UK 'private fuel tax' on AVTUR
Thread Starter
UK 'private fuel tax' on AVTUR
Came across this earlier today: if I read it right and you're flying a JetBanger 'for fun' (ie not for business, either commercial ops or for your own), your costs will go up by around £57/hour, courtesy of HMRC.
http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...E_PROD1_027787
I'm thinking of good arguments as to why this is stupid: the amount they'll gather in is bound to be exceeded by the bean counter costs, (this is the UK after all).
Jeesh, don't I pay enough tax to those grabbing sods already? And they never send me a thank you letter!
Reasoned arguments gainst need to be in by October 31st
http://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channelsP...E_PROD1_027787
I'm thinking of good arguments as to why this is stupid: the amount they'll gather in is bound to be exceeded by the bean counter costs, (this is the UK after all).
Jeesh, don't I pay enough tax to those grabbing sods already? And they never send me a thank you letter!
Reasoned arguments gainst need to be in by October 31st
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: S Yorks
Age: 51
Posts: 4
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Just an excuse to take more tax off us at a disproportionate rate.
They are hitting the marine industry too and increasing the tax on their fuel as well.
Are they going to do something useful with this money - no just give it to those who are too lazy to go and get a job.
They are hitting the marine industry too and increasing the tax on their fuel as well.
Are they going to do something useful with this money - no just give it to those who are too lazy to go and get a job.
Thread Starter
I know this place is mostly the preserve of 'professional pilots', but does no-one else see any threat in this? It had already made it to the depths of page 2
I'll bump it once, but if apathy continues to reign, so be it!
I'll bump it once, but if apathy continues to reign, so be it!
Thread Starter
So what do you make of this (section 2.15)?
"The preferred option is that the responsibility for paying the duty due would lie with the purchaser and/or the user of the fuel, who would be required to make a declaration and pay duty to HMRC if the fuel were used for private pleasure flying. Avtur used for private flying would be taxed at the same rate as kerosene: currently 54.68 ppl."
Not sure how you can interpret that as a problem for Avgas!!
"The preferred option is that the responsibility for paying the duty due would lie with the purchaser and/or the user of the fuel, who would be required to make a declaration and pay duty to HMRC if the fuel were used for private pleasure flying. Avtur used for private flying would be taxed at the same rate as kerosene: currently 54.68 ppl."
Not sure how you can interpret that as a problem for Avgas!!
Again the revenue are looking to find money to shore up a bankrupt exchequer, at the expense of another section of the community, the down side will be a contraction of private flying with a cost implication for sales and maintenance organisations with people being laid off as a result.
This is the UKs version of the USAs charging for flight information.
we need some money who is there we can attack without a concerted voice to fight back, ah yes private pilots not to organised, and the community at large sees them as rich 
.
This is the UKs version of the USAs charging for flight information.
we need some money who is there we can attack without a concerted voice to fight back, ah yes private pilots not to organised, and the community at large sees them as rich .
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: UK
Age: 60
Posts: 240
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The definitions of pleasure flying are not clear enough to identify whether they cover someone who owns an aircraft and flys it himself to business meetings which are not held at his normal place of work.
Some of my flying would be covered as pleasure, some would not. The fact that I could drive is irrelevant, I consider the above use to be a business expense.
Anyone see it differently?
BW
Some of my flying would be covered as pleasure, some would not. The fact that I could drive is irrelevant, I consider the above use to be a business expense.
Anyone see it differently?
BW
Thread Starter
Bladewashout
I beleive that you are correct. IF (and it's a big if) we regard this as a done deal, then there are two things we should fight for:
- why is Avgas being taxed at 28.84ppl, Avtur (for private use) at 54ppl? There should be one rate for aviation fuel!
- better definition on business use.
Still, if you think we feel bad, think yourself lucky you don't own a share in a Hunter or a Jet Provost..........800 lts/hour
I beleive that you are correct. IF (and it's a big if) we regard this as a done deal, then there are two things we should fight for:
- why is Avgas being taxed at 28.84ppl, Avtur (for private use) at 54ppl? There should be one rate for aviation fuel!
- better definition on business use.
Still, if you think we feel bad, think yourself lucky you don't own a share in a Hunter or a Jet Provost..........800 lts/hour
The revenue gripe about my helicopter use when I claim for work trips and say why cant you drive, cost of time does not seem to be taken into account,
others I have talked to say they claim with no problems, as a self employed person time is really important.
I can do a days work with the helio, that could take a week with a car.
others I have talked to say they claim with no problems, as a self employed person time is really important.
I can do a days work with the helio, that could take a week with a car.
Thread Starter
From the AOPA website (17/9/08):
"On avtur, duty will only apply to recreational/pleasure flights and the planned collection method is self declaration. Unfortunately the duty rate being proposed by HMRC is 50.35p per litre. All of this is subject to final confirmation from HMRC."
So....from November, my costs go up by just £56/hour when flying privately. Great! And...wait for it....the fun begins again when the APD hits us in November 2009! Current proposal is that even commercial use is subject to a c50ppl tax, thus demolishing the UK helicopter industry overnight.
Does anyone know a nice country to move to? I'm sick of this place.
On a lighter note, all private owners of turbine helicopters should be grateful to the HCGB. They are working behind the scenes to try and alleviate some of this nonsense.
"On avtur, duty will only apply to recreational/pleasure flights and the planned collection method is self declaration. Unfortunately the duty rate being proposed by HMRC is 50.35p per litre. All of this is subject to final confirmation from HMRC."
So....from November, my costs go up by just £56/hour when flying privately. Great! And...wait for it....the fun begins again when the APD hits us in November 2009! Current proposal is that even commercial use is subject to a c50ppl tax, thus demolishing the UK helicopter industry overnight.
Does anyone know a nice country to move to? I'm sick of this place.
On a lighter note, all private owners of turbine helicopters should be grateful to the HCGB. They are working behind the scenes to try and alleviate some of this nonsense.
Join Date: May 2001
Location: Escrick York england
Posts: 1,676
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
206 jock
Avtur used for private flying would be taxed at the same rate as kerosene: currently 54.68 ppl."
[/QUOTE]
i had a delivery of kerosene this morning for my boiler and grain dryer it was 49.89 ppl that included the kerosene and tax
steve
Avtur used for private flying would be taxed at the same rate as kerosene: currently 54.68 ppl."
[/QUOTE]
i had a delivery of kerosene this morning for my boiler and grain dryer it was 49.89 ppl that included the kerosene and tax
steve
Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: where I'm told
Posts: 38
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
The consultation paper, if adopted, could have some workable loopholes.
Convince your fuel supplier its all business related by at least,
A) Charging any passengers at a nominal fee
B) Carrying goods (eg briefcase or business papers) with you.
All suppliers of Avtur are Registered Dealers in Controlled Oils (RDCO). As such, they have a duty of care when selling or delivering Avtur to ensure that they only make supplies to customers who have a legitimate use for the oil. Under this proposal the RDCO’s general duty of care would be extended slightly so that if he thought that the fuel might be used for private pleasure flying, then under his general duty of care, he would draw attention to the purchaser of the obligation to contact HMRC and pay the duty due. The RDCO would note his records accordingly.
Commercial operation or use of aircraft by companies for the carriage of passenger or goods as an aid to the conduct of their business and the availability of the aircraft for whole aircraft charter, flown by a professional pilot(s) employed to fly the aircraft
B) Carrying goods (eg briefcase or business papers) with you.
rip off
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Goathland
Posts: 125
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Hi, Guys
A better way to get more income for the country would be to do away with all MP's expenses claims.... that would bring in more than taxing private flying fuel surely?
Kevin.
A better way to get more income for the country would be to do away with all MP's expenses claims.... that would bring in more than taxing private flying fuel surely?
Kevin.
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: UK
Posts: 321
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Quote:
Commercial operation or use of aircraft by companies for the carriage of passenger or goods as an aid to the conduct of their business and the availability of the aircraft for whole aircraft charter, flown by a professional pilot(s) employed to fly the aircraft
Commercial operation or use of aircraft by companies for the carriage of passenger or goods as an aid to the conduct of their business and the availability of the aircraft for whole aircraft charter, flown by a professional pilot(s) employed to fly the aircraft
RoterBoater that is the way I read it, lots of cheap machinery about soon but no one able to run it.
Another lot of people out of work, more land (airfields) for building, don't you wonder what they will think of next.
The bean counters screw the economy & then look to every one to bail them out!!!
Or am I just and old cynic? answers on a tenner please
PS
Kevin like your thinking
Another lot of people out of work, more land (airfields) for building, don't you wonder what they will think of next.
The bean counters screw the economy & then look to every one to bail them out!!!
Or am I just and old cynic? answers on a tenner please
PS
Kevin like your thinking
