HEMS A109? No thanks!
Joined: Dec 2003
Posts: 549
Likes: 14
From: The South
Lt Fubar,
The stretcher you show in the picture of the EC135 is the Casevac fit found in most Police EC135s (in the UK) and not a dedicated HEMS fit. The stretcher in a dedicated HEMS EC135 and MD902 (in the UK) is elevated on a mount that can slide and swivel for ease of loading.
FNW
The stretcher you show in the picture of the EC135 is the Casevac fit found in most Police EC135s (in the UK) and not a dedicated HEMS fit. The stretcher in a dedicated HEMS EC135 and MD902 (in the UK) is elevated on a mount that can slide and swivel for ease of loading.
FNW
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 483
Likes: 0
From: Europe
Poland
Polish HEMS was (is) flying 109 (just one) since years, nevertheless
the recent tender for the whole fleet was won by Eurocopter.
Agusta protested in court, but failed.
Generally the main argument was the impossibility to do CPR in 109 in flight.
(as already mentioned above)
The speed advantage of 109 in the country the size of Poland
was irrelevant, on any usual mission you can win only 5 to 10 minutes against 135.
And don't forget, that the paramedics and docs were used to Mi-2, still the
main HEMS helicopter in Poland, cabin of which is huge compared
even to the 135, not speaking about 109.
the recent tender for the whole fleet was won by Eurocopter.
Agusta protested in court, but failed.
Generally the main argument was the impossibility to do CPR in 109 in flight.
(as already mentioned above)
The speed advantage of 109 in the country the size of Poland
was irrelevant, on any usual mission you can win only 5 to 10 minutes against 135.
And don't forget, that the paramedics and docs were used to Mi-2, still the
main HEMS helicopter in Poland, cabin of which is huge compared
even to the 135, not speaking about 109.
Last edited by Ptkay; 27th August 2008 at 09:09.
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 178
Likes: 0
From: Poland
Originally Posted by FloaterNorthWest
Lt Fubar,
The stretcher you show in the picture of the EC135 is the Casevac fit found in most Police EC135s (in the UK) and not a dedicated HEMS fit. The stretcher in a dedicated HEMS EC135 and MD902 (in the UK) is elevated on a mount that can slide and swivel for ease of loading.
FNW
The stretcher you show in the picture of the EC135 is the Casevac fit found in most Police EC135s (in the UK) and not a dedicated HEMS fit. The stretcher in a dedicated HEMS EC135 and MD902 (in the UK) is elevated on a mount that can slide and swivel for ease of loading.
FNW
Ptkay maybe you have the photos from press displays of CPR practice in EC135, just before winning the contest ?
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 293
Likes: 0
From: foot of a mountain
Correct me if I am wrong, but the Swiss use the 109 for rescue and confined areas and ALSO have a fleet of 145's for long interhospital/site transfers? Why the combination? With the Arriel 1 the 145 is limited on Cat A either high or hot. Stuck in Arriel 2's maybe the gearbox will suffer?
Joined: Jul 2001
Posts: 1,084
Likes: 1
From: the cockpit
Never thought I would...but I have to defend the 109 here!
CareFlight have been using a 109E in the HEMS role very successfully for three years. The aircraft is used for rapid response to trauma and was only rarely used in the air ambulance role of secondary retrieval. It is now exclusively primary response.
Ummm....rubbish!
Last night CareFlight lifted a paediatric female post immersion. The 15 minute flight involved continual CPR and bagging throughout the flight - with a stretcher kit fitted and three medical personnel in the back (Specialist Doctor, SCAT Paramedic, and a Registrar). Plus pilot and Crewman up front. And Category A!!!
One of many instances of successful CPR in flight in our 109.
Having said that, we conducted a detailed type analysis for our particular role and the 135 did come out ahead. Factors such as protected tail rotor, very high main rotor, digital autopilot, cockpit ergonomics and displays as well as noise signature bought the 135 to the fore, but the 109 still scored very well.
The 109E is not the perfect HEMS machine - but it does extremely well in our particular role. Is labelling the 109 a crap machine for HEMS because it does not suit a particular HEMS mission profile a tad narrow minded perhaps?
CareFlight have been using a 109E in the HEMS role very successfully for three years. The aircraft is used for rapid response to trauma and was only rarely used in the air ambulance role of secondary retrieval. It is now exclusively primary response.
Generally the main argument was the impossibility to do CPR in 109 in flight.
Last night CareFlight lifted a paediatric female post immersion. The 15 minute flight involved continual CPR and bagging throughout the flight - with a stretcher kit fitted and three medical personnel in the back (Specialist Doctor, SCAT Paramedic, and a Registrar). Plus pilot and Crewman up front. And Category A!!!
One of many instances of successful CPR in flight in our 109.
Having said that, we conducted a detailed type analysis for our particular role and the 135 did come out ahead. Factors such as protected tail rotor, very high main rotor, digital autopilot, cockpit ergonomics and displays as well as noise signature bought the 135 to the fore, but the 109 still scored very well.
The 109E is not the perfect HEMS machine - but it does extremely well in our particular role. Is labelling the 109 a crap machine for HEMS because it does not suit a particular HEMS mission profile a tad narrow minded perhaps?
