What the hell do we have JAR-FCL for?
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What the hell do we have JAR-FCL for?
Good morning (well, for some of us),
I have run into several problems regarding JAR-FCL before in the past, but this does make it to the very top of bad conduct by the authorities quite easily:
Having done an (initial) instrument rating in one JAA member state you would assume that another JAA member state would put it on your license.
Everything was conducted according to JAR-FCL by a well respected English FTO licensed to do the training. So far so good. Now I took it all to my authorities and they have refused to put the IR on my license for weeks
.
First they claimed a lack of documentation. Fair enough, not really but one does things to please them from time to time anyway. It took me several days to collect what they wanted. Now the problem seems to have shifted somewhat and it is suddenly connected to the IR not having been conducted according to JAR-FCL 2 (national version). Can you believe it?
But the best is yet to come - last year they accepted a complete EC 135 type-rating from the very same FTO without any problems!
I have just started with a new company and part of the contract was of course an IR on my license. We are halfway through the type-rating and my time is running out
.
It all makes reading lasors sound like a farce. Facilitating the coordination of training within the JAA states and all that other
.
Yes, after years in this business I should know better but even now it still leaves me frustrated having to deal with this sort of.
I believe you can see where this is leading so I would be very much obliged if anyone could share some experience regarding the matter.
Rant over & thank you for bearing with me chaps
WSPS
I have run into several problems regarding JAR-FCL before in the past, but this does make it to the very top of bad conduct by the authorities quite easily:
Having done an (initial) instrument rating in one JAA member state you would assume that another JAA member state would put it on your license.
Everything was conducted according to JAR-FCL by a well respected English FTO licensed to do the training. So far so good. Now I took it all to my authorities and they have refused to put the IR on my license for weeks
.First they claimed a lack of documentation. Fair enough, not really but one does things to please them from time to time anyway. It took me several days to collect what they wanted. Now the problem seems to have shifted somewhat and it is suddenly connected to the IR not having been conducted according to JAR-FCL 2 (national version). Can you believe it?
But the best is yet to come - last year they accepted a complete EC 135 type-rating from the very same FTO without any problems!
I have just started with a new company and part of the contract was of course an IR on my license. We are halfway through the type-rating and my time is running out
.It all makes reading lasors sound like a farce. Facilitating the coordination of training within the JAA states and all that other
. Yes, after years in this business I should know better but even now it still leaves me frustrated having to deal with this sort of
. I believe you can see where this is leading so I would be very much obliged if anyone could share some experience regarding the matter.
Rant over & thank you for bearing with me chaps
WSPS
Solution:
Move to the country you got your IR from.
The country that is responsible for your tickets now will send everything over to the country you moved to.
That country will then be responsible for your license....and hopefully endorse your IR.
Move to the country you got your IR from.
The country that is responsible for your tickets now will send everything over to the country you moved to.
That country will then be responsible for your license....and hopefully endorse your IR.
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I did actually try to get a CAA license. But as you said, when not a UK resident...
I am an EU citizen though but I have less than a month to solve this now. My IR skill test was at the beginning of August. Nearly three months was plenty of time I thought and although I would love to be back in the UK I am running out of time.
Where are all the people who have done an IR abroad and faced the same problem that I have now. I thought there must be at least a few with experience on this.
Cheers
I am an EU citizen though but I have less than a month to solve this now. My IR skill test was at the beginning of August. Nearly three months was plenty of time I thought and although I would love to be back in the UK I am running out of time.
Where are all the people who have done an IR abroad and faced the same problem that I have now. I thought there must be at least a few with experience on this.
Cheers
JAA IRs
In theory, the answer is fairly simple. The agreement between JAA States stipulates that the IRT must be conducted by the National Authority to which the FTO conducting the training subscribes. The IR will then be issued by the candidate's licence issuing Authority.
In practice, its far from easy. For example, an IR course carried out by a UK FTO, in Germany, on German licenced pilots, using German registered aircraft, must be tested by the UK CAA. The German LBA will then issue the ratings. Trust me - I was that FTO!
In practice, its far from easy. For example, an IR course carried out by a UK FTO, in Germany, on German licenced pilots, using German registered aircraft, must be tested by the UK CAA. The German LBA will then issue the ratings. Trust me - I was that FTO!
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This JAR shnurfel
This must be a common problem. I did a factory type rating according to JAR FCL2 and the written exam and the checkride were not validated by the other very competent authority.
The term MAFIA comes to mind!!!
The term MAFIA comes to mind!!!
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VICTORY! 
Incredibly, at last they caved in this very afternoon.
Sorry to have made a fuss, but it really did not look like it was going to happen.
Maybe the possibility of legal proceedings helped the matter in the end.
If you have a similar problem, please post here, pm me or send an email. We simply cannot accept anything like that.
Thank you for your posts.
WSPS
Incredibly, at last they caved in this very afternoon.
Sorry to have made a fuss, but it really did not look like it was going to happen.
Maybe the possibility of legal proceedings helped the matter in the end
.If you have a similar problem, please post here, pm me or send an email. We simply cannot accept anything like that.
Thank you for your posts.
WSPS
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ncredibly, at last they caved in this very afternoon.
Sorry to have made a fuss, but it really did not look like it was going to happen.
Maybe the possibility of legal proceedings helped the matter in the end .
Sorry to have made a fuss, but it really did not look like it was going to happen.
Maybe the possibility of legal proceedings helped the matter in the end .
IR Victory
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Sie hat!
Now off to the North Sea at last!
@GoodGrief
Abbreviated course? ICAO? I am sure my course was conducted under JAR-FCL 2. If I would have had a CAA issued JAR license it would have gone on there straight away.
I am just concerned about what other people might experience. A good few of the pilots I know are at least thinking about getting an IR. If they want good value for their money presently they will have to go abroad.
So it appears that we have not quite arrived at the situation that was advertised then
.
I should have know all along of course. It was my own fault of falling for it. But I just could have done without the fight
.
Now off to the North Sea at last!
@GoodGrief
Abbreviated course? ICAO? I am sure my course was conducted under JAR-FCL 2. If I would have had a CAA issued JAR license it would have gone on there straight away.
I am just concerned about what other people might experience. A good few of the pilots I know are at least thinking about getting an IR. If they want good value for their money presently they will have to go abroad.
So it appears that we have not quite arrived at the situation that was advertised then
.I should have know all along of course. It was my own fault of falling for it. But I just could have done without the fight
.
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JAR FCL and National Differences
Ok so i appreciate that individual countries have (and maybe need) differences from JAR FCL 2 regs.
I am working in europe and am constantly being told that the national regs allow this or that, many of these differences are in direct contravention to JAR FCL 2 (not even got started on the JAR OPS side) is this right ??? (couple of examples. well expired licences being held as good for a theory pass, No Comms exam for ATPL)
Thoughts please gents (and ladies of course)
I am working in europe and am constantly being told that the national regs allow this or that, many of these differences are in direct contravention to JAR FCL 2 (not even got started on the JAR OPS side) is this right ??? (couple of examples. well expired licences being held as good for a theory pass, No Comms exam for ATPL)
Thoughts please gents (and ladies of course)
Each country can decide, which of the "joint" rules will also be valid in this specific country
This will all change with the EASA implementing rules for pilot licensing, which will, in 2012, become EU law and, as such, will override national law. After that, all EU member states will have to abide by the implementing rules irrespective of what their national law states (except, of course, for those states that habitually ignore any EU law that doesn't suit their national interest).
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IR or no IR das die Drawe nachgegeben hat ist DER Schlagzeile!
The LBA...the largest lit obstruction to aviation ( not marked on the map) in Germany, but we have the CAA
The LBA...the largest lit obstruction to aviation ( not marked on the map) in Germany, but we have the CAA
