R44 Rental - Las Vegas
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Thanks Birddog, that reminded me there is R44 rental, with instructor, at Area 51 for I believe $220/hr. Great deal and fantastic savings for "Airbourne". No need to call ahead or check websites, just show up at the gates and they’ll more than helpful.
airbourne - did you try Leading Edge Rotorcraft in Boulder City (post #3) for the Vegas trip?
I booked over the phone a week before, showed them my passport, log book and JAR licence when we turned up and within 30 minutes we were over the Hoover dam.
I booked over the phone a week before, showed them my passport, log book and JAR licence when we turned up and within 30 minutes we were over the Hoover dam.
They may no longer be trading - the owner, Benji Grammer, was sadly killed in a helo crash just before I flew there and I'm not sure what his partner did with the company after that.
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This is the information I got back from Monarch Sky in Las Vegas about duel flying for a couple of hours. Its not looking good to be honest.
By TSA regulations, we can not give training toward a US initial certificate, and Instrument, or a multi engine.
Since xxxxxxx does not have a US certificate, the training he receives could be considered training toward his initial US certificate.
The loop-hole of “discovery flights” is widely used to give training in these situations to non-pilots but a discovery flight is defined as a one time introduction to aviation for the purpose of promoting aviation. Certainly this would not apply to someone who is already a pilot.
I am aware that other schools may interpret these rules less conservatively but I have done a great deal of research with the TSA as well as AOPA to determine how safely to operate within the rules. I do not necessarily agree with the rules and apologize for their lack of common sense, but we are bound to them none the less.
The FAA Airman certification Branch can be reached at 405-954-3261, they will grant authorization for the Las Vegas FSDO to issue a US FAA certificate based on his foreign certificate. He must then call the Las Vegas FSDO to set up an appointment when he is in Las Vegas, 702-269-8013, the actual meeting takes less than 30 minutes and there is no charge/fee.
-------------------------------------
This is the information that I have been given. I am a jaa pilot, I do not wish to undergo FAA training rather just take a dual flight for 1-2 hours.
Am I correct in assuming that I still have to go and apply to the FAA for this permission.
Regards,
"If when you speak to operators... they mention TSA clearance you don't need TSA approval as you would be operating under the foreign license.
In the US, all "training" flights by aliens requires TSA approval, unless it is for a flight/training in the same category and class for which you already hold an ICAO license.
(In rotorcraft case, anything under 12,500lbs).
The above strictly refers to TSA requirements, not FAA."
---------------------------------------------
You are correct! You do have to apply for a US certificate.
Understand the following
er FAA rules, a foreign pilot may not fly a us certificated plane without a private pilot certificate issued on the basis of a foreign pilot license CFR §61.75 or a Special purpose pilot authorization CFR §61.77
I understand, respect and appreciate that you are fully qualified, BUT, you are not a US certificated pilot.
I understand that you do not require “training”, you are fully trained, none the less, there is no provision specifying the statement you’ve included in regard to ICAO.
In the US, all "training" flights by aliens requires TSA approval, unless it is for a flight/training in the same category and class for which you already hold an ICAO license.(In rotorcraft case, anything under 12,500lbs).
While you do not need training, any flight you conduct in the US with a US Certified Instructor is considered flight training.
CFR §1552.1 Scope and Definitions
CFR §1552.1 (c) Category 3
By TSA regulations, we can not give training toward a US initial certificate, and Instrument, or a multi engine.
Since xxxxxxx does not have a US certificate, the training he receives could be considered training toward his initial US certificate.
The loop-hole of “discovery flights” is widely used to give training in these situations to non-pilots but a discovery flight is defined as a one time introduction to aviation for the purpose of promoting aviation. Certainly this would not apply to someone who is already a pilot.
I am aware that other schools may interpret these rules less conservatively but I have done a great deal of research with the TSA as well as AOPA to determine how safely to operate within the rules. I do not necessarily agree with the rules and apologize for their lack of common sense, but we are bound to them none the less.
The FAA Airman certification Branch can be reached at 405-954-3261, they will grant authorization for the Las Vegas FSDO to issue a US FAA certificate based on his foreign certificate. He must then call the Las Vegas FSDO to set up an appointment when he is in Las Vegas, 702-269-8013, the actual meeting takes less than 30 minutes and there is no charge/fee.
-------------------------------------
This is the information that I have been given. I am a jaa pilot, I do not wish to undergo FAA training rather just take a dual flight for 1-2 hours.
Am I correct in assuming that I still have to go and apply to the FAA for this permission.
Regards,
"If when you speak to operators... they mention TSA clearance you don't need TSA approval as you would be operating under the foreign license.
In the US, all "training" flights by aliens requires TSA approval, unless it is for a flight/training in the same category and class for which you already hold an ICAO license.
(In rotorcraft case, anything under 12,500lbs).
The above strictly refers to TSA requirements, not FAA."
---------------------------------------------
You are correct! You do have to apply for a US certificate.
Understand the following
er FAA rules, a foreign pilot may not fly a us certificated plane without a private pilot certificate issued on the basis of a foreign pilot license CFR §61.75 or a Special purpose pilot authorization CFR §61.77I understand, respect and appreciate that you are fully qualified, BUT, you are not a US certificated pilot.
I understand that you do not require “training”, you are fully trained, none the less, there is no provision specifying the statement you’ve included in regard to ICAO.
In the US, all "training" flights by aliens requires TSA approval, unless it is for a flight/training in the same category and class for which you already hold an ICAO license.(In rotorcraft case, anything under 12,500lbs).
While you do not need training, any flight you conduct in the US with a US Certified Instructor is considered flight training.
CFR §1552.1 Scope and Definitions
CFR §1552.1 (c) Category 3
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As I stated, if you are getting training, and for now lets say you are training as that's what they told you this flight needs to be, for the same category and class that you already hold an icao license, you do not need TSA approval.
If you were say getting training in fixed wing and had a foreign rotor wing license, then you would need to register at flightschoolcandidate.gov.
If you were say getting training in fixed wing and had a foreign rotor wing license, then you would need to register at flightschoolcandidate.gov.
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I dont disagree with you birddog, I know you are right. But thats Monarch Sky, they are unwilling to let me fly with them either way unless I jump through all the TSA hoops!
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airbourne: Have a look at AOPA Online: AOPA's Guide to TSA's Alien Flight Training/Citizenship Validation Rule
If you can get the operator to accept the flight as a flight review - confirming your existing skills for aircraft check out (a check ride, if you will), as flight reviews are exempt.
I see the rules have recently changed, and Category 4 applications (getting a FAA license on the basis of a foreign license - not a validation, an actual license) now require online submission at flightschoolcandidates.gov for a Category 4 application, and you will need to upload copies of your passport, pilots license, etc. and pay a $70 fee.
The problem if you fly under the "training" rule and get a Category 4 approval (which can be done online) means that you would need to get a visa that allows flight training - doing training on a e.g. British Visa Waiver entry to the US would be in violation of the regs.
So, in short, if you can't get it qualified by the operator as a flight review, it is probably less hassle for you to get an FAA validation of your existing license which would remove the TSA requirements, as they are for training towards a license.
If you can get the operator to accept the flight as a flight review - confirming your existing skills for aircraft check out (a check ride, if you will), as flight reviews are exempt.
I see the rules have recently changed, and Category 4 applications (getting a FAA license on the basis of a foreign license - not a validation, an actual license) now require online submission at flightschoolcandidates.gov for a Category 4 application, and you will need to upload copies of your passport, pilots license, etc. and pay a $70 fee.
The problem if you fly under the "training" rule and get a Category 4 approval (which can be done online) means that you would need to get a visa that allows flight training - doing training on a e.g. British Visa Waiver entry to the US would be in violation of the regs.
So, in short, if you can't get it qualified by the operator as a flight review, it is probably less hassle for you to get an FAA validation of your existing license which would remove the TSA requirements, as they are for training towards a license.
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Airbourne,
I got your requirements first time ;-)
I trained at HAI, FL, along with a good friend who is based in Vegas, doing all his flying in the 44.
He's familiar with exactly what you want to do, is an instructor and is very well regarded, as well as a damn decent bloke.
PM me and I'll pass on his details. (We're both ex-UK, so can speak the lingo).
Blue.
I got your requirements first time ;-)
I trained at HAI, FL, along with a good friend who is based in Vegas, doing all his flying in the 44.
He's familiar with exactly what you want to do, is an instructor and is very well regarded, as well as a damn decent bloke.
PM me and I'll pass on his details. (We're both ex-UK, so can speak the lingo).
Blue.
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Well I am back from my trip to Vegas and San Francisco so I had to report back on everything that went on. Firstly thanks to bluestack for all his help in helping me make contact in Las Vegas.
Through Bluestacks help he put me in touch with a great guy based in Las Vegas, current on the R44, B206 and a couple of others. After touching base via a couple of emails to give him log book and medical details the trip was booked for Saturday 2nd Jan.
Myself and Mrs airbourne were picked up at out hotel at 9am, and driven the 30ish miles to Boulder City Airport, home to a few flying schools, GA, the tour companies and Las Vegas Helicopter Services
My instructor was great, not wanting to actually provide instruction (although I say you can never learn too much from someone that knows more that you) but still giving those handy hints that you always need to remember. A couple of differences for me were that it was a Raven 2, whereas I am used to an Astro, plus it was lifting from concrete. You know what I mean when you are used to lifting from grass.
Anyway, a PRISTINE R44 was rolled out from the hangar, all checks were done and the trip was planned. In fact, my guy suggested a much better route than I had planned. Again, another reason to have someone local on board that has the knowledge. Taking off from Boulder City, and flying below 3000ft toward the Strip. This was 9am on a Saturday morning, but skies were still busy with inbound commercial traffic and the tour flights. The tour guys operate slight higher than 3000ft so you have to watch out for them. Heading towards the city, overhead Fremont Street, and then up the strip, turning at New York, New York towards Hoover Dam (slightly left of the tour traffic). Again, I say this is where local knowledge is a major plus. I havnt done it before, so flying between the buildings is a bit nerve racking. Bear in mind I have about 60 hours, so everything is nerve racking!!!
So over to the Dam, a few 360's there and then onwards to an area right of the Grand Canyon. Obiviously avoiding the tour traffic. There is the option to land at (1G4) North Grand Canyon airstrip, but at $100 fee, its not worth it.
Did everything I wanted to do and see, and overall it was about 2.5 hours skids up to skids down. I will say again, although I had the relative knowledge, it was nice to be reminded of speeds, height and aircraft ops. It was more like a very fun lesson.
I was asked not to mention the instructor by name, but if anyone wants to contact the club, its Las Vegas Helicopter Services Bluestack also knows the person involved. He is easily identified by the sticker on the back of his car!
So if you are planning any holidays to Las Vegas and want some flying at reasonable prices, I suggest you contact these guys. I cannot recommend them high enough. I was very very happy with every aspect of the prep, flying, and everything. Have a look at the website or I would be happy to answer any questions anyone has either here or by PM.
Through Bluestacks help he put me in touch with a great guy based in Las Vegas, current on the R44, B206 and a couple of others. After touching base via a couple of emails to give him log book and medical details the trip was booked for Saturday 2nd Jan.
Myself and Mrs airbourne were picked up at out hotel at 9am, and driven the 30ish miles to Boulder City Airport, home to a few flying schools, GA, the tour companies and Las Vegas Helicopter Services
My instructor was great, not wanting to actually provide instruction (although I say you can never learn too much from someone that knows more that you) but still giving those handy hints that you always need to remember. A couple of differences for me were that it was a Raven 2, whereas I am used to an Astro, plus it was lifting from concrete. You know what I mean when you are used to lifting from grass.
Anyway, a PRISTINE R44 was rolled out from the hangar, all checks were done and the trip was planned. In fact, my guy suggested a much better route than I had planned. Again, another reason to have someone local on board that has the knowledge. Taking off from Boulder City, and flying below 3000ft toward the Strip. This was 9am on a Saturday morning, but skies were still busy with inbound commercial traffic and the tour flights. The tour guys operate slight higher than 3000ft so you have to watch out for them. Heading towards the city, overhead Fremont Street, and then up the strip, turning at New York, New York towards Hoover Dam (slightly left of the tour traffic). Again, I say this is where local knowledge is a major plus. I havnt done it before, so flying between the buildings is a bit nerve racking. Bear in mind I have about 60 hours, so everything is nerve racking!!!
So over to the Dam, a few 360's there and then onwards to an area right of the Grand Canyon. Obiviously avoiding the tour traffic. There is the option to land at (1G4) North Grand Canyon airstrip, but at $100 fee, its not worth it.
Did everything I wanted to do and see, and overall it was about 2.5 hours skids up to skids down. I will say again, although I had the relative knowledge, it was nice to be reminded of speeds, height and aircraft ops. It was more like a very fun lesson.
I was asked not to mention the instructor by name, but if anyone wants to contact the club, its Las Vegas Helicopter Services Bluestack also knows the person involved. He is easily identified by the sticker on the back of his car!
So if you are planning any holidays to Las Vegas and want some flying at reasonable prices, I suggest you contact these guys. I cannot recommend them high enough. I was very very happy with every aspect of the prep, flying, and everything. Have a look at the website or I would be happy to answer any questions anyone has either here or by PM.
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Fantastic experience is an underrated word! I do not know if they use the R22, but (a) there was one in the hangar and (b) my instructor is checked out on them. However, he told me he doesnt work on the 22 anymore. Lets just say weight is an issue! ha!
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Hey Airbourne,
Thanks for the info,
I know what you mean about the concrete,
Heading to Vegas in 2 weeks and looking to do something similar,
How much per hour should I expect to pay?
FreeFall
Thanks for the info,
I know what you mean about the concrete,
Heading to Vegas in 2 weeks and looking to do something similar,
How much per hour should I expect to pay?
FreeFall
