EC120 Fogged over windows
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,022
Likes: 2
From: In the air with luck
Have used all 3 on visors
1. Comma ProVision Fog Clear Gel
2. Rain-X Anti-Fog
3. Farécla Smart Anti Mist
1. Comma ProVision Fog Clear Gel
2. Rain-X Anti-Fog
3. Farécla Smart Anti Mist
Thread Starter
Fleet Manager
Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,083
Likes: 2,939
From: Ontario, Canada
I appreciate the informative responses.
I suppose that Hughes still has an edge over Eurocopter when it comes to clear windshields. I just completed an ALaska to Vancouver flight in a 500D in even worse conditions at times than I was in in the EC120, and never a hint of fog. Thank goodness for that, ans that route has a lot more to bump into if you cannot see where you are going!
Pilot DAR
I suppose that Hughes still has an edge over Eurocopter when it comes to clear windshields. I just completed an ALaska to Vancouver flight in a 500D in even worse conditions at times than I was in in the EC120, and never a hint of fog. Thank goodness for that, ans that route has a lot more to bump into if you cannot see where you are going!
Pilot DAR
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,413
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From: England & Scotland
Am I being slow, or is it just a case of running the heating / de-mist vented onto the window before leaving the ground to ensure that the laminate is warm and hence does not fog?
I ask as a novice to the 120 and with winter coming up......
I ask as a novice to the 120 and with winter coming up......
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 467
Likes: 2
From: Earth.
I used to find in the damp winter months in the UK, you had not choice to put the heater on to de-mist the windows before lift. Usually as soon as you jumped in the windows fogged up. I found the P2 bleed in the 120 quite effective at de-misting the windows, with flight power the airflow is pretty good.
TiP
TiP
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 293
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From: foot of a mountain
Tipweight, that is my experience with the 120. I suggested a possible loose duct or closed duct not because I think the maintenance is not of the best in the world, but because normally the airflow is sufficient and I have operated in icing conditions plenty time in winter in the mountains. The minute that first blade comes passed on startup by the fourth count of a blade you are iced up until you open the demister and it has always cleared the windows in my experience.
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,413
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From: England & Scotland
This topic came up at the Redhill safety evening yesterday. I don't have air-con, and I am VERY low time, I don't want to be in the same situation as the original post. So, my thinking (and question) goes like this:
Fogging is a function of relative humidity of the air inside the cabin and the temperature of surfaces in contact with that air. Avoiding condensation means I want the plexiglass temperature to be above the dew point.
So, on jumping in for start, is there a problem with applying full heat and fan, directed at the glass, as soon as the burner is properly lit? If that is added to the start procedure (and we learned last night that we can add to the start checklist) then by the time all checks are completed we should have one of two results. Either:
a) The fogging experienced by the original poster would have occurred, sit still and wait a couple of minutes for it to clear; or
b) If not, the plexiglas would be warmer than the dew point of the cabin air, now reduce (but not turn-off the heat unless you need the power) and keep a slight warm flow over the window.
1. Any problems with running the heater full whilst the remaining checks are carried out?
2. Would that be long enough to ensure adequate heat in the glass to avoid this problem?
Thanks
John
Fogging is a function of relative humidity of the air inside the cabin and the temperature of surfaces in contact with that air. Avoiding condensation means I want the plexiglass temperature to be above the dew point.
So, on jumping in for start, is there a problem with applying full heat and fan, directed at the glass, as soon as the burner is properly lit? If that is added to the start procedure (and we learned last night that we can add to the start checklist) then by the time all checks are completed we should have one of two results. Either:
a) The fogging experienced by the original poster would have occurred, sit still and wait a couple of minutes for it to clear; or
b) If not, the plexiglas would be warmer than the dew point of the cabin air, now reduce (but not turn-off the heat unless you need the power) and keep a slight warm flow over the window.
1. Any problems with running the heater full whilst the remaining checks are carried out?
2. Would that be long enough to ensure adequate heat in the glass to avoid this problem?
Thanks
John
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 32
Likes: 0
From: Arkansas
Depends I guess
When I light it off I am not on the ground long after that. The easy thing to do is sit a small (good quality to avoid fires) heater in the aircraft and leave it until ready to fly. We do that at night in the winter to keep drugs warm and it also prevents the fogged up windows. When warm enough for the drugs but cool out at night I walk out to a helicopter with condensation all over the windscreen. Kind of a pain.
Thread Starter
Fleet Manager
Joined: Aug 2006
Aviation Qualifications: CPL
Posts: 7,083
Likes: 2,939
From: Ontario, Canada
I was surprised to find (while reading the latest Aviation Safety Letter at my Transport Canada office this morning) this article..
Aviation Safety Letter - TP 185 - Publications - Aviation Safety - Air Transportation - Transport Canada
It seems I'm not the only one to have experienced this problem, and I faired better. There is also a reference to a Eurocopter Information Notice on the subject.
Aviation Safety Letter - TP 185 - Publications - Aviation Safety - Air Transportation - Transport Canada
It seems I'm not the only one to have experienced this problem, and I faired better. There is also a reference to a Eurocopter Information Notice on the subject.
