.
I don;t know what you do for a living, or anything about you, but you're outspoken for outspoken sake, controversial for controversial sake and unfortunately it's doing you little good.
I can't tell you how many text messages and private messages I've had about you in the last few days. But its a few. No one comments on your piloting ability, but they do describe your personality. Maybe you should apply a bit more common sense and a little less arrogance.
I'm really trying hard, in this post, to show some gesture of cordiality. It would do your cause so much benefit if you did the same.
I remain hopeful, but not entirely convinced. Lets see.
Joel
The problem with you/your posts is that you clearly show an inability or a desire to consider the circumstances or context.
Firstly, (posts 125, 126 etc) whilst this forum is called the "Professional" Pilots rumour network, we're actually posting in the Non-airline forums section. Now I fully appreciate that this doesn't mean that if you're not airline you're not professional (i.e. commercial).
However it doesn't mean we all are either. My original post was clearly from a Private perspective and most people understood this. Even it were not, the elements relating to having to notify or advise people of our movements would still be valid in my opinion and many others too.
With respect to the paperwork element, you as a professional pilot may be obligated to complete far more detailed paperwork than a privately operated flight. You're inference was also that by not completing this type of paperwork (an expression that a few of us couldn't even agree on the interpretation) some people were being un-professional.
Let me assure you that I, and many of my non-professional aviator friends, conduct our flights very professionally, I am an obsessive compulsive and a stickler for detail.
I'm also quite happy to play around with my machine albeit in certain circumstances. On a given day, with all the right criteria, I will for a minute or so, play in my helicopter. I will do what I can to ensure it's safe, it's legal but also fun. Maybe its safe, maybe it's not. Maybe it breaks the 500ft rule, the land clear rule, or some other rule. Maybe it doesn't.
However, I can do that because I'm pilot in command, because I've evaluated the environmental conditions and applied my 25 years of flying fixed wing and rotary wing aircraft and calculated in my own mind that I can. I'm probably also flying my own personal machine at the time.
Now, I know what you're going to say. It's going to be something along the lines of "on what authority?, or what gives you the right to?, or what makes you so experienced....." etc etc.
The answer is this. I have a brain and I'm capable of applying all the various elements and making a decision. It may be the right one, it may be the wrong one, but it's MY decision - and I will deal with any consequences be they god, bad or indifferent.
And so far, thank g-d. I seem to be doing O.K.
I don;t know what you do for a living, or anything about you, but you're outspoken for outspoken sake, controversial for controversial sake and unfortunately it's doing you little good.
I can't tell you how many text messages and private messages I've had about you in the last few days. But its a few. No one comments on your piloting ability, but they do describe your personality. Maybe you should apply a bit more common sense and a little less arrogance.
I'm really trying hard, in this post, to show some gesture of cordiality. It would do your cause so much benefit if you did the same.
I remain hopeful, but not entirely convinced. Lets see.
Joel
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
All because I expressed surprise that a private pilot didn't have to fill in any paperwork before flying....outstanding!
Every day is a learning day.
Every day is a learning day.
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
I have not changed anything, and once again...
I have never said anyone has to file any paperwork, let alone to a 3rd party, before a flight.
The problem with going off on one JT is...
...you forget who else has gone before you 
BBC News - Colin McRae blamed for fatal helicopter crash
http://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources...HL%2002-09.pdf
Please, please don't interpret this as a cheap shot, but a possible life saver.
I have never said anyone has to file any paperwork, let alone to a 3rd party, before a flight.
The problem with going off on one JT is...
I'm also quite happy to play around with my machine albeit in certain circumstances. On a given day, with all the right criteria, I will for a minute or so, play in my helicopter. I will do what I can to ensure it's safe, it's legal but also fun. Maybe its safe, maybe it's not. Maybe it breaks the 500ft rule, the land clear rule, or some other rule. Maybe it doesn't.
However, I can do that because I'm pilot in command, because I've evaluated the environmental conditions and applied my 25 years of flying fixed wing and rotary wing aircraft and calculated in my own mind that I can. I'm probably also flying my own personal machine at the time.
Now, I know what you're going to say. It's going to be something along the lines of "on what authority?, or what gives you the right to?, or what makes you so experienced....." etc etc.
The answer is this. I have a brain and I'm capable of applying all the various elements and making a decision. It may be the right one, it may be the wrong one, but it's MY decision - and I will deal with any consequences be they god, bad or indifferent.
And so far, thank g-d. I seem to be doing O.K.
However, I can do that because I'm pilot in command, because I've evaluated the environmental conditions and applied my 25 years of flying fixed wing and rotary wing aircraft and calculated in my own mind that I can. I'm probably also flying my own personal machine at the time.
Now, I know what you're going to say. It's going to be something along the lines of "on what authority?, or what gives you the right to?, or what makes you so experienced....." etc etc.
The answer is this. I have a brain and I'm capable of applying all the various elements and making a decision. It may be the right one, it may be the wrong one, but it's MY decision - and I will deal with any consequences be they god, bad or indifferent.
And so far, thank g-d. I seem to be doing O.K.
BBC News - Colin McRae blamed for fatal helicopter crash
http://www.aaib.gov.uk/cms_resources...HL%2002-09.pdf
Please, please don't interpret this as a cheap shot, but a possible life saver.
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Time for a Harry Hill decision. . . . . . .
" Now I like Joel, but I also like Sid . . . . . .but which is best ?"
There's only one way to find out . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
FIGHT !!
Tarman
" Now I like Joel, but I also like Sid . . . . . .but which is best ?"
There's only one way to find out . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
FIGHT !!
Tarman
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Are you two girls finished yet. As you two are having a hissy fit, I have an opinion that JT is perfectly within his rights as he has suggested being a private pilot. Fortunately and unfortunately there are many professional pilots that have their opinion also, which can get miss interpereted for the wrong reasons, but with very good intentions. Personally I do not have time to constantly post, because I am always flying and plus the mod's delete half my stuff that I put up.
Anyhow what was this thread about.......
Anyhow what was this thread about.......
Avoid imitations
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I think the discussion is reaching a conclusion:
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
ROFL 
Is there a part 2 to that vid Shy? The kissing and making out...sorry up!
Is there a part 2 to that vid Shy? The kissing and making out...sorry up!
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Silsoe,
I'm well aware of theColin McCrae and others and I appreciate your concern (which I hope is genuine) and I hope I never come anywhere near the flying situations they got themselves into.
But I'm honest enough to admit that every now and then I'm going to throw my machine around a little. I'm actually sat at EGCB watching an instructor throw an R44 around the field like there's no tomorrow.
Silsoe, it happens, loads do it. I'm honest enough to admit it. And I recall being chastised on here for a very dodgy departure I once did at Cholmondeley Pageant. I turned the wrong way and had to make a very interesting turn to ensure I didn't fly over the crowd. It looked ****e from the ground and my instructor was watching. He bollocked me properly.
It was referred to on Pprune and I voluntarily told the world it was me. Im quite happy to admit when I get things wrong. Do you ?
Anyway, I'm gonna blow you a kiss and send you a hug (we could get a room if you like) and hopefully you'll accept the gesture in good faith.
Joel
I'm well aware of theColin McCrae and others and I appreciate your concern (which I hope is genuine) and I hope I never come anywhere near the flying situations they got themselves into.
But I'm honest enough to admit that every now and then I'm going to throw my machine around a little. I'm actually sat at EGCB watching an instructor throw an R44 around the field like there's no tomorrow.
Silsoe, it happens, loads do it. I'm honest enough to admit it. And I recall being chastised on here for a very dodgy departure I once did at Cholmondeley Pageant. I turned the wrong way and had to make a very interesting turn to ensure I didn't fly over the crowd. It looked ****e from the ground and my instructor was watching. He bollocked me properly.
It was referred to on Pprune and I voluntarily told the world it was me. Im quite happy to admit when I get things wrong. Do you ?
Anyway, I'm gonna blow you a kiss and send you a hug (we could get a room if you like) and hopefully you'll accept the gesture in good faith.
Joel
Purveyor of Egg Liqueur to Lucifer
Joel,
Yes my concern was/is genuine and I hope that at those times when we all feel like 'doing something', just before we do, we we think back to other peoples mistakes. There are times and places for everything, yet in aviation those times and places are very few. Much like driving, today I am giving the car a blast on a track day, after all the briefings, simulator and instruction. Not totally safe, but safer than the open road and in a controlled environment.
Yes I do admit my mistakes and I would like to think in the aviation world that we all do. Better to admit your mistakes when they happen than to have someone else find them out in not very nice circumstances.
Pop over for a brew next time you're around our area, kettle's always on and there is more often than not a digestive looking for a dunking.
Happy & safe flying
SS
Yes my concern was/is genuine and I hope that at those times when we all feel like 'doing something', just before we do, we we think back to other peoples mistakes. There are times and places for everything, yet in aviation those times and places are very few. Much like driving, today I am giving the car a blast on a track day, after all the briefings, simulator and instruction. Not totally safe, but safer than the open road and in a controlled environment.
Yes I do admit my mistakes and I would like to think in the aviation world that we all do. Better to admit your mistakes when they happen than to have someone else find them out in not very nice circumstances.
Pop over for a brew next time you're around our area, kettle's always on and there is more often than not a digestive looking for a dunking.
Happy & safe flying
SS
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Silsoe,
I love popping into new places for a brew and I definateley like digestives. The thing is, I have no idea where you are! But I'll find out and take you up on the offer. And likewise if you're ever at Barton, I'll return your offer, gladly.
Joel
I love popping into new places for a brew and I definateley like digestives. The thing is, I have no idea where you are! But I'll find out and take you up on the offer. And likewise if you're ever at Barton, I'll return your offer, gladly.
Joel
