Kiwi Ditches H500 off Milford Sound
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Kiwi Ditches H500 off Milford Sound
Anyone got the skinny on this?
Pilot survives chopper plunge
Pilot survives chopper plunge
An Arrowtown pilot had to swim for safety when his helicopter plunged into the sea near the mouth of Milford Sound this week.
Mark Cotton said his training kicked in and he had managed to slow the $750,000 Hughes 500 helicopter's descent by auto-rotation, an emergency manoeuvre which keeps the blade spinning despite loss of engine power.
After extracting himself unhurt from the helicopter, which subsequently sank, about 4.45pm on Wednesday, he then swam about 20m to safety at the edge of the coast.
The Otago Daily Times reported the emergency happened when Mr Cotton was returning to his Haast base after a 90-minute, relatively low-altitude survey of wild deer, carried out on behalf of his company, Snowline Safaris.
His machine's emergency radio beacon did not activate on impact and he spent about two and a-half hours sitting on a rock before he attracted the attention of the crew of a Milford Sound-based crayfish boat heading back into the sound.
He said he had advised the Civil Aviation Authority about the accident and had already had discussions with CAA staff.
Mr Cotton said he would go back to the site to see if his helicopter was retrievable, but he had no idea how deep the water was.
Mark Cotton said his training kicked in and he had managed to slow the $750,000 Hughes 500 helicopter's descent by auto-rotation, an emergency manoeuvre which keeps the blade spinning despite loss of engine power.
After extracting himself unhurt from the helicopter, which subsequently sank, about 4.45pm on Wednesday, he then swam about 20m to safety at the edge of the coast.
The Otago Daily Times reported the emergency happened when Mr Cotton was returning to his Haast base after a 90-minute, relatively low-altitude survey of wild deer, carried out on behalf of his company, Snowline Safaris.
His machine's emergency radio beacon did not activate on impact and he spent about two and a-half hours sitting on a rock before he attracted the attention of the crew of a Milford Sound-based crayfish boat heading back into the sound.
He said he had advised the Civil Aviation Authority about the accident and had already had discussions with CAA staff.
Mr Cotton said he would go back to the site to see if his helicopter was retrievable, but he had no idea how deep the water was.
Insurance scam by any chance?
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Insurance scam by any chance?
I very much doubt it Crab!
Ending up in the ocean near the Milford Sound an hour or so before dark at this time of year (winter) would not be something any Kiwi pilot would do willingly. Two hours sitting on a rock when you are wet and very cold would have been terrible, and he could have well had to spend a lot longer out in the cold if he hadn't been able to attract the attention of a passing cray boat. That is definitely a sparsely populated area! (except for the sandflies!!) But, that is his play ground had he knows the risks of flying there.
I am not surprised his beacon didn't work.. not many do work, let alone under water. A Spider GPS/Satellite tracker would have worked perfectly though and had he needed finding then rescuers would have known he was in trouble within a short time and been able to start looking for him - within 2 minutes flying time of his crash site.
I'm pleased that the only loss was metal and that can always be replaced.
Ending up in the ocean near the Milford Sound an hour or so before dark at this time of year (winter) would not be something any Kiwi pilot would do willingly. Two hours sitting on a rock when you are wet and very cold would have been terrible, and he could have well had to spend a lot longer out in the cold if he hadn't been able to attract the attention of a passing cray boat. That is definitely a sparsely populated area! (except for the sandflies!!) But, that is his play ground had he knows the risks of flying there.
I am not surprised his beacon didn't work.. not many do work, let alone under water. A Spider GPS/Satellite tracker would have worked perfectly though and had he needed finding then rescuers would have known he was in trouble within a short time and been able to start looking for him - within 2 minutes flying time of his crash site.
I'm pleased that the only loss was metal and that can always be replaced.
So it's not slight suspicious that there were no witnesses, we only have his word that it happened the way he said - no mention of an engine failure or what might have caused the failure that required an EOL in the water, conveniently the ELT didn't activate so the time spent on the rock is again just his version of events, he didn't get a radio call out and conveniently only had a 20m swim to safety whilst the helo is probably in sufficiently deep water to make it uneconomic to recover it.
He might well be telling the truth but the sceptic in me will be interested to see what the investigation (if there is one) reveals. Since there is no loss of life or injury and no damage to any 3rd party it may well be that the NZ CAA don't need to investigate the crash - the insurers might have a different opinion however.
He might well be telling the truth but the sceptic in me will be interested to see what the investigation (if there is one) reveals. Since there is no loss of life or injury and no damage to any 3rd party it may well be that the NZ CAA don't need to investigate the crash - the insurers might have a different opinion however.
Not likely Crab.
You're in one of the remotest parts of New Zealand, where there are no safe places to land, and you wonder why there were no witnesses? Think unpopulated Norwegian Fjords and you have an idea of Milford sound, both in remoteness and topography.
If you go back through helicopter crashes in NZ you will find that in a distressingly high percentage of them the ELT does not go off. Do a google search of Michael Erceg and EC120 to see what I mean.
Missing helicopter may never be found - National - NZ Herald News
They eventually found the helicopter, but the ELT never went off.
Thoughts are that this is due to the placement of the ELT or the severity of the impact. There have been law changes to put them in the fuselage, then put them in the tailboom, then put them back in the fuselage, but none have stopped this ELT failure phenomenon.
And remember, it is a 500. They seem to fall out of the sky quite frequently for no apparent reason
Loss of life and damage to third parties are not the only reasons to carry out an investigation. How about an unexplained engine shutdown in a popular aircraft type that is used to carry thousands of passengers worldwide every year?
CAA do sometimes carry out accident investigations in NZ, but the Transport Accident Investigation Commission is the main office for investigations. They are an independant authority. If they decline to investigate, then the CAA will investigate and release their own report
You're in one of the remotest parts of New Zealand, where there are no safe places to land, and you wonder why there were no witnesses? Think unpopulated Norwegian Fjords and you have an idea of Milford sound, both in remoteness and topography.
If you go back through helicopter crashes in NZ you will find that in a distressingly high percentage of them the ELT does not go off. Do a google search of Michael Erceg and EC120 to see what I mean.
Missing helicopter may never be found - National - NZ Herald News
They eventually found the helicopter, but the ELT never went off.
Thoughts are that this is due to the placement of the ELT or the severity of the impact. There have been law changes to put them in the fuselage, then put them in the tailboom, then put them back in the fuselage, but none have stopped this ELT failure phenomenon.
And remember, it is a 500. They seem to fall out of the sky quite frequently for no apparent reason
Loss of life and damage to third parties are not the only reasons to carry out an investigation. How about an unexplained engine shutdown in a popular aircraft type that is used to carry thousands of passengers worldwide every year?
CAA do sometimes carry out accident investigations in NZ, but the Transport Accident Investigation Commission is the main office for investigations. They are an independant authority. If they decline to investigate, then the CAA will investigate and release their own report
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Crab, this is not suspicious in the slightest! Why do you keep going on about it?
Is scamming insurance something you would do, or have done in the past maybe?
Is scamming insurance something you would do, or have done in the past maybe?
Last edited by Motion Lotion; 11th Sep 2010 at 03:58.
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dont know this bloke at all, so have nothing vested one way or the other.......but.
i think some of you good old boys that are poking crap at this bloke and his antics should probably get on google earth or your preferred virtual map system and check out the mouth of Milford sound or any other part of Fiordland for that matter, should,nt be too hard as it sounds like the internet might be where you spend most of your time, and you will see that the terrain is tiger country, or better still go and have a look and do the place and your mouths justice. It would be a bad choice to set up an Insurance scam.
He did say he was low level, his choice but what ever happened he done alright he got out and got home.
Insurance scam maybe who knows, there was the guy who claimed he put his Cessna 185 in the sea off Ash vegas a few years back and it turned up in a container in a trucking yard a year or two later.
Either way if it went as reported he done very well.
i think some of you good old boys that are poking crap at this bloke and his antics should probably get on google earth or your preferred virtual map system and check out the mouth of Milford sound or any other part of Fiordland for that matter, should,nt be too hard as it sounds like the internet might be where you spend most of your time, and you will see that the terrain is tiger country, or better still go and have a look and do the place and your mouths justice. It would be a bad choice to set up an Insurance scam.
He did say he was low level, his choice but what ever happened he done alright he got out and got home.
Insurance scam maybe who knows, there was the guy who claimed he put his Cessna 185 in the sea off Ash vegas a few years back and it turned up in a container in a trucking yard a year or two later.
Either way if it went as reported he done very well.
Chief Bottle Washer
Bad morning, Semi Rigid? crab@ has been on this forum long enough that he can come back and sort himself out.
PPRuNers who sign up simply to stir are a different matter, and I'll moderate accordingly
(now back to Milford Sound, one of NZ's magic spots: although I think that Doubtful Sound is better! No more OT, thanks...)
PPRuNers who sign up simply to stir are a different matter, and I'll moderate accordingly
(now back to Milford Sound, one of NZ's magic spots: although I think that Doubtful Sound is better! No more OT, thanks...)
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For those of you who have never been to Milford Sound try Google Images. That will give you a small insight on the terrain but you would be still in awe if you ever get to go there.
Be assured that if anything were to go wrong, and you had to auto rotate to a landing, then you would be going to the sea. And the near vertical sides, 1000's of feet high, are nearly as deep below the sea. There is nothing like this in the UK, nothing in Scotland comes near, so perhaps Crab could be forgiven in not understanding the nature of helicopter operations in this sort of area.
And for speculation? I would speculate that if a good autorotational landing was carried out onto the water, impact minimalised, and the helicopter then sank hundreds of feet a beacon would not necessarily go off anyway.
I do not know the individual or company involved. I am not from there so have no vested interest in this event. However if it were me that had been put in these circumstances and somebody was to question my intergrity on a public forum in the manner of Crab I would be annoyed to say the least.
Be assured that if anything were to go wrong, and you had to auto rotate to a landing, then you would be going to the sea. And the near vertical sides, 1000's of feet high, are nearly as deep below the sea. There is nothing like this in the UK, nothing in Scotland comes near, so perhaps Crab could be forgiven in not understanding the nature of helicopter operations in this sort of area.
And for speculation? I would speculate that if a good autorotational landing was carried out onto the water, impact minimalised, and the helicopter then sank hundreds of feet a beacon would not necessarily go off anyway.
I do not know the individual or company involved. I am not from there so have no vested interest in this event. However if it were me that had been put in these circumstances and somebody was to question my intergrity on a public forum in the manner of Crab I would be annoyed to say the least.
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... would not be something any Kiwi pilot would do ...
I keep waiting for the day someone publishes a book or produces a film documenting the helicopter exploits that have taken place in those cute islands - the stories would keep many a helo driver captivated I'm sure!
Safe flying you guys, and hey, you've got some class acts down there that I've worked with over the years.
Last edited by Hell Man; 11th Sep 2010 at 07:06.
Hell Man,
Try this: Fishpond.co.nz : The Chopper Boys and the Helicopter Hunters, Rex Forrester - Shop Online for Books in NZ Chopper Boys and Helicopter Hunters by Rex Forrester.
They are two separate books about heli deer hunting and recovery, and all the fun and games that went with it. The two books look like they were combined for a re-release. Worth getting if you can find a copy.
Otherwise, for some
and some and lots of watch the video below.
Try this: Fishpond.co.nz : The Chopper Boys and the Helicopter Hunters, Rex Forrester - Shop Online for Books in NZ Chopper Boys and Helicopter Hunters by Rex Forrester.
They are two separate books about heli deer hunting and recovery, and all the fun and games that went with it. The two books look like they were combined for a re-release. Worth getting if you can find a copy.
Otherwise, for some
and some and lots of watch the video below.Join Date: Jul 2009
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Noooby - am gonna order the book and am already thinking of the pleasure I know I will get from reading it - thanks!
The video clip brought a tear to the eye, not because I was a deer hunter, but because so many of my former workmates were. What I had to endure working alongside these guys was somethin else - deer mimicking sounds at the bar accompanied by endless recitals of their deer hunting stories and around 100 hours (or more) of deear capture video!
But I loved it.
HM
The video clip brought a tear to the eye, not because I was a deer hunter, but because so many of my former workmates were. What I had to endure working alongside these guys was somethin else - deer mimicking sounds at the bar accompanied by endless recitals of their deer hunting stories and around 100 hours (or more) of deear capture video!
But I loved it.
HM
