Heathrow crossing H numbers
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Class A airspace
Casting stones and all that guys,!!! just remember over 70% of all UK Class A airspace incursions are commited by CPL/ATPL qualified pilots.
Most of these without seeking clearance!!
Whether this is a wind up or not, don't reach for the flame thrower so quick
(even if he is a robbie jockey!!!!!!)
Chances are, sooner or later despite your best efforts you will get a letter of invitation from the Kremlin, I hope the enforcement guys are more tolerant than some poster on Pprune!!!
PS Singe remember "to fail to plan, is to plan to fail"
Most of these without seeking clearance!!
Whether this is a wind up or not, don't reach for the flame thrower so quick
(even if he is a robbie jockey!!!!!!)
Chances are, sooner or later despite your best efforts you will get a letter of invitation from the Kremlin, I hope the enforcement guys are more tolerant than some poster on Pprune!!!
PS Singe remember "to fail to plan, is to plan to fail"
Hovering AND talking
Join Date: Feb 2003
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Where did that statistic come from Heli-phile?
If this isn't a wind-up (and I'm sure it is), I would like to know where Le Singe obtained his PPL and who does his LPCs?
If I bust Class A airspace, I sure as hell wouldn't come on Pprune and ask the assembled mass where I went wrong and why couldn't I fly through it???
Cheers
Whirls
If this isn't a wind-up (and I'm sure it is), I would like to know where Le Singe obtained his PPL and who does his LPCs?
If I bust Class A airspace, I sure as hell wouldn't come on Pprune and ask the assembled mass where I went wrong and why couldn't I fly through it???
Cheers
Whirls
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Class A Airspace incursions
Got that 70% figure from a NATS tour back in the 90's when I was a "Nigel"
I would be interested if anyone has the recent figures - for better or worse!!
I don't think La Singe actually bust airspace, but pissed off the controller by wanting to without sufficient prep/planning/topos etc. (at least he asked first!!)
I would be interested if anyone has the recent figures - for better or worse!!
I don't think La Singe actually bust airspace, but pissed off the controller by wanting to without sufficient prep/planning/topos etc. (at least he asked first!!)
Join Date: Sep 2006
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Victim...
Folks,
I have actually been a victim of an airspace intrusion going from Denham to my friend's heliport in the Stoke Poges area. Jet Ranger, right rear door off, a friend with a camera in that seat and two more on board. Had just got clearance to enter the Heathrow zone special VFR and started in. We managed to get a few minutes into it when another aircraft entered the zone without clearance. Needless to say, I was kicked out and directed back towards the Denham area as the other pilot apparently was on a different frequency while I was able to respond.
After circling for fifteen minutes we got clearance again and started in. Rain, colder and colder, 10 year-old in left rear seat freezing. The wacko then breached the zone again and we were sent back to Denham just before we reached Stoke Poges... On the third try we got through. Cold and with 45 minutes of fuel burned - fuel that was meant for the trip back to Sweden on the following day.
Anyway, the London heli lanes along with the Heathrow traffic is not for the weak of heart. My being a PPL(H) with about 500 hrs and never having flown in the UK before didn't exactly help, but I got through that ordeal and was able to pass straight south towards Calais on the following day - a wonderful 10.5 hour flight back to Bromma Airport in Stockholm, a flight that had to be terminated an hour before our destination due to adverse weather, but that's another story.
I studied the maps and contacted "London Special" in advance via e-mail. Even though I am fluent in (american) english, I had serious problems understanding some of the controllers. Actually, the french guys' "radio english" was easier to understand... My bad, though.
Joke or not, I am a bit concerned about the tone in the replies from my fellow PPruners. Why so harsh? Why so derogatory? Why not just correct him and say "You really need to study the Heathrow procedures before venturing on a flight there." Could it be cultural differences???
All the best for now,
P
I have actually been a victim of an airspace intrusion going from Denham to my friend's heliport in the Stoke Poges area. Jet Ranger, right rear door off, a friend with a camera in that seat and two more on board. Had just got clearance to enter the Heathrow zone special VFR and started in. We managed to get a few minutes into it when another aircraft entered the zone without clearance. Needless to say, I was kicked out and directed back towards the Denham area as the other pilot apparently was on a different frequency while I was able to respond.
After circling for fifteen minutes we got clearance again and started in. Rain, colder and colder, 10 year-old in left rear seat freezing. The wacko then breached the zone again and we were sent back to Denham just before we reached Stoke Poges... On the third try we got through. Cold and with 45 minutes of fuel burned - fuel that was meant for the trip back to Sweden on the following day.
Anyway, the London heli lanes along with the Heathrow traffic is not for the weak of heart. My being a PPL(H) with about 500 hrs and never having flown in the UK before didn't exactly help, but I got through that ordeal and was able to pass straight south towards Calais on the following day - a wonderful 10.5 hour flight back to Bromma Airport in Stockholm, a flight that had to be terminated an hour before our destination due to adverse weather, but that's another story.
I studied the maps and contacted "London Special" in advance via e-mail. Even though I am fluent in (american) english, I had serious problems understanding some of the controllers. Actually, the french guys' "radio english" was easier to understand... My bad, though.
Joke or not, I am a bit concerned about the tone in the replies from my fellow PPruners. Why so harsh? Why so derogatory? Why not just correct him and say "You really need to study the Heathrow procedures before venturing on a flight there." Could it be cultural differences???
All the best for now,
P
You might also find these useful
Heathrow
Helicopter Routes in the Heathrow Zone
Heathrow crossing operations chart
London Heathrow AIP Entry including flight procedures
Battersea
London Heliport Inbound/Outbound Flight Procedure
The Battersea chart is for reference only, you cannot go there unless you have been with someone else who is already approved and then visited the tower for a brieifing.
But don't try flying the helilanes using these,you need a full size copy of the chart pitot212 linked to in his first post, there is a lot of detail on it.
GS
Heathrow
Helicopter Routes in the Heathrow Zone
Heathrow crossing operations chart
London Heathrow AIP Entry including flight procedures
Battersea
London Heliport Inbound/Outbound Flight Procedure
The Battersea chart is for reference only, you cannot go there unless you have been with someone else who is already approved and then visited the tower for a brieifing.
But don't try flying the helilanes using these,you need a full size copy of the chart pitot212 linked to in his first post, there is a lot of detail on it.
GS
Ivor
Honest answer I don't know (see below) , but I've done several famil flights over the last few years and each one has required a tower visit, a briefing and on the last one two weeks ago the pilot concerned came out with a bit of paper with all the things they'd discussed on it (an aide memoir kind of thing for the ATC guys to make sure they've cover everything).
I've just called the tower there to ask why they insist on the tower visit and they say its what the heliport operator requires them (the atc contractor) to do. They want to make sure that pilots are aware of the airspace, joining and circuit procedures which are non standard, the requirements for getting to altitude for noise abatement as they get lots of noise complaints. Whether the Heliport operating company had anymore specific reasons I don't know.
GS
Honest answer I don't know (see below) , but I've done several famil flights over the last few years and each one has required a tower visit, a briefing and on the last one two weeks ago the pilot concerned came out with a bit of paper with all the things they'd discussed on it (an aide memoir kind of thing for the ATC guys to make sure they've cover everything).
I've just called the tower there to ask why they insist on the tower visit and they say its what the heliport operator requires them (the atc contractor) to do. They want to make sure that pilots are aware of the airspace, joining and circuit procedures which are non standard, the requirements for getting to altitude for noise abatement as they get lots of noise complaints. Whether the Heliport operating company had anymore specific reasons I don't know.
GS
Last edited by VeeAny; 11th Oct 2009 at 10:34.
Avoid imitations
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Battersea is a private helipad so they can have any rules they like, just like you could if you were to allow helicopters to use your own property.
They can (and do) also close the heliport for weather reasons, btw.
They can (and do) also close the heliport for weather reasons, btw.
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Singe, I am really surprised at your modesty in post #20, where you state just how good you are. 150 hours in 10 years averages out at 1 hour and 15 minutes per month, hardly enough to remain current, let alone to remain on the cutting edge.
Heed the advice offerred on this forum.
Heed the advice offerred on this forum.
Red On, Green On
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What's the French for troll? Guys, you've been had. M Le Singe is sitting up in his internet tree making silly faces at you all..
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TLH (Battersea) now have a procedure in place to brief Pilot's in advance (depending on their experience) by phone and other means and complete the briefing after arrival - thus removing the need for a "famil" flight.
Barny
Barny
