R44 trip to Brno Czech Republic
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R44 trip to Brno Czech Republic
I'm delivering a R44 to Brno in Czech Republic next week.
The plan is to leave the Midlands early Tues and make it all the way in one day. If not we'll take two days to reach Brno.
Then it's Ryanair back.
If anyone wants to log the time and fly with me, we are happy to share costs. I don't need the hours - it will be about 10 hours in total, subject to wind and weather.
Please PM me if you are interested
Big Ls
The plan is to leave the Midlands early Tues and make it all the way in one day. If not we'll take two days to reach Brno.
Then it's Ryanair back.
If anyone wants to log the time and fly with me, we are happy to share costs. I don't need the hours - it will be about 10 hours in total, subject to wind and weather.
Please PM me if you are interested
Big Ls
what exactly do you mean by "share costs " . Are you including fixed costs such as insurance or just fuel . This may be public transport . Please give me all details of money changing hands Nigelh CAA watchdog.
ps i,ll give you a tenner not to have to get into it
ps i,ll give you a tenner not to have to get into it
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cost sharing
NigelH
here's the relevant heading and paragraph from the CAA ANO:
SUMMARY OF THE MEANING OF PUBLIC TRANSPORT AND AERIAL WORK
1. The Overall Approach
Public transport and aerial work are defined at Article 157 of the Air Navigation Order 2005 using a number of terms which are defined in Article 155 (1) of the Order.
The general rules are defined at Article 157 (1)-(8).
Six exceptions to those general rules are then established in Articles 158 to 163. (See also table at pages 6 & 7 below).
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5.3 Exception No 3 - Cost sharing (Article 160)
5.3.1 A flight will be deemed to be a private flight for all purposes if the only payment is a contribution to the direct costs of the flight (not annual costs) otherwise payable by the pilot in command. This is provided that (a) no more than four persons (including the pilot) are carried, (b) the pilot pays at least his proportionate share (e.g. if four persons are carried the pilot must pay at least 25% of the direct costs) and (c) the flight has not been publicised in any way except within the premises of a flying club (in which case all the adult persons being carried in the aircraft must be members of that flying club).
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And yes, I will certainly be paying my share.
And yes, I'll have that tenner if/when we meet, please.
regards,
BigLs
here's the relevant heading and paragraph from the CAA ANO:
SUMMARY OF THE MEANING OF PUBLIC TRANSPORT AND AERIAL WORK
1. The Overall Approach
Public transport and aerial work are defined at Article 157 of the Air Navigation Order 2005 using a number of terms which are defined in Article 155 (1) of the Order.
The general rules are defined at Article 157 (1)-(8).
Six exceptions to those general rules are then established in Articles 158 to 163. (See also table at pages 6 & 7 below).
-------------
5.3 Exception No 3 - Cost sharing (Article 160)
5.3.1 A flight will be deemed to be a private flight for all purposes if the only payment is a contribution to the direct costs of the flight (not annual costs) otherwise payable by the pilot in command. This is provided that (a) no more than four persons (including the pilot) are carried, (b) the pilot pays at least his proportionate share (e.g. if four persons are carried the pilot must pay at least 25% of the direct costs) and (c) the flight has not been publicised in any way except within the premises of a flying club (in which case all the adult persons being carried in the aircraft must be members of that flying club).
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And yes, I will certainly be paying my share.
And yes, I'll have that tenner if/when we meet, please.
regards,
BigLs
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I note that:
"...and (c) the flight has not been publicised in any way except within the premises of a flying club"
may well make this offer to be in breach of the above regulation?
"...and (c) the flight has not been publicised in any way except within the premises of a flying club"
may well make this offer to be in breach of the above regulation?
The caa have employed me to work undercover to rid GA of all unwelcome and illegal practices ..like using the incorrect colour ink in your log book or accepting money for dodgy flights . Poacher turned gamekeeper you may say 
I will be keeping an eye on this flight and will be looking up the caa definition of "club ". you may well be in big trouble 
and as for flying a robbo ...well that is unforegiveable . Just checking ....have you done your "haszardous cargo over water in twin engine with co-pilot course plus dunker " otherwise the flight may be illegal
I will be keeping an eye on this flight and will be looking up the caa definition of "club ". you may well be in big trouble and as for flying a robbo ...well that is unforegiveable . Just checking ....have you done your "haszardous cargo over water in twin engine with co-pilot course plus dunker " otherwise the flight may be illegal
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hazardous cargo
Done the dunker (at Andark). Great fun.
The hazardous cargo will depend on the Indian takeaway the night before.
On a more serious point, it' s important to look at the spirit of the law as well as the letter of the law.
What is on offer here is the chance for a rated, current R44 pilot to fly an international mission for a fraction of the usual costs.
It could just as easily be Self-Fly Hire.
Anyone who is aspiring to becoming a CPL should welcome all the help - both financial and opportunities - that they can get. Logging 10 hours at the cost sharing rates may be just the kind of leg-up it takes for someone to get over the next hurdle and start their career.
Anyone who is a "mere" PPL (H) may be wanting to broaden their horizons and gain the experience and confidence to fly more often and more regularly.
This also will help the industry and keep more people flying. More work for the instructors, engineers, sales outfits.
Informing the Pprune community -- which is de facto a forum for "Rotorheads", and one that you have to positively opt-in -- is a far, far cry from putting an ad in The Sun avertising to the public that there are some cheap flights to anywhere in the back of your Twin Squirrel, Nigel.
Big Ls
The hazardous cargo will depend on the Indian takeaway the night before.
On a more serious point, it' s important to look at the spirit of the law as well as the letter of the law.
What is on offer here is the chance for a rated, current R44 pilot to fly an international mission for a fraction of the usual costs.
It could just as easily be Self-Fly Hire.
Anyone who is aspiring to becoming a CPL should welcome all the help - both financial and opportunities - that they can get. Logging 10 hours at the cost sharing rates may be just the kind of leg-up it takes for someone to get over the next hurdle and start their career.
Anyone who is a "mere" PPL (H) may be wanting to broaden their horizons and gain the experience and confidence to fly more often and more regularly.
This also will help the industry and keep more people flying. More work for the instructors, engineers, sales outfits.
Informing the Pprune community -- which is de facto a forum for "Rotorheads", and one that you have to positively opt-in -- is a far, far cry from putting an ad in The Sun avertising to the public that there are some cheap flights to anywhere in the back of your Twin Squirrel, Nigel.
Big Ls
So what you are really saying is that you are selflessly doing this for the future of aviation as we know it !!! You should get some kind of honour , not just mere cash !!
Some innaccuracies though.......WHEN have the caa EVER looked at the spirit of the law ????If they can nab you they will .....the only reason they dont very often is because they are naive and incompetent and can never get their story quite right ....so they fabricate it ( allegedly!!) and then get caught out and lose their case
wasting even more of our money trying to keep us all warm and safe ....
Also my flights are NEVER cheap They are lease agreements as agreed by the caa, therefore come complete with inflight service and refreshments.
Some innaccuracies though.......WHEN have the caa EVER looked at the spirit of the law ????If they can nab you they will .....the only reason they dont very often is because they are naive and incompetent and can never get their story quite right ....so they fabricate it ( allegedly!!) and then get caught out and lose their case
wasting even more of our money trying to keep us all warm and safe ....Also my flights are NEVER cheap
They are lease agreements as agreed by the caa, therefore come complete with inflight service and refreshments.
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biggles99, you say that you don't need the hours. At the same time, you say that you will pay out of your own pocket to deliver the helicopter in Brno.
Just out of curiosity, why would anyone that does not need the hours pay to deliver the helicopter? If you are to enjoy Brno, a return Ryanair flight is probably cheaper. Ok, perhaps you want to take the opportunity to fly just because you enjoy it. The problem is that you won't actually fly if someone accepts your "offer".
So you mean that the advertisment you made, on a forum publicly available without any need to register, is "within the premises of a flying club"?
I would have taken you more seriously if you would have said that because your cat has a grandmother from the USA and the cat will fly with you to compensate for a defect artificial horizon, American law is applicable and therefore FAA regs and therefore the flight is considered legal.
Sorry, I admit, I just got too much time on my hands! Have a nice flight though.
Just out of curiosity, why would anyone that does not need the hours pay to deliver the helicopter? If you are to enjoy Brno, a return Ryanair flight is probably cheaper. Ok, perhaps you want to take the opportunity to fly just because you enjoy it. The problem is that you won't actually fly if someone accepts your "offer".
is a far, far cry from putting an ad in The Sun avertising to the public
I would have taken you more seriously if you would have said that because your cat has a grandmother from the USA and the cat will fly with you to compensate for a defect artificial horizon, American law is applicable and therefore FAA regs and therefore the flight is considered legal.
Sorry, I admit, I just got too much time on my hands! Have a nice flight though.
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I would like to say to anyone who has the time to make this trip to go for it, I was very fortunate to have made some such trips not with bigles but to different parts of europe and eastern europe, it will be a thouroughly enjoyable trip with someone who has done it before, the whole experience of flying to a different part of europe viewing the scenery eperiencing their ATC, handling facilities, fuelling etc etc will broaden your knowledge greatly. After all I think their is an adventurer in every pilot somewere so let the adventurer out and enjoy the trip!!
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Sorry this is a little off topic but WHAT A CAT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
I couldn't stop laughing !!!!!!!!
But seriously this flight would be a great opportunity for a potential CPL
Chester
I couldn't stop laughing !!!!!!!!
But seriously this flight would be a great opportunity for a potential CPL
Chester
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I have no problem to understand why someone would benefit from flying this ferry flight with biggles99.
What I don't understand is what's in it for biggles99? Why would biggles99, that does not need the hours, PAY to supervise someone else at the controls of the helicopter? Normally, biggles99 probably should have been paid to do.
chester2005, I'm glad that you like the cat.
What I don't understand is what's in it for biggles99? Why would biggles99, that does not need the hours, PAY to supervise someone else at the controls of the helicopter? Normally, biggles99 probably should have been paid to do.
chester2005, I'm glad that you like the cat.
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I would LOVE to do this as I've already explained to me Biggles99, I just can't afford the hours right now.
And IF my little bit of research on Biggles99 is correct he is MORE than qualified to do this trip and I think any one hour building with a bit of cash ready for the hours couldnt get a better opportunity!! come on beats doing circuits or milling around your county!
What better for a new cpl(h) pilot or cpl(h) to be pilot to have than various european country stop offs in your log book and pehaps less than 200 hours??!!! Quite impressive if you ask me!
Like I said if I had the money I would be packing my overnight bag now and for any future trips!
An amazing chance here my fellow wanabee cpl's
And IF my little bit of research on Biggles99
is correct he is MORE than qualified to do this trip and I think any one hour building with a bit of cash ready for the hours couldnt get a better opportunity!! come on beats doing circuits or milling around your county!What better for a new cpl(h) pilot or cpl(h) to be pilot to have than various european country stop offs in your log book and pehaps less than 200 hours??!!! Quite impressive if you ask me!
Like I said if I had the money I would be packing my overnight bag now and for any future trips!
An amazing chance here my fellow wanabee cpl's
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Oh dear, you really are making heavy weather of this, aren't you?
Maybe you missed the key bit "I'm DELIVERING a R44..." in the opening few words of the original post?
I'm just implying that I think that biggles99 gets compensated one way or the other. I can't imagine that biggles99 would actually PAY to do this flight without having any other incentive. Ģf there's an economical incentive the pilot can't really claim "cost sharing".
A Swedish company selling beds had an offer "buy a bed and get a free helicopter ride". At the time they did not have an AOC. The CAA cracked down on it considering the flights to be commercial because you needed to buy a bed in order to get the flight. It's not like the flights are for everyone. The compensation is made through the money paid for the bed.
Anyhow, I should reiterate that I think that it really sounds as a great experience to fly with on the ferry flight. What I don't think is that it's true that biggles99 in the end needs to pay out of his own pocket to do this flight.