Helicopter Static Charge?
Yes, the kick is real. Doing flood relief, we winched the rescue crewy down to a rooftop, and he then had to load the stranded people onto the hoist each time we sent the horse collar down to him. In the drizzling rain, he got a huge kick every time the collar came down - he had to grab it in the gusty winds, no chance to let it earth itself.
He took it 6 times in that sortie, we recommended him for a bravery award at the end of the week and he was rewarded with a medal.
On the other question about a "tea-bag" when the engine fails:
The briefing was to let the tea-bag touch the ground, then use the cable cutter to let him go, so he won't get dragged away by the aircraft.
That's assuming the aircraft predicament allows enough time for the crewman to operate the cutter before other things overtake him.
He took it 6 times in that sortie, we recommended him for a bravery award at the end of the week and he was rewarded with a medal.
On the other question about a "tea-bag" when the engine fails:
The briefing was to let the tea-bag touch the ground, then use the cable cutter to let him go, so he won't get dragged away by the aircraft.
That's assuming the aircraft predicament allows enough time for the crewman to operate the cutter before other things overtake him.
Working on a Lama operation in Scotland I watched in horror as a new loader (Australian)
was catching the incomming ag buckets on a very wet day . His eyes were almost lighting up and his hair was standing on end.
I went to tell him to desist and allow the buckets to earth out before touching them.
I was stopped by the other loaders (New Zealanders) who apparently had told him that they all had to do it and were enjoying the show!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wet humid days are the worst and composite blades seem to generate a larger charge than metal.
The worst shock I saw was caused by a 365C which was enough to throw the loader several feet.
(Addition)
I spoke to the guy who got zapped above. It was actually an S58T that did the damage (shows how the memory plays tricks). He said that it felt like he had been hit by a pickaxe handle. Apparently the 58 would build up static so fast that just earthing it out momentarily would not work.
was catching the incomming ag buckets on a very wet day . His eyes were almost lighting up and his hair was standing on end.
I went to tell him to desist and allow the buckets to earth out before touching them.
I was stopped by the other loaders (New Zealanders) who apparently had told him that they all had to do it and were enjoying the show!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Wet humid days are the worst and composite blades seem to generate a larger charge than metal.
The worst shock I saw was caused by a 365C which was enough to throw the loader several feet.
(Addition)
I spoke to the guy who got zapped above. It was actually an S58T that did the damage (shows how the memory plays tricks). He said that it felt like he had been hit by a pickaxe handle. Apparently the 58 would build up static so fast that just earthing it out momentarily would not work.
Last edited by ericferret; 24th Jan 2008 at 12:57.
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When I was doing my training I volunteered to hook up a sling to a 206 on a very cold winter day. Even though I had gloves on I got a real jolt when the hook on the machine touched the ring on the line which I was holding.
No one ever heard of using a zapper snapper then? A simple piece of wire attatched to the winch hook that dangles below the winchman to dissipate the static before he does.
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The charge varies with helicopter size and ambient conditions. When there is lots of dust in the air, rain or high humidity the chances of being shocked are much higher due to the increased friction. But operating with a mid sized helicopter like a S76 the average shock rarely exceeds something you may get off a car door. Being paranoid about the shock off a wire is not smart if you are in the water awaiting rescue as you may only get one chance to grab the strop in bad weather, and waiting for it to be earthed nicely alongside you may take a while.
The technique of ‘stomping’ the hook into the ground with your foot will certainly remove a charge, but is not the best practice for a very thin piece of live saving wire that is about to haul you to safety.
Watching three crew members in a submarine conning tower back away from my out stretched hand one day would have been amusing had I not known how hard the boys were working to get me onboard in the reasonable swell and fading light. After about the fourth swing past and one smash into the side of the conning tower, I pulled a shot-bag from my leg pocket that was connected to 15’ of H.I. line. I hurled this at the occupants and when it bounced off one of their heads and into the tower I yelled, “its Fu@ki@g well earthed now!” The bloke we were going to get was then recovered with just a few more heartbeats depleted.
The technique of ‘stomping’ the hook into the ground with your foot will certainly remove a charge, but is not the best practice for a very thin piece of live saving wire that is about to haul you to safety.
Watching three crew members in a submarine conning tower back away from my out stretched hand one day would have been amusing had I not known how hard the boys were working to get me onboard in the reasonable swell and fading light. After about the fourth swing past and one smash into the side of the conning tower, I pulled a shot-bag from my leg pocket that was connected to 15’ of H.I. line. I hurled this at the occupants and when it bounced off one of their heads and into the tower I yelled, “its Fu@ki@g well earthed now!” The bloke we were going to get was then recovered with just a few more heartbeats depleted.
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Try using a section of broom handle,with 4-5 ft of thin chain attached.As the hook comes in,make sure the chain is touching the deck,with the pole making contact with your hook etc BEFORE grabbing it,or guess what.......you'll end up like the ready brek man!,especially in hail/damp conditions.
syh.
syh.
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Just reading the title of this thread cracked me up!! I spent 8 years logging/fighting fire underneath helicopters in BC Canada in everything from 206, A-Star, 500, K-Max,61, KA 32, 107's etc. Especially in the rain or with thunderheads nearby it got really bad. Sometimes under the bigger machines, a perfectly delivered hook would arc at you from 6 or more feet! would put you on your knees sometimes. Turned out in that kind of crazy work it was a right of passage...when the machine costs so much, you better hook up asap!
With experience you would find that sometimes the 5-6 foot chain dangling from the bottom of the hook would fall/rip off throught the timber...you would learn to set yourself up in or nearby a bush and let it hit that first and then quick as a bunny lunge toward the hook. Sadly not even that worked all the time. It got really funny with the rookies when they got their first arc...they would arc out and then pull back, only to let the hook charge up again and BAM. repeat as necessary LOL.
You knew it was really bad if you were in blowing snow and you could sometimes not see the helicopter 1/2 a klick away but you knew where he was cause of the blue arc nailing the guy on the ground!!! Show's up really well in the snow.
Last but not least try this...often when breaking in a new hooktender and finally letting him at the hook we would wait untill a good wet rainstorm. We would set him up high and in the open on a big stump with a handfull of steel chokers in his hand.
Being the keener he usually was (including yours truly) he would slam those chokers towards the hook only to get blown off his feet by the charge. It was funny back then. The saying always went "Real Men Take the Arc!" 
Those times have since past and I being a responsible pilot towards my customers, always remind them of the tricks I learned then cause boy o boy do they get pissed when they get a kick! I'll put it on the ground too sometimes, especially when it's really dry, or really snowy.
Customer relations and all that
BWB
With experience you would find that sometimes the 5-6 foot chain dangling from the bottom of the hook would fall/rip off throught the timber...you would learn to set yourself up in or nearby a bush and let it hit that first and then quick as a bunny lunge toward the hook. Sadly not even that worked all the time. It got really funny with the rookies when they got their first arc...they would arc out and then pull back, only to let the hook charge up again and BAM. repeat as necessary LOL.
You knew it was really bad if you were in blowing snow and you could sometimes not see the helicopter 1/2 a klick away but you knew where he was cause of the blue arc nailing the guy on the ground!!! Show's up really well in the snow.Last but not least try this...often when breaking in a new hooktender and finally letting him at the hook we would wait untill a good wet rainstorm. We would set him up high and in the open on a big stump with a handfull of steel chokers in his hand.
Being the keener he usually was (including yours truly) he would slam those chokers towards the hook only to get blown off his feet by the charge. It was funny back then. The saying always went "Real Men Take the Arc!" Those times have since past and I being a responsible pilot towards my customers, always remind them of the tricks I learned then cause boy o boy do they get pissed when they get a kick! I'll put it on the ground too sometimes, especially when it's really dry, or really snowy.
Customer relations and all thatBWB
I guess there is no Health and Safety Executive in Canada then
Crab old Man,
The Nanny State syndrome does not exist in all parts of the world....and as is proven by many posts here.....we continue to thrive and even enjoy a bit of a laugh while at our workaday employment.
The Nanny State syndrome does not exist in all parts of the world....and as is proven by many posts here.....we continue to thrive and even enjoy a bit of a laugh while at our workaday employment.
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If your the one being rescued, you wouldn't feel the zap unless the hook / basket hit you first. The zap is not that strong as to travel to body in the water.
If you are the rescuer on the hook going into the water and the conditions are right for increased static electricity, you will feel it. Some times you might even bite through your tongue as a result of the zap.
Beware!
A zapper snapper is a good idea when the conditions warrant it. (Have been using our three metre length of old hoist cable for years but never had a name for it until now - Thanks [email protected])
Regards
Breeze
If you are the rescuer on the hook going into the water and the conditions are right for increased static electricity, you will feel it. Some times you might even bite through your tongue as a result of the zap.
Beware!
A zapper snapper is a good idea when the conditions warrant it. (Have been using our three metre length of old hoist cable for years but never had a name for it until now - Thanks [email protected])
Regards
Breeze
A friend of mine in Norway who used to fly Lynx Mk. 86's once told me a story of a SAR Swimmer who was jumping out of the machine in a low hover to straighten the main wheels for taxiing.
He forgto to undo his helmet cord, and promptly started jumping up and down with a "AHHH!" every time he hit. And the helicopter was hovering in nice wet snow falling...
My friend was struggling to keep the helicopter in control as he watched the SAR swimmer keep up his show, until the F/E got the cord unhooked...
He did survive it tho.
As to Canada and Health and Safety in the workplace, it seems that "production" and "Speed" are more important than safety sometimes. Have on numerous occasions mentioned the "broomhandle with cable touching the hook and ground", but have been over-ruled as it seems this would take valuable seconds away from the work...
Cheers
W.
He forgto to undo his helmet cord, and promptly started jumping up and down with a "AHHH!" every time he hit. And the helicopter was hovering in nice wet snow falling...
My friend was struggling to keep the helicopter in control as he watched the SAR swimmer keep up his show, until the F/E got the cord unhooked...
He did survive it tho.
As to Canada and Health and Safety in the workplace, it seems that "production" and "Speed" are more important than safety sometimes. Have on numerous occasions mentioned the "broomhandle with cable touching the hook and ground", but have been over-ruled as it seems this would take valuable seconds away from the work...
Cheers
W.
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Easy there Winnie,
What I expressed were my experiences as a young lad doing a job which very few do or have done, nor do I recomend it in my later years (just a few more than you but not by much) We were by no means special forces but tough bastards all the same and earned our money the hard way. After 8 years I only know of one man that died doing it on the ground and it was NOT from the "arc". On the other hand I know a few pilots that have passed on doing anything but "production" work as most of us here do. To put it bluntly my experiences on the ground are by no means a reflection of the aviation (ie Pilots/Engineers) community in Canada and our commitment to safety. It was not my intent to give you all a false representation of a cowboy attitude. It's just that a few of us that have worked both sides have a different perspective as I bet your SAR Tech does now after his experience.
Fly Safe All
BWB
What I expressed were my experiences as a young lad doing a job which very few do or have done, nor do I recomend it in my later years (just a few more than you but not by much) We were by no means special forces but tough bastards all the same and earned our money the hard way. After 8 years I only know of one man that died doing it on the ground and it was NOT from the "arc". On the other hand I know a few pilots that have passed on doing anything but "production" work as most of us here do. To put it bluntly my experiences on the ground are by no means a reflection of the aviation (ie Pilots/Engineers) community in Canada and our commitment to safety. It was not my intent to give you all a false representation of a cowboy attitude. It's just that a few of us that have worked both sides have a different perspective as I bet your SAR Tech does now after his experience.
Fly Safe All
BWB
Apologies to you BWB, I did not put it clearly that those were my opinions, not reflections on you!
I meant as a sweeping generalization that things here (and in my country of origin too unfortunately) production, fast, quick are words that go before safety and comfort.
I know nobody has been killed because of static discharge, but it is DARN uncomfortable, and can be easily avoided. But that takes time.
Again, sorry, not directed at you.
Cheers
Winnie.
I meant as a sweeping generalization that things here (and in my country of origin too unfortunately) production, fast, quick are words that go before safety and comfort.
I know nobody has been killed because of static discharge, but it is DARN uncomfortable, and can be easily avoided. But that takes time.
Again, sorry, not directed at you.
Cheers
Winnie.
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We were lifting 40ft Containers in East Timor with the Mi26 and had a few Local guy's trained(As best we could) to do the hook up's. One of the boys forgot to ground the hook and it Blew him off the container and straightened his Curls...Very Funny!!!
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In the AAC we used a home made hook, cable and spike system where as the loader gets under the machine he simply whacks the spike into the ground under the machine and puts the hook over the back of the skid thereby grounding the aircraft prior to hooking up the load. If we didn't have one then you just hang onto the plastic sheathing on the stropp and touch it to the hook first before touching the machine. Once saw a RAF loady get zapped off the top of a truck by a Chinook - not funny!!!!
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In submarines we used to do helo transfers to the top of the fin (conning tower to non submariners). We had to have a man with an earthing pole grounded to the boat to remove the static charge from the winch cable before the person being winched touched the metal submarine. If we really didn't like the person on the winch strop all sorts of offers of money beer and rum would be made to the man with the earthing pole to touch the visitors leg, body or delicate areas with the pole, causing the charge to be earthed through the body part touched and thus extreme agony in the nether regions for the next week or so! 
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Helicopter Electro-Static Discharge
Anyone know of any good online articles explaining this phenomenon.
I am researching this as one of our aircraft suffered a big discharge the other day causing some damage.
I am researching this as one of our aircraft suffered a big discharge the other day causing some damage.
