Aircraft recovery tools
Aircraft recovery tools
We were chatting over tea today at work about cheery things such as catastrophic MGB failures and other cheery things. I came to wondering whether anyone has ever tried to make something similar to the Cirrus series parachutes? Something mast mounted perhaps?
Crazy idea, with a lot of tricky technical problems, but just a thought!
Crazy idea, with a lot of tricky technical problems, but just a thought!
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Not something im sure hasnt been pondered before, by many...over time
I always draw helicopters probly about 3 a day minimum, done it since I was about 5. They most times incorporate a two pod look where the crew capsule which is constructed simular to a chromoly racecar cell and the rest... Not needed items
The crew capsule would drop down leaving the beating fuel filled mess behind and landing nose high onto the rear of the skids
I have no money to build anything, but it never hurts to draw your thoughts
Altitude where the system would work, would be a major question as most other times an autorotation will get you down, but in severe cases of wirestrike, major driveline failure or structual failure.
I dont see how it isnt a good idea
No reason why a the driveline cant be attached to a frame in the front rather than the one piece unit, its gotta be better than the AS350 canopy design which is like hiding behind a fiberglass car spoiler and expecting to survive an impact... I atleast feel more safe behind the firewall and front end if you get my point, its a design that should have never been safely passed, even thought it s an awesome helicopter, and I love it to bits but roof protection worries me when i see photos of the floor remaining and and everything else gone
I think landing in an emergency without the thrashing junk flipping the machine or causing injurys to those around would lower injuries
When the engines dropped all power is cut so it lands stationary and maybe even chuted down if weight permitted. Im sure in 2009 lightweight chutes can be designed with the weight capacity to support the capsule
This is jsut my opinion but im sure chat about future helicopter concepts cant hurt, id like to hear what other think
End of the day, human life is the most important thing and should be taken into account over engine and parts which can be replaced
Simon
I always draw helicopters probly about 3 a day minimum, done it since I was about 5. They most times incorporate a two pod look where the crew capsule which is constructed simular to a chromoly racecar cell and the rest... Not needed items
The crew capsule would drop down leaving the beating fuel filled mess behind and landing nose high onto the rear of the skids
I have no money to build anything, but it never hurts to draw your thoughts
Altitude where the system would work, would be a major question as most other times an autorotation will get you down, but in severe cases of wirestrike, major driveline failure or structual failure.
I dont see how it isnt a good idea
No reason why a the driveline cant be attached to a frame in the front rather than the one piece unit, its gotta be better than the AS350 canopy design which is like hiding behind a fiberglass car spoiler and expecting to survive an impact... I atleast feel more safe behind the firewall and front end if you get my point, its a design that should have never been safely passed, even thought it s an awesome helicopter, and I love it to bits but roof protection worries me when i see photos of the floor remaining and and everything else gone
I think landing in an emergency without the thrashing junk flipping the machine or causing injurys to those around would lower injuries
When the engines dropped all power is cut so it lands stationary and maybe even chuted down if weight permitted. Im sure in 2009 lightweight chutes can be designed with the weight capacity to support the capsule
This is jsut my opinion but im sure chat about future helicopter concepts cant hurt, id like to hear what other think
End of the day, human life is the most important thing and should be taken into account over engine and parts which can be replaced
Simon
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I remember having read something about a german kit helicopter that will have a parachute thing. Don't remember when I read that or where, and which one it was (was it the Neo?). The Dynali kit helicopter also has an optional parachute. If it works for them, I guess there is no reason why it wouldn't work for bigger helicopters.
Also, look at this:
Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
And here is a patent for the parachute for helicopters:
Patent US3138348
Also, look at this:
Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
And here is a patent for the parachute for helicopters:
Patent US3138348
I was thinking something mast mounted, in a canister, like the longbow radar. The main limiting factor I would suggest would be weight, but I don't know how much a large-load parachute and rocket weighs. I'm guessing we're talking in the hundreds of kilos range?
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pba, I guess the problem putting something on top of the rotor mast like the longbow is it will go bye-bye if the MGB seizes causing the rotor head to shear off...
A flat pack parachute on top behind the rotor, and an explosive to jettison the rotor head/disk might work.
though these types of solutions tend to only be warranted if you have enough altitude....
Dave Jackson, what clever concepts are you withholding from us?
A flat pack parachute on top behind the rotor, and an explosive to jettison the rotor head/disk might work.
though these types of solutions tend to only be warranted if you have enough altitude....
Dave Jackson, what clever concepts are you withholding from us?
I think I'd rather auto-rotate to a crash landing area of my choice than drift down into the middle of the only briar patch for miles!
Remember that all these ballistic recovery systems are only designed to get you down alive. They are not expected to avoid balling up the ship. They would have an advantage in IIMC though.
Remember that all these ballistic recovery systems are only designed to get you down alive. They are not expected to avoid balling up the ship. They would have an advantage in IIMC though.
Last edited by krypton_john; 6th Nov 2009 at 02:59.
Avoid imitations
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The crew capsule would drop down leaving the beating fuel filled mess behind and landing nose high onto the rear of the skids
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Haha nice ony Shy, but ya I guess they can come too 
If the chute came from the top ot the nose, and you had only a human carrying capsule, then it should come down with the rear of the skids first and gently drop the nose down after the backs down. Even it it rolls and ends up upside down, without the driveline all onboard should survive
Wind permitting of cause. Why cant we have side curtain airbags like in cars, the ones on the new bmw's fit in the pillars and take almost no space
Helicopters are awesome, but its like riding a motorbike without a helmet... You wont always need one but when it goes sour youll be glad that you have protection
Crashworthy seats should not be the only focus
If the chute came from the top ot the nose, and you had only a human carrying capsule, then it should come down with the rear of the skids first and gently drop the nose down after the backs down. Even it it rolls and ends up upside down, without the driveline all onboard should survive
Wind permitting of cause. Why cant we have side curtain airbags like in cars, the ones on the new bmw's fit in the pillars and take almost no space
Helicopters are awesome, but its like riding a motorbike without a helmet... You wont always need one but when it goes sour youll be glad that you have protection
Crashworthy seats should not be the only focus
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sorry to be a downer,
but i must recount the advice that we received from a superb instructor that we had at air-log, long beach in late 79.
Dan Aguiler was his name (spelling??) and I think it maybe the late Dan now???, but he was one great dude with a terrific sense of humour, had our total respect.
His message was simple,- "if the jesus nut falls of jes stand up, pull yer trousers down, turn roun' with yer backside over the cyclic an' let the NTSB go figggurrre!"
tet
but i must recount the advice that we received from a superb instructor that we had at air-log, long beach in late 79.
Dan Aguiler was his name (spelling??) and I think it maybe the late Dan now???, but he was one great dude with a terrific sense of humour, had our total respect.
His message was simple,- "if the jesus nut falls of jes stand up, pull yer trousers down, turn roun' with yer backside over the cyclic an' let the NTSB go figggurrre!"
tet
Years ago I had occassion to visit an engineering shop in Auckland where an ex NZ government minister whos' name escapes me was building a kit helicopter. I'll dig out my photos one day to see what he was calling it, but it had a parachute in it. There was a lever down near the pilots left leg which, when pulled, released the rear transmission cowl. The idea was that the cowl promptly departed the scene rearward & upward through the rotors. With the cowl being attached by a fibre strop, the rotor blades would come to a pretty sudden stop as they were wound up in the strop. Immediately after(I'd hope so!!) the parachute would deploy from just aft of the transmission, & with no pesky spinning rotorblades to contend with, the now silent helicopter & relaxed crew would waft down to a smooth touchdown. It all looked & sounded bloody scary to me, & once I find the photos & you have a look I'm sure you'll agree.
I'd rather take the risk of a MGB failure than the risk of having a "Rotor Jettison" mechanism on board.
For many of us, half the time we fly (or more) we are way to low for any parachute to help us anyway. A MGB or control failure at altitude is about the only situation where a chute would help, but how common is that?
I'd rather see some sort of a Airbag system underneath/around the machine to reduce impact forces during forced landings.
For many of us, half the time we fly (or more) we are way to low for any parachute to help us anyway. A MGB or control failure at altitude is about the only situation where a chute would help, but how common is that?
I'd rather see some sort of a Airbag system underneath/around the machine to reduce impact forces during forced landings.
Lele - you make an interesting point. My "comparison" is with air-dropping, as that's effectively what you'd be doing. The Eastern Bloc used to use rocket packs and airbags to cushion the descent in the final stages, which allowed them to use very small stabilising parachutes and to drop from (effectively) any height band. That might be a model that could work.
The issue is that you really require the stabilising parachute for the helicopter scenario, as you're likely to go unstable following the sort of catastrophic transmission type failure we're talking about.
The issue is that you really require the stabilising parachute for the helicopter scenario, as you're likely to go unstable following the sort of catastrophic transmission type failure we're talking about.
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I seem to remember the Rafael REAPS: Israeli tech tested in the US a few years back?
Here tiz: Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
Here tiz: Rotorcraft External Airbag Protection System (REAPS)
Last edited by Bushfiva; 9th Nov 2009 at 11:10. Reason: Linky
