easy question for you chopper guys

[Thridle Op Des]

Proper Comparisons

I think a little realignment need to be made here. It is not possible to compare a complete power failure manoeuvre in a helicopter with a single engine failure in a fixed-wing. The initial question is based on the more suvivable outcome of a complete motive power failure (irrespective of the number of engines you started with). My two major types are the Bell 212 and the Airbus 330. I know without any doubt what I would prefer to have that never-hopefully-in-my-lifetime experience. I might write the 212 off, the insurance company will pay for it, but I know that a stable auto in a 212 is about 30kts down and 70kts forward (minus the wind) as opposed to 170kts forward 60kts down in an Airbus 330. As an ex TRE on the 212, I have found that most pilots will do a survivable but not necessarily pretty auto if required. Most surfaces will take an autorotating helicopter fairly well, If both RR's quit in a 330 then sure I will probably be in a good position to get a relight - as long as I took the reasonable precaution of carrying enough fuel, however just taking the discussion to the limits, a 330 requires 2km of flat surface, preferrably something pretty hard and while it can be done - getting the energy management right to land a dead 330 onto the runway at Lajes from 120 miles out requires spectacular abilities, I know the guy in the rhs on that day - trust me!

Regards

TOD

[212man]

TOD, all that ME sun must be fuddling your memory: 70 kts in auto (for the 212)? I thought it was 60 kts (56 kts is Vy)

On the subject of the Transat glider (you mention), the most bizarre thing that sruck me from reading the report by the AIB was that the CVFDR was shed with the double gen failure (double engine failure)! If any scenario is going to lead to a need to study the CVFDR, surely it must be a double engine failure in a twin engined jet

[Thridle Op Des]

Hi 212, Ah ha, I was considering IMC autos to keep the equation the same since we never look out the windows in these high speed planks, I was just giving the 1/2 mvv a bit more margin - that,s my excuse and I'm sticking to it!

Its interesting what doesn't work then you are left on batteries only - Airbus has a lovely comment in FCOM 3 about battery only flight to the effect that it's not supposed to be done for a 'long time' since I guess it will never happen since the Emergency Generator will always be powered by the RAT.

What you doing up this time of night?

TOD

[212man]

In the US delivering our 3 S-92s to Bradley International to be loaded onto an AN-124. They Should arrive Thursday.